3rd Overall Pick - Trey Lance vs Justin Fields (with bonus third poll option)

[NinerNation21]

Just now, N4L said:

My response was meant to highlight the absurdity of the quoted comment and was clearly in jest. Yeeessh

Stop joking around! This is serious business!

[J-ALL-DAY]

2 minutes ago, Forge said:

I don't know that we ever find out, to be honest. May have been an educated guess by people and Shanny is as predictably stubborn as people think lol. Could be that there was a real leak from somewhere, though that doesn't mesh with how we have handled similar draft situations in the past (Bosa) or how we handled the selection internally. 

But just taking out the "I think the pick will be Jones crowd", there are still a lot of people who believe the leader in the clubhouse is Mac Jones for whatever reason, and they aren't the type of people you easily discount. 

The thing is, Shanny/Lynch aren't going to leak and they kept quiet with people in the organization...That leads me to possibly Mike Shanahan being the leak or possibly just the Jones camp since they probably were told something in the interviews. 

Peters smiled when he saw that the team traded up to #3 so I'm guessing he was at least aware of the trade happening. Would he be someone Shanny/Lynch told this to? Because Peters has connections in the media and since he's trying to get a GM job, he's going to be cozy with reporters in hope they push for his name the next time around. 

[N4L]

12 minutes ago, Forge said:

The one that kills me is Riddick. The more that dude opens his mouth regarding the draft over the last few years, the more I understand why he can't get a GM job. Sorry, but notion of, "draft guys for your scheme" rather than "build your scheme around your talent" is such a very outdated and misguided doctrine to run a team by. 

I have never understood the love affair of Louis Riddick. Hes a (semi) good analyst, but being in the media and then going straight to a GM job is a big leap. If he was as good of a talent evaluator as everyone thinks, he would be working in a FO somewhere and would be working his way up the ladder. 

(says the fan of the team with john lynch as GM LOL)

[NinerNation21]

Wasn't the McGlinchey pick leaked like the week of the draft? 

[Forge]

3 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

The thing is, Shanny/Lynch aren't going to leak and they kept quiet with people in the organization...That leads me to possibly Mike Shanahan being the leak or possibly just the Jones camp since they probably were told something in the interviews. 

Peters smiled when he saw that the team traded up to #3 so I'm guessing he was at least aware of the trade happening. Would he be someone Shanny/Lynch told this to? Because Peters has connections in the media and since he's trying to get a GM job, he's going to be cozy with reporters in hope they push for his name the next time around. 

I do think that Peters knows. Here's the one that may surprise some people...I think Paraag knows. Paraag knew about Bosa in 2019 as well. I think that they have kept it quiet from the lower staff, but I Think the people up top know. 

[N4L]

3 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

The thing is, Shanny/Lynch aren't going to leak and they kept quiet with people in the organization...That leads me to possibly Mike Shanahan being the leak or possibly just the Jones camp since they probably were told something in the interviews. 

Mike Shanahan makes some sense, but I really dont think its him. He has been around the block enough times to know how these things work. He is obviously involved with our organization, but I doubt he would do anything to undermine his son. Maybe thats wishful thinking on my part, but I think Mike would be more likely to outright lie to a former contact than he would be to spill the beans. 

5 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Peters smiled when he saw that the team traded up to #3 so I'm guessing he was at least aware of the trade happening. Would he be someone Shanny/Lynch told this to? Because Peters has connections in the media and since he's trying to get a GM job, he's going to be cozy with reporters in hope they push for his name the next time around. 

I think Peters knew/knows. He is clearly one of the main people inside the inner circle. 

1 minute ago, NinerNation21 said:

Wasn't the McGlinchey pick leaked like the week of the draft? 

It was "leaked" 2 days before by Peter King's mock. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

1 minute ago, Forge said:

I do think that Peters knows. Here's the one that may surprise some people...I think Paraag knows. Paraag knew about Bosa in 2019 as well. I think that they have kept it quiet from the lower staff, but I Think the people up top know. 

Maybe Paraag knows but he's not leaking to these guys. He's been part of this regime and hasn't been leaking and I'm pretty sure both Lynch/Shanny made it clear to him to stop those leaks since he was part of that during the prior regimes.

I'd have to guess at this point if it is NOT the Jones' camp, then it is Peters or Mike Shanahan.

Kiper mentioned last week that you can get a good feel of what is going to happen from talking to agents of players as they are usually the first to know....That's why I'm thinking it was Jones' agent who made it known to everyone that he will be the pick.

[Forge]

1 minute ago, NinerNation21 said:

Wasn't the McGlinchey pick leaked like the week of the draft? 

They've all been leaked for the most part at some point. Except maybe Aiyuk. I never heard anything about that lead up there. It's usually Peter King and it's usually about a week before the draft. 

McG was leaked before the draft. King called out Kinlaw last year about a week + before the draft. 

I've been pretty steadfast in my thinking here. Jones could always potentially be the pick, but the reports are kind of garbage. Right now, I don't put a ton of stock into the media narrative because nobody is claiming anything within or even around the organization, even though I do find the overwhelming number of reliable reporters propagating the story to be disconcerting. However, there is no way that with a week or less to go in the draft if Peter King / Albert Breer  and those guys are still saying the pick is Mac that don't think that it has legit merit. 

[Forge]

2 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Maybe Paraag knows but he's not leaking to these guys. He's been part of this regime and hasn't been leaking and I'm pretty sure both Lynch/Shanny made it clear to him to stop those leaks since he was part of that during the prior regimes.

I'd have to guess at this point if it is NOT the Jones' camp, then it is Peters or Mike Shanahan.

Kiper mentioned last week that you can get a good feel of what is going to happen from talking to agents of players as they are usually the first to know....That's why I'm thinking it was Jones' agent who made it known to everyone that he will be the pick.

And honestly, the Peters / Mike thing would be bizarre as well. Mike is just as crazy secretive. This is a dude that never interviewed, visited, or watched Jay Cutler in any way just to keep is desire to draft him quiet LOL. 

We told Bosa's agent and representation that he was the pick at the combine, so I'd agree with you. If this is coming from somewhere, it's likely the Jones representation camp. We have a history of telling guys early (Bosa, and honestly probably Kinlaw based on his interview last year). 

[Forge]

That being said, it's still Justin Fields LOL 

[J-ALL-DAY]

3 minutes ago, Forge said:

And honestly, the Peters / Mike thing would be bizarre as well. Mike is just as crazy secretive. This is a dude that never interviewed, visited, or watched Jay Cutler in any way just to keep is desire to draft him quiet LOL. 

We told Bosa's agent and representation that he was the pick at the combine, so I'd agree with you. If this is coming from somewhere, it's likely the Jones representation camp. We have a history of telling guys early (Bosa, and honestly probably Kinlaw based on his interview last year). 

Someone mentioned and it may have been Maiocco, but that Mike is close with Schefter and they wrote a book together. That's the only reason I'm mentioning him.

Peters needs to develop a good relationship with the media to help his GM chances going forward so that's why he may be the leak.

But this seems like Jones' camp to be honest. I just wonder what the hell this front office/Shanny tell these guys in interviews. Even if they are taking them, I don't know why they would tell them they will be the pick. With Bosa, that was a no-brainier so don't mind that one since it became clear the Cards were taking Murray, he was going to be the pick. 

[big9erfan]

31 minutes ago, Forge said:

 Sorry, but notion of, "draft guys for your scheme" rather than "build your scheme around your talent" is such a very outdated and misguided doctrine to run a team by. 

I've been meaning to say this for a long time. Huge mistake to bypass talent for presumed fit. Hardly anyone had Jones going at 3 before the trade. Then suddenly everyone does because they think he is the "best fit". He's "Shanny's kind of QB". That just seems silly to me.

[big9erfan]

Read a mock this morning that had Fields going 2 to NYJ. The gist of the writeup is that GMs sometimes overthink things and want to find that "hidden gem" that guy that the rest of the world under-estimated. It strokes their egos to find that guy. The scary thing to me is that Kyle has that kind of mentality written all over him. He is always trying to prove he is smarter than everyone else. His personality might just push him off of making the "obvious choice".

[Forge]

1 minute ago, big9erfan said:

I've been meaning to say this for a long time. Huge mistake to bypass talent for presumed fit. Hardly anyone had Jones going at 3 before the trade. Then suddenly everyone does because they think he is the "best fit". He's "Shanny's kind of QB". That just seems silly to me.

Especially for Kyle Shanahan. We have seriously seen him be successful offensively with every kind of talent. Can't throw deep? That's the Jimmy G offense. Have an elite downfield thrower? Well, Matt Ryan will finish second in aDOT. Have a mobile guy? How about a ball control, hyper efficient offense led by RG3 that balances the run and pass and is one of the most efficient teams in the league on deep plays and in the red zone? There's absolutely no reason he should be looking for scheme fit. He can be successful with any of these guys and he has shown it. Take the best talent. 

That's been my biggest gripe this entire time. The reasoning is just brutal from some of these commentators. At least the guys in here who support Mac believe that he's the best prospect. I'm not going to agree with that, but I can respect that. 

[Dr A W Niloc]

14 hours ago, Forge said:

What kind of talent would Justin Fields have around him in SF? What about Trey Lance?

      The kind that benefits from a yards after catch approach more than a yardsticks-and-fall-down one.  

      A guy who is #1 in deep yards and #2 in screen yards, as opposed to one who is 20th and--brace yourself--111th respectively, is tied for 135th in average time to throw, and will be gone before Shanahan's pick.  

      The less said about a "dual threat" who runs a 4.92 40 and holds the ball for 3.37 seconds (dead last), the better.

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 The low aDOT is a result of the qb situation is SF, not a preference of shanny. He had one of the highest adots in Atlanta. One of the lowest here. Shanny adjusts to what works.

      Exactly.  And with Mac Jones neither Kyle nor his players have to make any such wholesale adjustments in system or personnel.

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It's such a bizarre stance to not consider how good these QBs are in a vacuum. Each of them would benefit considerably from shanny. It's not like that bump is only applicable to Jones.

      The difference is that while a raw QB would benefit from Shanahan, Shanahan will be benefiting from the most NFL-ready QB available.

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 They are mocking him there. Doesn't mean they think he's worth it

      At the very least, it means they believe Shanahan thinks he's worth it.

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But it's so vague to simply try to apply "missing piece" as the basis of a selection.

      Well, they did trade up to #3 to replace Jimmy Garoppolo (PFF:28th, PPG:41st) and the rest of the team looks pretty good (when healthy) so...