News/Info on current WFT Players

[offbyone]

13 hours ago, Slappy Mc said:

Again, any comparison to the situation involving Trent Williams is erroneous. Trent Williams refused to play for the team because of a medical situation. It was clear that Trent wanted out. The return was bad, but it was better than releasing him outright like some teams have done.

I actually both agree and disagree with you about trent.  I agree that it was a totally different situation for a number of reasons.  The biggest being that Trent Williams had already shown for a number of years to be an all pro player.  Chase Young is all potential at this point and has been more unproductive than productive on the field.  So you can't expect some amazing return for young.

I guess the real similar issue is that despite being at odds with the team we still could have gotten a good return on Trent if we timed it better.  We should have cut bait and walked sooner.  Same with Cousins.  And like them, if we want a return from Chase Young it is going to be timing based.  The exact timing is a bit unknown, but the point being now that we know we are not on the best footing with him, we should be listening to offers and willing to accept a good one cause the timing window might close as soon as it opens.

[Slappy Mc]

1 hour ago, Thaiphoon said:

Yup. I mean I think the writing is on the wall that he will not be with us next year. Regardless of how he plays this year.

So you have to ask yourself a question:

"Am I willing to trade him for a 2024 4th rounder?" (*)

Why 2024 4th?

Because that is what a 2025 3rd rounder is valued at. And if we let him walk in FA, and he signs a large contract we could get a 2025 3rd rounder as a comp pick.

But the catch with comp picks is any signing you make can cancel them out. So it is conceivable that we could get nothing in return if he leaves via FA.

Which leaves a tag and trade scenario if you want to get more value. Which could net us more than just a 2024 4th rounder. But that means that we can't tag Sweat if he also has a great season. Which means you potentially lose the better professional and (as of this moment) better player in Sweat because you wanted to milk out one extra draft pick from Young.

So what do you do?

Personally, if the team is dead set on moving on from him, I would trade him at the trade deadline. Mainly because I am not a believer in the comp pick strategy as you leave too many things to chance. That way he can show teams (hopefully) that he is recovered from his injury and hopefully increase our return. 

Trading him now would mean, to me, that they don't feel he will regain form and won't provide anything more than what we have on roster. (I don't believe this happens)

Also, I am not opposed to tag n' trade if he performs well enough to garner more than the scraps we would get now. 

I also see Montez Sweat getting extended here for a decent salary (nothing resetting the market by any means).

1 hour ago, Thaiphoon said:

EDIT: the only quibble I have with your post is that IMHO Trent was not refusing to play because of a medical condition. He was using that as an excuse to provide cover for the fact that he just wanted out. He was trying to get a brand new contract with guaranteed $$ and when he was told no, the medical excuse was put front and center as why he wasn't showing up (**)

 

(**) Note I'm not saying he made up the cancer. I'm saying he was blaming the medical staff for the missed diagnosis as the reason why he was not coming back. It was BS. The whole thing was a run-of-the-mill contract dispute that he used his personal medical issues to muddy the waters and generate sympathy to him and public sentiment against the team.

I also don't want to discredit the dispute that happened with Bruce Allen. Trent Williams by all accounts was done with Washington. If they had reset the market with a fully gtd deal, maybe he stays, but the damage was done both ways and it was best to move on. 

[Thaiphoon]

2 hours ago, Slappy Mc said:

Personally, if the team is dead set on moving on from him, I would trade him at the trade deadline. Mainly because I am not a believer in the comp pick strategy as you leave too many things to chance. That way he can show teams (hopefully) that he is recovered from his injury and hopefully increase our return. 

Trading him now would mean, to me, that they don't feel he will regain form and won't provide anything more than what we have on roster. (I don't believe this happens)

Oh I don't mean now. I think you get more possible value right at the deadline than right now. Every team right now has their team "set" and it will take until October to show a team that the DE that they thought was gonna work isn't and the only thing they need is a good DE. Enter in Washington dangling Chase for a Day 2 pick.

[lavar703]

On 6/12/2023 at 12:29 PM, Slappy Mc said:

Personally, if the team is dead set on moving on from him, I would trade him at the trade deadline. Mainly because I am not a believer in the comp pick strategy as you leave too many things to chance. That way he can show teams (hopefully) that he is recovered from his injury and hopefully increase our return. 

Trading him now would mean, to me, that they don't feel he will regain form and won't provide anything more than what we have on roster. (I don't believe this happens)

Also, I am not opposed to tag n' trade if he performs well enough to garner more than the scraps we would get now. 

I also see Montez Sweat getting extended here for a decent salary (nothing resetting the market by any means).

I also don't want to discredit the dispute that happened with Bruce Allen. Trent Williams by all accounts was done with Washington. If they had reset the market with a fully gtd deal, maybe he stays, but the damage was done both ways and it was best to move on. 

I don’t see anyone getting a contract extension. Harris has no idea about this roster and he’s not keeping this group. There’s simply no way Rivera and Mayhew get more time under Harris. It’s not happening. By the time Harris’ group has their first full off-season it will be year 5 for this regime and considering the schedule we face you’re looking at at best another .500 type season. 
 

 

[Slappy Mc]

16 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

I don’t see anyone getting a contract extension. Harris has no idea about this roster and he’s not keeping this group. There’s simply no way Rivera and Mayhew get more time under Harris. It’s not happening. By the time Harris’ group has their first full off-season it will be year 5 for this regime and considering the schedule we face you’re looking at at best another .500 type season. 
 

 

I'm not so definitive about them going. I would prefer for the new owner to clean house and start over. However, Rivera is well respected in the HC circles and the players respond well to him. I personally cannot ignore the mismanagement of the previous 3 seasons, but I also don't cut the checks. 

If a big name becomes available, I think we are an up and coming destination with the Snyder cloud not looming anymore. 

[turtle28]

On 6/13/2023 at 1:30 PM, lavar703 said:

I don’t see anyone getting a contract extension. Harris has no idea about this roster and he’s not keeping this group. There’s simply no way Rivera and Mayhew get more time under Harris. It’s not happening. By the time Harris’ group has their first full off-season it will be year 5 for this regime and considering the schedule we face you’re looking at at best another .500 type season. 

If Chase has a double digit/break out season, Harris is going to want to re-sign the hometown kid bc he’s coming off a good year & they can promote him.

 A guy like Magic will agree with that too. It’s all in Chase’s hands.

Rivera may want to trade Chase, I have to wonder if the new owners will left him knowing that unless Rivera wins some playoffs games this year that he won’t be their director of football operations/head coach next year.

[turtle28]

Theisman to Monk highlights 

[offbyone]

On 6/16/2023 at 5:03 PM, turtle28 said:

If Chase has a double digit/break out season, Harris is going to want to re-sign the hometown kid bc he’s coming off a good year & they can promote him.

 A guy like Magic will agree with that too. It’s all in Chase’s hands.

Rivera may want to trade Chase, I have to wonder if the new owners will left him knowing that unless Rivera wins some playoffs games this year that he won’t be their director of football operations/head coach next year.

I hope not, that would mean Harris and Magic are making personnel decisions.  That would just mean we got a new Dan Snyder.

[turtle28]

On 6/12/2023 at 12:04 PM, offbyone said:

I actually both agree and disagree with you about trent.  I agree that it was a totally different situation for a number of reasons.  The biggest being that Trent Williams had already shown for a number of years to be an all pro player.  Chase Young is all potential at this point and has been more unproductive than productive on the field.  So you can't expect some amazing return for young.

I guess the real similar issue is that despite being at odds with the team we still could have gotten a good return on Trent if we timed it better.  We should have cut bait and walked sooner.  Same with Cousins.  And like them, if we want a return from Chase Young it is going to be timing based.  The exact timing is a bit unknown, but the point being now that we know we are not on the best footing with him, we should be listening to offers and willing to accept a good one cause the timing window might close as soon as it opens.

If we’re going to trade Chase it makes zero sense to do it now as his value is as low as it can be. We/he has to build up his value w/ him hopefully having a good first month or two of the season.
 

Then, if Rivera is he’ll bent on trading Chase - which I don’t know why he would be if say Chase has 5 sacks the first 8 games - but, you then trade Chase at the trade deadline to a contender who needs pass rush help like say the Bills, Chiefs, Bengals or Ravens maybe?

Then we probably get a 1st or at least a 2nd for him.

Edited June 19 by turtle28

[turtle28]

10 hours ago, offbyone said:

I hope not, that would mean Harris and Magic are making personnel decisions.  That would just mean we got a new Dan Snyder.

Any decision to pay a player $20 mil a year is going to involve the owners sign off. That will always be the case.

I will say that I don’t expect Rivera & the Marty’s to be around next February to be making the decision on Chase Young or Montez Sweat & how to handle which one to sign long term. I think they’ll all be fired unless we win 10 plus games this year.

Edited June 19 by turtle28

[Troublez]

On 6/19/2023 at 4:30 AM, turtle28 said:

If we’re going to trade Chase it makes zero sense to do it now as his value is as low as it can be. We/he has to build up his value w/ him hopefully having a good first month or two of the season.
 

Then, if Rivera is he’ll bent on trading Chase - which I don’t know why he would be if say Chase has 5 sacks the first 8 games - but, you then trade Chase at the trade deadline to a contender who needs pass rush help like say the Bills, Chiefs, Bengals or Ravens maybe?

Then we probably get a 1st or at least a 2nd for him.

How many sacks has Chase got the last 16 games he's played? Do you really think he's capable of getting 5 more in 8 games?

Turtle I think your a little bias given his College production and your fandom. This dude is a bum - and it's his attitude, nothing physical is holding him back. Hopefully, he has been humbled and ready to be coached. Otherwise, I'd just bench him / use as a situational pass rusher because this defense looks better when he's not on the field. And that's super sad to say....

[lavar703]

1 hour ago, Troublez said:

How many sacks has Chase got the last 16 games he's played? Do you really think he's capable of getting 5 more in 8 games?

Turtle I think your a little bias given his College production and your fandom. This dude is a bum - and it's his attitude, nothing physical is holding him back. Hopefully, he has been humbled and ready to be coached. Otherwise, I'd just bench him / use as a situational pass rusher because this defense looks better when he's not on the field. And that's super sad to say....

Everyone is biased on this topic. He's going to be here another year and we'll see what happens. Either he's great and we pay him or he's not and he's gone. 

[turtle28]

On 6/13/2023 at 1:30 PM, lavar703 said:

I don’t see anyone getting a contract extension. Harris has no idea about this roster and he’s not keeping this group. There’s simply no way Rivera and Mayhew get more time under Harris. It’s not happening. By the time Harris’ group has their first full off-season it will be year 5 for this regime and considering the schedule we face you’re looking at at best another .500 type season. 
 

 

I don’t think anyone gets a contract extension this August or whatever.
 

I think Chase earns his. If Chase has a better season than he had as a rookie, Harris/Rales/Magic will see the potential in Chase & the new GM will franchise Chase & then give him a Da’Ron Payne type deal. 
 

Curl has a great year then he’ll get re-signed. If he doesn’t then they’ll let him walk & Quan Martin will be our starting SS next year.

The only way Sweat gets a contract extension is if Chase has an awful year & Sweat has a dominant year.

[turtle28]

17 hours ago, Troublez said:

How many sacks has Chase got the last 16 games he's played? Do you really think he's capable of getting 5 more in 8 games?

Turtle I think your a little bias given his College production and your fandom. This dude is a bum - and it's his attitude, nothing physical is holding him back. Hopefully, he has been humbled and ready to be coached. Otherwise, I'd just bench him / use as a situational pass rusher because this defense looks better when he's not on the field. And that's super sad to say....

Chase has had 6.5 sacks his last 16 games he played in that he was healthy. And 2 taken away on bogus roughing the passer calls in 2021, if you could those that’s 8.5 before the age of 23.

He also has 5 forced fumbles & a fumble recovery for a TD which was a game changing play vs the 49ers as a rookie in a game where if he doesn’t make that play we probably lose the game.
 

My bias has nothing to do with college. @lavar703 can remember, I didn’t even want to draft Chase really until the draft got closer & especially not before the 2019 college football season. I wanted Andrew Thomas or my line was “tank for Tua” but that was before Tua dislocated his hip. I wanted Andrew Thomas bc we were going to lose Trent & we needed to draft a new LT.

I mean effin shoot me dead for rooting for a Commanders player to succeed that we drafted 2nd overall & I still want to see become an All-Pro type player!

If that makes me some ridiculously biased fan bc I want to see Chase reach his expectations then I guess I’m just going to have to live with that.

The difference between me & most in this forum & half the donk on Twitter is I will always root for the Commanders player to succeed & reach their potential until it’s blatantly obvious they wont then I’ll say they should just be a back up or we need to move on.

In Chase’s case - short of his rookie season & the first half of his 2nd season when I believe he was still just 22 - he hasn’t been healthy to prove himself & reach that potential so if I’m an idiot bc I want to see if he can do that this year before giving up on our 2nd overall pick who does have Julius Peppers type natural athleticism still at 6’5, 270 pounds, then so be it! I guess I’m the idiot! 😂 

I guess we’ll find out by January who’s right.

[Slappy Mc]

8 hours ago, turtle28 said:

I mean effin shoot me dead for rooting for a Commanders player to succeed that we drafted 2nd overall & I still want to see become an All-Pro type player!

If that makes me some ridiculously biased fan bc I want to see Chase reach his expectations then I guess I’m just going to have to live with that.

The difference between me & most in this forum & half the donk on Twitter is I will always root for the Commanders player to succeed & reach their potential until it’s blatantly obvious they wont then I’ll say they should just be a back up or we need to move on.

Two things that you need to consider:

1. If Chase wasn't drafted 2nd overall, would you be this hard-pressed to admit that he has failed (so-far)? Not sure why you aren't beating the table for Montez Sweat to get a contract extension first. If you recall he was also a 1st round pick and has significantly better stats.

2. When the team decided to decline his 5th-year option, that should have told you a lot about "the potential" that you speak of. He has been monitored and evaluated very closely for 3 years by the staff and they concluded that 17.5M was too much to commit to Chase for next year. Even if he balls out here, his chances to resign here went down significantly. The team essentially is playing hard ball. Ron came out and said that Chase understands this side of the business. If the shoe flips and Chase has the leverage, he will absolutely use everything in his power to max his profits, that probably won't be with the team that didn't believe in him enough to pick up his option. I think you need to look at this season more as a 1 year rental. (JMHO)

 

Also, hopefully you understand that those that see the "reality" of the Chase Young situation are not rooting for him to fail, we just aren't expecting him to succeed anymore. We want him to do really well. It would be amazing if things clicked and he became a world-beater. There just isn't anything that has been shown to indicate that it is going to happen.