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What's a Football take that has you like this?


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Just to give an idea of how close they were despite the gap in total points due to Mario's body failing him, as @Forge said, here are their career PPG...

Gretzky - 1.92 (2857 points/1487 games)
Lemieux - 1.88 (1723 points/915 games)

They were equals and I guarantee if you asked Wayne, he'd agree. Mario was as special as special gets.

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16 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

Ravens fans tend to be a little overly sensitive when it comes to their quarterback. 

Last year, I basically said that I wasn't buying into Lamar's hype because it had only been one year and I gave my reasons for it, and I got absolutely bombarded by a few Ravens fans throwing themselves out the window because of it.

 

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13 hours ago, ET80 said:

I can't seem to locate 2014 numbers, but I would imagine the figure is pretty high. Not 70%, but high.

So, that's one check in favor for Donald. Now, any other stat...such as sacks, TFLs, forced fumbles, fumble recoveries, pass deflections, Interceptions, TDs?

No? Just that one stat?

Oh. Ok.

That's good for at least >>> then.

It's not even close.

You might take Donald's career, but in terms of peak, no one did what Watt did (that could have been worded better) at his peak. It was a joke. It was not human.

As for doubles, he was doubled a lot but he also played a lot of wide 9/5t - probably because he was getting doubled a lot. Something Donald can't or won't do; be as versatile in where he lines up

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1 hour ago, JAF-N72EX said:

Last year, I basically said that I wasn't buying into Lamar's hype because it had only been one year and I gave my reasons for it, and I got absolutely bombarded by a few Ravens fans throwing themselves out the window because of it.

 

Yeah and they're also doing this new thing where they can't accept any praise of Joe Burrow. You're not allowed to be into Burrow otherwise it means you're anti-Lamar.

If you check the thread in comparisons called Burrow or Lamar for the next 10 years, you will see several thesis' from Raven fans about how wrong people are to like Burrow.

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Using wins as an individual stat is dumb,  however it does have some uses.  

If I was owner, gm, head coach and starting QB (100% job security), I could under hand toss the ball to a RB every play.  I'd probably set records for completion %, if 3 and out all game, all season got me to minimum attempts to qualify.  The team would be 0-16 and laughing stock of NFL.  Do I deserve any credit for being an accurate passer? No. 

Extreme example, but if what you're doing isn't winning football games, what is the point. 

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1 hour ago, Piquel said:

Using wins as an individual stat is dumb,  however it does have some uses.  

If I was owner, gm, head coach and starting QB (100% job security), I could under hand toss the ball to a RB every play.  I'd probably set records for completion %, if 3 and out all game, all season got me to minimum attempts to qualify.  The team would be 0-16 and laughing stock of NFL.  Do I deserve any credit for being an accurate passer? No. 

Extreme example, but if what you're doing isn't winning football games, what is the point. 

If Mahomes did this, you best believe @Kirill is gonna thump his chest and boast about the greatness of the Chiefs. 

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1 hour ago, LinebackerGod said:

If Mahomes did this, you best believe @Kirill is gonna thump his chest and boast about the greatness of the Chiefs. 

0-16 I doubt he'd be boasting about the Chiefs.  Mahomes on the other hand..........

 

Also not you specific but when people quote Kirill it forces those of us that have him blocked to see his garbage. 

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3 hours ago, Piquel said:

Using wins as an individual stat is dumb,  however it does have some uses.  

If I was owner, gm, head coach and starting QB (100% job security), I could under hand toss the ball to a RB every play.  I'd probably set records for completion %, if 3 and out all game, all season got me to minimum attempts to qualify.  The team would be 0-16 and laughing stock of NFL.  Do I deserve any credit for being an accurate passer? No. 

Extreme example, but if what you're doing isn't winning football games, what is the point. 

Here's the dirty secret. EVERY stat is contextual including wins. In bulk stats show trends overall that can be useful but most stats are better served as a basis for conversation and then you need to explain the reasons behind them. Overall for QB's for instance, the best QB's ever simply have a lot of wins compared to their peers. That includes Brady, Montana, Manning, Farve, Rodgers, Brees, Marino, Elway, Bradshaw etc. 

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6 hours ago, JAF-N72EX said:

Last year, I basically said that I wasn't buying into Lamar's hype because it had only been one year and I gave my reasons for it, and I got absolutely bombarded by a few Ravens fans throwing themselves out the window because of it.

 

Calling Lamar's rookie year "terrible" is probably why you got bombarded. It's just a stupid take that demonstrates you can't analyze football at all. 

Like the previous poster who said Lamar is "putrid" when he is forced to throw the ball. Meanwhile the Ravens have been 3rd and 7th in DVOA when facing 3rd and long situations for the past two years. 

The issue with Lamar haters is that their football analysis is so bad, its probable that there's something else going on that is driving their opinion. Because honestly I don't know if people can be that stupid. 

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17 hours ago, FrantikRam said:

Clowney is more talented than anyone AD has played with up front.

Ndamukong Suh? Brockers? Absolutely not.

If you think Jadevion Clowney is talented, you've never seen him play. He looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane - there's a reason he failed in both Seattle and Tennessee.

17 hours ago, FrantikRam said:

You cite Fowler, but he's been a monumental bust in JAX and ATL. Only success was playing next to Donald. Same for Floyd.

That's more than we can say about Clowney. Even next to Watt, he didn't do much.

 

17 hours ago, FrantikRam said:

You probably can't name another pass rusher that Donald has played with the past three years. He raises the level of play of everyone in the front 7.

I've already named off Fowler and you gave me Floyd. You have Clowney, and Mercilus. Now... can you name me another pass rusher Watt has played with?

Can we also get into the supporting secondaries each had? This shouldn't be up for debate on who had the better secondary behind them. That plays into the effectiveness of a pass rush... I covered where Donald had a significant advantage on this with Talib, Peters, Ramsey, Nickell-Roby, etc. 

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1 hour ago, ET80 said:

Ndamukong Suh? Brockers? Absolutely not.

If you think Jadevion Clowney is talented, you've never seen him play. He looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane - there's a reason he failed in both Seattle and Tennessee.

That's more than we can say about Clowney. Even next to Watt, he didn't do much.

 

I've already named off Fowler and you gave me Floyd. You have Clowney, and Mercilus. Now... can you name me another pass rusher Watt has played with?

Can we also get into the supporting secondaries each had? This shouldn't be up for debate on who had the better secondary behind them. That plays into the effectiveness of a pass rush... I covered where Donald had a significant advantage on this with Talib, Peters, Ramsey, Nickell-Roby, etc. 

 

 

Well, Talib was injured most of the year. And while he was injured, Peters was one of the worst CBs in the league. Not even an exaggeration there.

Brockers offers next to nothing rushing the passer - he's not on Clowneys level in that regard, nor Fowler/Floyd's.

Floyd also did next to nothing when he was with Mack - but that makes sense because Mack is not close to Donald.

 

AD definitely had a better defense around him last year than Watt has ever had though, I'll give you that. Ramsey and John Johnson are both at the top of the league at their respective positions.

I'll also say that Watts 2014 season was better than any of ADs seasons, but when you factor in everything AD was the better player.

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