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3 minutes ago, LinebackerGod said:

I’m willing to concede that it might be more scheme-based. I want to see Jackson operate in a traditional offense. I have a feeling it’d be a disaster, but I’m curious to see if it would help or hinder him as a passer.

There's really no way to know. In the mean time, the smart thing to do for a Baltimore Ravens team trying to improve is cut losses and move on from both Roman and Lamar.

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1 minute ago, Yin-Yang said:

I mean, we’ve seen a lot more passing ability out of Lamar than we have coaching ability from Roman...

Warner, Baldinger, Smitty, essentially Dez, all ripped him. 

I’d say Roman (as both a poor pass play designer + run game prominence + heavily reliance on tight ends) had more to do with it than Lamar would. The way you talk, you’d think Jackson was moonballing balls over player’s heads like Trubisky. He’s a fine passer. 

He’s a fine passer? Jackson is fine when he’s throwing to guys sitting in zone facing him clapping their hands waiting for the ball. Making tight window throws against man coverage? Throwing outside the numbers? He’s awful. He’s perfect for the scheme they run. If you ask him to start chucking it to a diva #1 outside WR, his efficiency is going to be laughable. I agree Baltimore needs a more reliable #1, but I don’t think adding any WR to their roster makes them somehow a lot more dangerous. I think they’d be more deadly adding another TE to their team so they can continue to hammer soft zones that they routinely see.

Just saying that I don’t think WRs trying to work their brand are gonna be pumped to play with Lamar. 

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2 minutes ago, LinebackerGod said:

I wouldn’t. He throws the ball less than any other QB. And he’s extremely inefficient throwing to his WRs.

Okay so again take a step back and listen to what you're saying...

You're saying he force feeds Mark Andrews and isn't efficient at throwing to WR's. Now ask yourself why that might be. Is it:

A) Lamar Jackson sucks

B) There's a clear talent gap between Mark Andrews and the Ravens' WR's?

If you think it's A, I can't help you.

2 minutes ago, LinebackerGod said:

His success throwing has been dinking and dunking it to Andrews, who is elite at finding soft spots in zones and eating teams up. Jackson can’t throw accurately down the field on his limited attempts. Why would I want to play in that offense with that QB?

This isn't based on statistical evidence because Lamar's deep ball stats are actually very good.

2 minutes ago, LinebackerGod said:

I’m not criticizing him for throwing to Andrews at all lol. I’m saying he’s bad when throwing outside the numbers to his WRs. Like, kind of god awful. Not sure that’s debatable.

Kind of like how his WR's are trash outside the numbers? Weird.

2 minutes ago, LinebackerGod said:

Whether it’s the systems fault or the QB’s fault, no WR is gonna want to play in Baltimore unless it’s purely about winning. WRs are notoriously selfish. Hard to sell a guy on “blocking” and trying to catch wobblers from a below average passing QB. Lamar is a good football player and very tough to stop. But he doesn’t do his WR’s any favors. 

Wr's don't want to play here because of the scheme. Full stop. If you think dudes don't wanna play with Lamar, you're delusional. There's no other option here.

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1 hour ago, wackywabbit said:

None of the WRs who have played with him think that is the issue.

You’re not wrong, but quoting Dez Bryant as proof in 2021 is meme worthy 

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19 minutes ago, LinebackerGod said:

He’s a fine passer? Jackson is fine when he’s throwing to guys sitting in zone facing him clapping their hands waiting for the ball. Making tight window throws against man coverage? Throwing outside the numbers? He’s awful. He’s perfect for the scheme they run. If you ask him to start chucking it to a diva #1 outside WR, his efficiency is going to be laughable.
 

What do you expect, though? Great passing performances within an extremely limited offense, with extremely limited receivers, with a weakened OL, and thus a weakened run game? Talk them up if you’d like, but a Marquise Brown, Willie Snead, and Dez Bryant trio are amongst the worst in the league for a WR room. Check Tom Brady’s stats playing without weapons in 2019 and you’ll see how much of an effect weapons can have on a QB (cliff notes: he improved in nearly every statistical category). 

I’m not the biggest Lamar believer out there - he’s not an elite passer, sure. But he’s not nearly as bad as you’re saying. The guy’s a solid passer that moonlights as a better one because of how much his running ability absolutely handicaps a defense. 

 

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28 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Wr's don't want to play here because of the scheme. Full stop. If you think dudes don't wanna play with Lamar, you're delusional. There's no other option here.

You're right. WR's are banging down the doors in Baltimore to play there. Clearly. 

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3 minutes ago, LinebackerGod said:

You're right. WR's are banging down the doors in Baltimore to play there. Clearly. 

You're. Not. Listening.

They're not banging down the doors BECAUSE OF GREG ROMAN. Holy **** you people....

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3 hours ago, BucsDraftGeek47 said:

count me as one of the ones who is severely unimpressed with the Colts FO for not going after some bigger name WRs in FA

....or anyone for that matter

so much cap space and so little action

better hope Wentz reverses form 

They’re probably going to use that cap space for Nelson, Darius Leonard, and Braden Smith. I believe their priority this offseason was always to extend their own with that cap space. And they’re one of the few teams that hate giving out signing bonuses.

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1 hour ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

You're. Not. Listening.

They're not banging down the doors BECAUSE OF GREG ROMAN. Holy **** you people....

If it wasn't for Greg Roman, Lamar Jackson would not be Lamar Jackson. They are running the best offense to maximize Lamar. Having him throw the ball 30x per game to WRs is not smart so they don't do it.

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4 hours ago, Blackstar12 said:

His annual 100+ yd games 😂 

Yeah - Houston has bigger problems. 

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11 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

If it wasn't for Greg Roman, Lamar Jackson would not be Lamar Jackson. They are running the best offense to maximize Lamar. Having him throw the ball 30x per game to WRs is not smart so they don't do it.

They can still run better passing concepts when they decide to pass. That's the entire criticism of Roman's scheme, and I think there have been numerous analysts who have made videos highlighting this - guys running routes next to each other, route concepts that are just abysmal, etc.

That, combined with the Ravens already have poor WR's/WR coaching makes things extremely difficult. We'll see how things change with our recent hires and obviously the draft and continued progression of Lamar as a passer, but our passing schemes leave a lot to be desired given how much teams HAVE to sell out to stop the run.

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26 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

If it wasn't for Greg Roman, Lamar Jackson would not be Lamar Jackson. They are running the best offense to maximize Lamar. Having him throw the ball 30x per game to WRs is not smart so they don't do it.

People overthink it so much with Lamar. Just because everyone was wrong about him coming out of college we get all of this pretzel logic around how it takes this unique/amazing scheme to get the best out of him. 

The idea that he's just so lucky to have landed with an organization that has historically under-invested and mis-utilized its offensive pieces for basically its entire franchise history and landed with an OC who had to take an assistant TE coach job with us just to stay in the league after getting run out of multiple OC jobs is honestly kind of hilarious. He's done as much or more to burnish the reputation of all of these supposed geniuses he is so lucky to have landed with than the other way around. Roman's a great running game mind and the org deserves credit for helping Lamar develop, but at the end of the day, Lamar is the system. And he would have been just fine going to a team that had a more 'normal' scheme that didn't pretend they were doing him a favor by asking him to throw to a sentient traffic cone at the WR2 position running a route tree that looked revolutionary in 1965. 

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