2021 Sign, Draft or Promote - Starting Safety

[Kparty15]

On 2/23/2021 at 7:53 PM, Ozzy said:

I agree Hamsah is not a safety at all in the NFL and will most likely move to linebacker, he does not have the coverage skills no way.  And the Vikings want Harrison Smith around the line of scrimmage and able to move around, so they need a safety that can play back deep in coverage and Hamsah is not that guy unless they are switching how they play defense and play 5 DBs and he would be the 3rd safety and or OLB type.  Richie Grant would be ideal but doubt he is there in the 3rd for the Vikings.

 

 

Yeah in my more up to date version I have the Vikings taking him 3rd round.  They would have to and all honestly outside of that 1st pick the next selection should be safety.  They would be in deep crap if they do not get a star safety in this draft because Metellus is not the answer and that is it for guys even on the roster.  Maybe Dorn could do it but never seen him play in a real game yet obviously.  

Harris is as good as gone I feel at that high price point, and really did not play all that great last year anyway compared to the year before because he could not be as aggressive with the young corners.

CB though they got youth and depth with Gladney, Dantzler, Hand and Boyd along with Hughes for another year and maybe Jones or Fields.  Safety is just Harrison and that is it so they have to get someone, Ford could be a great pick, or Jamar Johnson 3rd round.  Sherwood also but he is more a SS and they need a coverage safety, not really Ford but could be the best there in the 3rd.  

 

JR Pace could be another decent later round safety, same with Kary Vincent Jr.  Ar'Darius Washington I would not mind later in the draft.  And UDFA safeties could be Brad Stewart, Shaun Crawford, Lamont Wade or Shawn Davis.  Would not mind Brandon Drayton either he is a hit man.  

 

Could argue safety might be the #1 need on the team if Harris walks.  Because I have more faith in Samia, Udoh, Hinton or Bailey starting for the Vikings than I do Metellus starting or Dorn.  That is sad but even Samia who played poorly has shown more ability than Metellus who barely ever played and Dorn who has never played in a NFL game yet.  Both in college were good but nothing great at safety and until they can show they can play the position at this level that is a massive question mark for the team.  

 

 

Jevon Holland is probably the only safety I would even consider at 14, especially if he times out well because his 2019 tape is pretty impressive.  Is he better than the available OL or DL at that spot, hard to say.  Moehrig is getting hype for the 1st round but Holland if he played in 2020 would be the best prospect I feel, again if he times out well could make it a lot safety bet, especially if he shows 4.4 speed range.  

 

Safety is not a high draft need.  It’s honestly one of the less valuable positions on the defense.  Our coaching staff is very good at developing late round safeties.  If a top talent falls to us living then we can take one, but otherwise it makes more sense to wait until day 3.

[swede700]

2 hours ago, Kparty15 said:

Safety is not a high draft need.  It’s honestly one of the less valuable positions on the defense.  Our coaching staff is very good at developing late round safeties.  If a top talent falls to us living then we can take one, but otherwise it makes more sense to wait until day 3.

Harris is truly the only late round safety that this staff has developed.  Andrew Sendejo was already a primary backup when Zimmer took over...and no one else has ever been developed into anything more than a backup at best.  I personally think it's a pretty high need, because Harrison is going to be starting the backside of his career, we don't know how quickly he's going to drop off and there is absolutely no one else that we can count on.   For me, I'm definitely taking one on day 2.

Edited March 5, 2021 by swede700

[Kparty15]

2 hours ago, swede700 said:

Harris is truly the only late round safety that this staff has developed.  Andrew Sendejo was already a primary backup when Zimmer took over...and no one else has ever been developed into anything more than a backup at best.  I personally think it's a pretty high need, because Harrison is going to be starting the backside of his career, we don't know how quickly he's going to drop off and there is absolutely no one else that we can count on.   For me, I'm definitely taking one on day 2.

Jayron Kearse turned out to be pretty good and Mike Zimmer was able to develop George Illoka...

[Ozzy]

2 hours ago, Kparty15 said:

Jayron Kearse turned out to be pretty good and Mike Zimmer was able to develop George Illoka...

True but then they let Kearse go for what $2 mil or something when he could have been pretty useful last season.  I agree waiting for a safety is probably how they go about it but a ton of very good ones could be gone before the 3rd round.  Sure Grant could fall to them, then again he might not fall to them and they are left with a second tear guy.

Either way they have to address it because Metellus is not the answer at the position and I doubt Dorn is either.  Especially if they want Harrison to play around the line of scrimmage and move around, they need a safety that really knows what they are doing and even if they get a great rookie, they will have to start basically right away.  Always thought it would have been great to have got Winfield Jr and based on how awesome he was as a rookie, they probably should have let go of Anthony Harris last year, got Winfield and they would be in a lot better position at safety and would have saved all that money not paying Harris.  Could have easily got Winfield Jr instead of Gladney, who I like but Winfield was amazing.  I guess injury history maybe scared some teams off.

[swede700]

On 3/5/2021 at 5:27 PM, Kparty15 said:

Jayron Kearse turned out to be pretty good and Mike Zimmer was able to develop George Illoka...

It's arguable that Kearse turned out to be "pretty good."  If by "pretty good", you mean a pretty good special teamer, because that's pretty much what he was...other than that, he was a career backup who clearly couldn't be trusted to play any significant amount of time in the defensive backfield.  And Iloka was developed in Cincinnati, not here.  He was a non-factor here.  

[swede700]

SAFETY: A

Safety is without doubt the best position of the free-agent class this year, to the point that it may suppress the market for all of them, at least in terms of how much money they can bank.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-grading-the-2021-nfl-free-agency-class-by-position

[CriminalMind]

I'm not hoping for a safety not drafted in round 1-3 by Vikings (assuming 2 players).  We have more pressing needs

Edited March 10, 2021 by CriminalMind

[swede700]

2 hours ago, CriminalMind said:

I'm not hoping for a safety not drafted in round 1-3 by Vikings (assuming 2 players).  We have more pressing needs

While not the most pressing need, I'd probably put the need right behind DT and OG.  I'm definitely looking at taking one in the first 3 rounds.  They have absolutely no one outside of Harrison Smith.

[RpMc]

Safety is definitely need number 3 on my mind behind G/3T which are tied for number 1 priority. 

[vikingsrule]

17 minutes ago, RpMc said:

Safety is definitely need number 3 on my mind behind G/3T which are tied for number 1 priority. 

I think you’ve got to throw DE in that group too, but otherwise I agree. I just wouldn’t prioritize safety as an early round need. I’m thinking round 4 or later, or a cheap FA option. Seems there should be a solid FA safety class, maybe they can get a decent enough starter.

Even if they get a player at Harris’s 2020 level, that’s probably good enough. I never saw Harris as a major liability out there, his performance didn’t come close to matching the contract though. 

[RpMc]

With Hunter presumably coming back, and two at least replacement level players in Odenigbo (presumably), Weatherly, and a second year rookie in Wonnum, I'd put end behind safety in my pecking order.  Particularly the way that Zimmer likes to use them to disguise coverage.  There's no one else on the roster other than Smith, and starting caliber safety talent falls off the table after the third round, IMO.

[CriminalMind]

5 hours ago, swede700 said:

While not the most pressing need, I'd probably put the need right behind DT and OG.  I'm definitely looking at taking one in the first 3 rounds.  They have absolutely no one outside of Harrison Smith.

I would have DE above Safety, and until clarity is known about RR, a LT could still be an option above safety.

From a depth chart POV, it looks like we are deficient at Safety, but when I factor in "positional importance" it pushes it down for me a bit.

[swede700]

5 minutes ago, CriminalMind said:

I would have DE above Safety, and until clarity is known about RR, a LT could still be an option above safety.

From a depth chart POV, it looks like we are deficient at Safety, but when I factor in "positional importance" it pushes it down for me a bit.

I'm with @RpMc on this one.  DE is lesser on my list than safety. With a healthy Hunter, I think they could go into the regular season with what they have now at DE.  You can't say that about safety.  

[Vikes22]

4 hours ago, vikingsrule said:

I think you’ve got to throw DE in that group too, but otherwise I agree. I just wouldn’t prioritize safety as an early round need. I’m thinking round 4 or later, or a cheap FA option. Seems there should be a solid FA safety class, maybe they can get a decent enough starter.

Even if they get a player at Harris’s 2020 level, that’s probably good enough. I never saw Harris as a major liability out there, his performance didn’t come close to matching the contract though. 

I agree 100% vikingsrule. With 4 4th round picks, I would take a safety in round 4 ( maybe even 2 ).

if we get another really good DE, that would make our whole secondary better. 

[RpMc]

Meat of this safety class is in the second or third round if you want/need someone who can start right away. Edge class has depth that is likely to last into the 4th, maybe 5th depending on what you’re looking for, and if we aren’t selecting an edge player in the first round, they are unlikely to be an early starter anyway.  We’ve done well in the 4th round and later with edge players. 

Based on need, history at the position, and the way the draft looks like it’s going to shake out, safety makes more sense than DE unless they go DE in round 1.