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2021 off-season discussion


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5 hours ago, BStanRamFan said:
16 hours ago, NYRamsFan88 said:

I used to like the trend, but I’d like someone who’d be willing to stick around for 2-3 years as opposed to renting a guy for one season. Someone with a little more talent and pass rush ability in case AD gets hurt again. When AD got hurt our pass rush was pitiful; we’ve got a bunch of guys who can play inside, but no one reliable to come off the edge. If we address this appropriately we’ll be much better off in the long run.

Yeah I don't think we have the ability to be giving out many 2-3 year deals and if we do, I highly doubt it would be enough for a semi-talented pass rusher.

We need to get one year wonders, improve their value, and continue to flip for compensatory picks while also drafting EDGE players to keep under contract for 4 years.

Pass-rushers that can actually hold their own and aren't dependent on the surrounding cast (and yes, I include Clowney in this because he's shown to be exactly that in the pro's; stellar run-stopper, but his pass-rush as a solo artist is lacking) don't often hit the market and when they do, they're not getting 2-3 year deals, they're getting 4-5 year deals.

More often than not, giving 4+ year deals to middling edge-rushers propped up by market scarcity (lack of options actually on the market) get teams into far more trouble than they're worth.  How are those Trey Flowers, Dante Fowler, and Robert Quinn signings working out for Detroit, Atlanta, and Chicago respectively?

We'd all like someone here for a long stretch that provided a consistent edge presence, but we are limited in the means we have to gain that.  And we don't have the benefit of pseudo-inflation of earnings by being in a state without a state income tax the way some teams do

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https://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2021/2/5/22269038/orlando-brown-jr-expected-to-be-traded-ravens-news-nfl-trade-rumors

This is interesting considering the Whitworth situation. Brown wants to play LT and is still on his rookie deal.

We seem to only trade our picks for positions of value (CB, EDGE, QB, WR) and I imagine LT would be on that list. What would it take to get Brown Jr? Perhaps Noteboom + pick, but I'm unsure what that pick would need to look like.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Aside from upcoming FA's, there will likely be alot of cap casualties to fit under that 180M mark. Jourdan Rodrique put together a list and I cherry picked one I think would be interesting for this team and possibly affordable. The allure of a team being fully committed to "win now" mode could be what sways a vet from taking another teams offer in a cap stricken year. I tried to pick Vets who have gotten a deal and are more likely ring chasing. If they sign a 1 year deal while the cap is so low, they can look to cash next season when it presumably returns. It's a riskier move for younger guys who have never gotten that big contract before, but for guys who have made their money and are looking for a Lombardi trophy to add to their resume, the Rams are the place to do it. If they have a big season, it could lead to one last pay day next year. 

Jon Bostic ILB Washington

Bernardrick McKinney ILB Houston

Kevin Zeitler RG NYG

Allen Bailey DL Atlanta

Malik Jackson DT Philly

Trai Turner RG LAC

Chandler Jones OLB Arizona

Von Miller OLB Denver

Geno Atkins DT Cincinnatii

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 We all knew Everett was gone, but this is interesting. I doubt we end up with Ertz, but to see them reach out about him gives us an idea where our focus is at. We also went for Eifert one offseason. Higbee and Ertz would have to be the best TE duo in the league and it shows where McVay/Snead's attention is this offseason (offense).

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2 hours ago, BStanRamFan said:

 

 We all knew Everett was gone, but this is interesting. I doubt we end up with Ertz, but to see them reach out about him gives us an idea where our focus is at. We also went for Eifert one offseason. Higbee and Ertz would have to be the best TE duo in the league and it shows where McVay/Snead's attention is this offseason (offense).

Ertz is only signed for 1 more year and the Eagles would be trying to create cap space so trading a player back wouldn't likely work unless it was a rookie contract so a draft pick would have to be sent to them. With only having 1 more year on his contract you'd have to assume he wants a big deal. He's very good but he's also usually a little dinged up every year so not sure what a contract for him would be like. Not sure how they'd proceed with this. 

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1 hour ago, Flounch said:

I don't really see the point to trade for Ertz knowing that they didn't use the TE last year. And also, we already draft Hopkins last year to replace Everett.

 

You have to realize that McVay when he was with Washington they he made Reed a huge part of the offense. Then you have to realize Stafford used Hockenson a lot. Everett won’t be back and plus Ertz is a top 3 TE in the NFL. The Eagles are a mess right now and they know they won’t be bringing back Ertz because they can’t afford both him and Goedert. I don’t blame the Rams for at least making a call. If they can get him for a good deal then it will be worth it. I’m always happy when going for talent especially when you have the offensive mind and the QB. 

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18 minutes ago, NVRamsFan said:

Ertz is only signed for 1 more year and the Eagles would be trying to create cap space so trading a player back wouldn't likely work unless it was a rookie contract so a draft pick would have to be sent to them. With only having 1 more year on his contract you'd have to assume he wants a big deal. He's very good but he's also usually a little dinged up every year so not sure what a contract for him would be like. Not sure how they'd proceed with this. 

Take on the last year of his deal, give up a conditional pick based on playing time since Philly seems to be in the rebuild mode. Let him walk the following season in FA and grab a 3rd round comp pick when he signs a big deal. 

Maybe a 4th this year and a 4th the following year that could turn into a 3rd if he plays 16 games. Then it would essentially be a 4th for Ertz and the 3rd's would cancel out from Comp Pick/Giving back to Philly in 2022. Just a thought. 

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26 minutes ago, BStanRamFan said:

Take on the last year of his deal, give up a conditional pick based on playing time since Philly seems to be in the rebuild mode. Let him walk the following season in FA and grab a 3rd round comp pick when he signs a big deal. 

Maybe a 4th this year and a 4th the following year that could turn into a 3rd if he plays 16 games. Then it would essentially be a 4th for Ertz and the 3rd's would cancel out from Comp Pick/Giving back to Philly in 2022. Just a thought. 

I get it, the estimate though for a guy like Henry's free agency is about $10 million a year which is less than Littleton which only got a 4th rounder. And that's a pretty good comp a bit better and healthier in Ertz but older so not sure he even gets $10 million (not getting into guessing games on next years cap going up). The question in your scenario is the 2021 draft pick better spent on a TE who doesn't play all year than on say a rookie Edge or WR? Both of those could play all year not to mention something on the OL that helps us with depth right away and potentially this coming year. 

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4 hours ago, BStanRamFan said:

Take on the last year of his deal, give up a conditional pick based on playing time since Philly seems to be in the rebuild mode. Let him walk the following season in FA and grab a 3rd round comp pick when he signs a big deal. 

Maybe a 4th this year and a 4th the following year that could turn into a 3rd if he plays 16 games. Then it would essentially be a 4th for Ertz and the 3rd's would cancel out from Comp Pick/Giving back to Philly in 2022. Just a thought. 

Why would we give that up for Zach Ertz? Look at his production in 2020. He didn't play well. Higbee had 8 more catches, nearly 200 more yards, and 4 more TDs on 12 less targets. 

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1 hour ago, jrry32 said:

Why would we give that up for Zach Ertz? Look at his production in 2020. He didn't play well. Higbee had 8 more catches, nearly 200 more yards, and 4 more TDs on 12 less targets. 

The entire Philadelphia offense was in shambles, riddled with injuries, and they just traded away Wentz. 2020 was an outlier for Ertz. From 2015-2019 he was a top 3 TE in the league. 

We trade a 2021 4th and a 2022 conditional 4th for Ertz. Can be improved to a 3rd if he plays X amount of games. Best case scenario, we give up one 4th and the 3rd's cancel out when he leaves in FA and we receive a 3rd round comp pick in return for one year of the best TE duo in the league.

Worst case scenario he gets injured again and we give up two 4th's and likely still get back a 4th when he leaves in FA on a lesser deal the following year. It's essentially one year of TE play for a net 4th round pick regardless of outcome. I can see why they are interested, but obviously not worth getting into a bidding war with LAC for.

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5 hours ago, NVRamsFan said:

I get it, the estimate though for a guy like Henry's free agency is about $10 million a year which is less than Littleton which only got a 4th rounder. And that's a pretty good comp a bit better and healthier in Ertz but older so not sure he even gets $10 million (not getting into guessing games on next years cap going up). The question in your scenario is the 2021 draft pick better spent on a TE who doesn't play all year than on say a rookie Edge or WR? Both of those could play all year not to mention something on the OL that helps us with depth right away and potentially this coming year. 

That's def the question. We know we've pushed our chips in the middle so this is just continuing to double down on that premise. I'm not saying we should go for Ertz or we're even likely to get him, but I can see the line of thinking that gets us in the discussion. I would personally keep the 2021 pick given our success rate on 3-6th round picks under Snead/McVay, but it's exciting to think of one year of Woods/Kupp/Jefferson/Akers/Higbee/Ertz and potentially a burner as the 4th WR (Desean Jackson?) 

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16 hours ago, BStanRamFan said:

The entire Philadelphia offense was in shambles, riddled with injuries, and they just traded away Wentz. 2020 was an outlier for Ertz. From 2015-2019 he was a top 3 TE in the league. 

Or it wasn't. He turned 30 years old. He might simply be declining. Either ways, considering his contract, I have no interest in taking that risk.

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We trade a 2021 4th and a 2022 conditional 4th for Ertz. Can be improved to a 3rd if he plays X amount of games. Best case scenario, we give up one 4th and the 3rd's cancel out when he leaves in FA and we receive a 3rd round comp pick in return for one year of the best TE duo in the league.

We're not going to get a third round comp pick if Ertz leaves, even if he bounces back. TEs don't get paid enough.

Quote

Worst case scenario he gets injured again and we give up two 4th's and likely still get back a 4th when he leaves in FA on a lesser deal the following year. It's essentially one year of TE play for a net 4th round pick regardless of outcome. I can see why they are interested, but obviously not worth getting into a bidding war with LAC for.

That's not remotely the worst case scenario. The worst case scenario is that he is declining, he sucks again in 2021, and we've lost two fourths for a guy who doesn't help our team. It's an unnecessary risk. 

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15 hours ago, jrry32 said:

Or it wasn't. He turned 30 years old. He might simply be declining. Either ways, considering his contract, I have no interest in taking that risk.

5 good seasons, 3x Pro Bowl, 1x First Team All Pro and Most receptions ever by a TE in a season.  His down year is the same year the franchise decided to clean house on their HC and QB. Yes, it's an outlier. He could be declining at 30, but then I look at what Travis Kelce is doing at 32 and say...let's see what next season brings before we pass judgement.

15 hours ago, jrry32 said:

We're not going to get a third round comp pick if Ertz leaves, even if he bounces back. TEs don't get paid enough.

Kelce and Kittle pushed the market to 14-15M per. Hunter Henry's deal this year will be very telling, but you're right, it could not be enough to warrant a 3rd.

 

15 hours ago, jrry32 said:

That's not remotely the worst case scenario. The worst case scenario is that he is declining, he sucks again in 2021, and we've lost two fourths for a guy who doesn't help our team. It's an unnecessary risk. 

If it's his injuries causing him to decline a physical would tell us alot about the state of his body. That would happen with any FA signing. If it was him being surrounded by a team completely depleted by injuries and in an outlier year, then I can't see him sucking again given the status of our offense.

He would certainly be a luxury though, not a necessity. But in the words of Lester Phineus Snead, "F&ck them picks". 

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