LinebackerGod Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 2 hours ago, TENINCH said: He's top 10. I'd take him over Mayfield, Tannehill, Ryan, Tannehill, and Stafford. That’s a mistake. Cousins isn’t some horrid player, but every one of the guys you mentioned would be upgrades. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClutchDJ Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 11 minutes ago, LinebackerGod said: That’s a mistake. Cousins isn’t some horrid player, but every one of the guys you mentioned would be upgrades. Stafford would be an upgrade over Cousins based on what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinebackerGod Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 Just now, ClutchDJ said: Stafford would be an upgrade over Cousins based on what? Eyeballs. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClutchDJ Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 2 minutes ago, LinebackerGod said: Eyeballs. Must be a bad set. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearerofnews Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 (edited) How is anyone not sold on Herbert. 1 year or not. Where is the weakness? Size, arm talent, arm strength, accuracy, athleticism, mobility, agility, strength-power, vision, intelligence. Does the hard things great (3rd downs, vs pressure, vertical passing) I don't wanna pull a Vans. But how isnt Herbert already considered elite? What more do you need to see? Big game performance, consistency? Ok i can get. But the talent.. doesn't get any better. Edited March 7, 2021 by Bearerofnews Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerbyRam Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 I need to see more with Russell Wilson before I call him elite. I think he's great, but I need to see more for him to get to that level. I did some digging through the numbers on Goff, in comparison since 2017: Goff has been on the offense that has scored 100+ more points, had more wins and had 1300+ more passing yards. Wilson has been more accurate by roughly 1% (65.4 to 64.2). Wilson has had pro-bowl (and even all-pro) receivers to throw too in that time too. Goff wasn't afforded that luxury. Goff has also been significantly more accurate in the redzone (60.82% on 291 attempts to 56.15% on 301 attempts) but has 20 fewer touchdowns (99 to 79) on as McVay will get Goff to get it within the 10 and run it in from there, which has proven to bear fruit. I'm not saying Goff is better, because an eye test will tell you Wilson is ahead but I don't see Wilson as elite. I don't see what he's done in recent memory to even suggest that he is. If he was then he would be outperforming someone like Goff on all of the above, who has work to do to stay in the league. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBLIII Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 (edited) On 3/6/2021 at 12:47 PM, Kmart128 said: I disagree... his last season with Pats you could see he fell off from elite. He was borderline top 10. Defense carried that team. And this year he looked about the same... only difference is he was surrounded by a ton of great player. Evans, Godwin, Gronk, Brate, Fournette, Brown, Jones... Brady honestly should have played better with all those pieces around him. And then the defense caught fire at the end of the year and led them to a superbowl. While Brady is still playing at an extremely high level he is not elite currently and needs the pieces around him and a great defense. Still id put him in level just below. He never fell off. He is just as good as 2007. Only reason people doubt it is the age number. To me it's absolutely crazy to suggest a QB should have done better than than 50/15 in 20 games with no offseason in a new offense. Edited March 8, 2021 by SBLIII Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raffy15 Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 On 3/6/2021 at 9:19 PM, Bearerofnews said: How is anyone not sold on Herbert. 1 year or not. Where is the weakness? Size, arm talent, arm strength, accuracy, athleticism, mobility, agility, strength-power, vision, intelligence. Does the hard things great (3rd downs, vs pressure, vertical passing) I don't wanna pull a Vans. But how isnt Herbert already considered elite? What more do you need to see? Big game performance, consistency? Ok i can get. But the talent.. doesn't get any better. From a clean pocket he was only good, not great. He was outstanding at making great throws from a muddy pocket but is this sustainable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearerofnews Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 54 minutes ago, raffy15 said: From a clean pocket he was only good, not great. He was outstanding at making great throws from a muddy pocket but is this sustainable? Yeah but i don't think that's a skill set. It's a situational performance data point. Clean pocket data was passes Herbert made quickly, due to having the worst oline in the league. So when he had a clean pocket and executed an attempt, alot of those were to rbs or screens. Quick passes that didn't net alot of yds or tds. Chargers threw to rbs alot to make up for a bottom 3 run game in terms of YPC. Short passing game was an extension of the run game. It's why Herbert who went deep at a high count, but still had a lower ypa, ay/a, ny/a, any/a. Chargers are bad at screens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicMT Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 On 3/8/2021 at 3:50 AM, DerbyRam said: I need to see more with Russell Wilson before I call him elite. I think he's great, but I need to see more for him to get to that level. I did some digging through the numbers on Goff, in comparison since 2017: Goff has been on the offense that has scored 100+ more points, had more wins and had 1300+ more passing yards. Wilson has been more accurate by roughly 1% (65.4 to 64.2). Wilson has had pro-bowl (and even all-pro) receivers to throw too in that time too. Goff wasn't afforded that luxury. Goff has also been significantly more accurate in the redzone (60.82% on 291 attempts to 56.15% on 301 attempts) but has 20 fewer touchdowns (99 to 79) on as McVay will get Goff to get it within the 10 and run it in from there, which has proven to bear fruit. I'm not saying Goff is better, because an eye test will tell you Wilson is ahead but I don't see Wilson as elite. I don't see what he's done in recent memory to even suggest that he is. If he was then he would be outperforming someone like Goff on all of the above, who has work to do to stay in the league. That's a laughable bad take. Not even sure Wilson is an elite QB (although he's really close to the top 5 if not in it) but he's soooo much better than Goff that it seems to me like you're trolling. Just for fun : (all stats are from 2017) TDS (both rushing and passing) = Wilson 148 Goff 111 (that's a good 37 TDs more, which is more than Goff had in any season in his career) INTs = Wilson 34 Goff 48 (14 picks difference that's a really bad season worth of INTs) Fumbles = Wilson 39 Goff 37 (slight advantage Goff) Td% = 6.1% / 8.2%/ 6.0% / 7.2 % (Wilson) vs 5.9% / 5.7% / 3.5% / 3.6% (Goff) Int% = 2.0%/1.6%/1.0%/2.3% (Wilson) vs 1.5% /2.1%/2.6%/2.4% (Goff) Also I'd like to point out that wins are a team stat and that yes, Wilson is absolutely outperforming Goff on any important metric that matters. To also act like Goff hasn't had a good supporting cast (T. Gurley? Kupp and Woods and Cooks at some point isn't a bad WR corp by any mean). You also left out the fact that McVay is a waaaaay better OC/coach than any OCs Wilson ever had. Oh, also Goff really had a better O-line through his career. You could make an argument that Wilson isn't elite tier, but not by comparing him to Goff sorry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggie. Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 On 3/6/2021 at 5:47 AM, Kmart128 said: I disagree... his last season with Pats you could see he fell off from elite. He was borderline top 10. Defense carried that team. And this year he looked about the same... only difference is he was surrounded by a ton of great player. Evans, Godwin, Gronk, Brate, Fournette, Brown, Jones... Brady honestly should have played better with all those pieces around him. And then the defense caught fire at the end of the year and led them to a superbowl. While Brady is still playing at an extremely high level he is not elite currently and needs the pieces around him and a great defense. Still id put him in level just below. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeezla Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 I hope Burrow looks stronger/faster than ever when he comes back. A reverse-Wentz if you will. I really want to see what he can do with some protection, and I'm not just saying that because I want Sewell to go to Cinci so Chase/Pitts slide to the Eagles. If I'm the Bengals, I take Sewell in the 1st (assuming he's there), Creed Humphrey in the 2nd, and hope for Tylan Wallace in the 3rd. Maybe sign Curtis Samuel in FA and definitely go hard after Hunter Henry or Jonnu Smith. Defense can wait a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJaxxenGuy Posted March 11, 2021 Share Posted March 11, 2021 14 hours ago, Jeezla said: I hope Burrow looks stronger/faster than ever when he comes back. A reverse-Wentz if you will. I really want to see what he can do with some protection, and I'm not just saying that because I want Sewell to go to Cinci so Chase/Pitts slide to the Eagles. If I'm the Bengals, I take Sewell in the 1st (assuming he's there), Creed Humphrey in the 2nd, and hope for Tylan Wallace in the 3rd. Maybe sign Curtis Samuel in FA and definitely go hard after Hunter Henry or Jonnu Smith. Defense can wait a year. He’s more likely to come back like Sam Bradford than a reverse Wentz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawgX Posted March 11, 2021 Share Posted March 11, 2021 On 3/6/2021 at 5:06 PM, TENINCH said: He's top 10. I'd take him over Mayfield, Tannehill, Ryan, Tannehill, and Stafford. I actually like Cousins but I'd take all of those guys over Cousins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheesehead430 Posted March 11, 2021 Share Posted March 11, 2021 Tier 1 Aaron Rodgers Pat Mahomes Tier 2 Russell Wilson Deshaun Watson Josh Allen Lamar Jackson Ryan Tannehill Tom Brady Tier 3 Kyler Murray Matthew Stafford Matt Ryan Dak Prescott Drew Brees* Tier 4 Baker Mayfield Derek Carr Justin Herbert Ben Roethlisberger Jared Goff Kirk Cousins Carson Wentz Tier 5 Ryan Fitzpatrick Joe Burrow Tua Tagoviola Daniel Jones Jalen Hurts Teddy Bridgewater Teddy Garropollo Cam Newton Mitch Trubisky Cam Newton Drew Lock Sam Darnold Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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