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Trojan's Raider Mock


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The Draft:
17. Trade down TB. 32 + 64 + 2022 3rd
32. Alim McNeill, DT NC State
48. Tyson Campbell, CB Georgia
64. Jamar Johnson, FS Indiana
79. Jalen Mayfield, RT Michigan
80. Pete Werner, LB The Ohio State
121. Shaka Toney, SLB/LEO Penn State
162. Jamie Newman, QB Wake Forest
167. Jaylon Moore, RG Western Michigan
200. Jonathan Adams Jr., WR Arkansas State

Alim McNeill -- I realize this is higher than most have him, but this is the must come away with player of the class for me of prospect we will definitely have an opportunity to get. When you watch NC State, when it's a good rep you rewind and see #29 lined up right over the center popping up with the speed as if he himself snapped the ball with a quick grip and the ability to 2 gap the center and control where the run lane is going to be. Against North Carolina (Tarheels with Javonte Williams Michael Carter, and a future NFL QB) NC State got silly wrecked, but you rewind and #29 was subbed out, or was dang close to making the play at the LOS but the talent around him allowed the RBs enough lateral space to escape. I won't hold that against Alim, because the reps he is in the game have a massive impact on how that defense plays. He collapses the pocket, dictates where LBs can shoot cleanly, and has a violence of pressuring the pocket inwards and creating disruption unexpected of a nose tackle. He seemed to line up near exclusively over the center, but you can see athleticism that if needed he could play 3 technique alongside Johnathan Hankins and be disruptive there as well, and then replace Hankins when you want a NT -- but still want some pocket collapsing in likely, but not sure bet, passing situations where a more traditional 3tech like Mo Hurst needs to be on the field. There's no prospect like McNeill in the class. Sure there are monster sized noses like Shelvin from LSU, Slaton from Florida, and Quinton Bohanna (who I like very late if the Raiders miss on Alim) from Kentucky, but it's not in the same class of athlete at all. Those are more Terrance Cody "oh that's a big boy" guys, than the "wow, that nose has moves" you see from Alim. He looks like a Fletcher Cox type to me, and I keep thinking second round, but for the Raiders I'd be scared to not draft him because I like him so much and to me that means trade down for more picks and reach. If we could go to 32 or around there, then the reach isn't a big one.


Tyson Campbell -- Sometimes looks over the wrong shoulder, but size wise and as a guy that is fairly consistently riding his WR down the sideline here is a scheme fit. Tyson Campbell would be a great CB2 for us, at least it looks that way to me, and would allow Damon Arnette to play the nickle when we want 3 corners and they can compete for the job when in base. This is the kind of investment that I feel like will help all three highly drafted young CBs take the leap together as a very talented group and make our traditional weakness a strength. Corner depth with the amount of injuries we've sustained at the position makes it all the more of a priority than on paper. Arnette over Amik in nickle, then Mullen, Campbell and  Johnson as boundaries with someone like Nevin Lawson being the veteran of the group looks good to me. I'm sure most are familiar with Campbell so I'll end this here.

Jamar Johnson -- Moved from cornerback to Safety this last year, and despite the limited experience displayed that which we need. A guy that can rove in the single high bait QBs and break on the ball. Before the snap he shows one thing, then changes plan with authority and moves into position ruining reads and allowing him to make plays on the ball. His projected weaknesses are essentially the opposite of Johnathan Abram and I think as a pair these two would work well with one another, and if Johnson's more CB tier of tackling just disrupts a guy enough a Abram or Karl Joseph could lay the wood and still make a stop. Jamar is in position, has range, and can sell one thing and jump another which is what we lack.

Jalen Mayfield -- Some have him as fringe first and often second round... but this guy is raw and lacks the supreme length. I think this is closer to correct range, but he has what could be built up to be a nasty guard or run game grader right tackle with coaching and I think Cable would be a fit to clean up a lot of the rawness. The versatility of Denzelle Good is another reason why I feel Mayfield could be that OL option for us as his ability to play guard or tackle would give flexibility to Mayfield to develop at whichever he can, if he can. If it takes a year to make the line up Simpson could play guard and Good at tackle and we'd be unspectacular, but passable. If Mayfield cleans up technique and independent hand usage and coordinates his feet with his strikes it will be a special bookend to Kolton though and that's what we should swing for in the third -- his nastiness is the difference between him and others in his tier of this deep class to me and it's exciting enough that I feel he's a pound the table guy for Gruden and Cable at appropriate value.

Pete Werner -- This guy isn't as athletically special as his team mates, or a few other LBs in the tier above, but he has experience across multiple LB positions, dependability in relation to health, and size and length needed to be a top notch versatile back up that will be fine if inserted into the lineup. The range of a Littleton or Kwiatkoski should help his more average range if needed as it wouldn't be his primary responsibility. That said he has demonstrated against Clemson and Alabama and other top schools the ability to blitz gaps, read and react to zone movement and fill the lane, and drop back into a zone and pinch slants and over routes. 

Shaka Toney -- He didn't play linebacker which is where I'd be drafting him to develop into the SLB position. That said he was an undersized edge player opposite athletic freaks like Yetur Gross Matos last year and Jayson Oweh this year and another athletic freak a year ago was at SLB in Micah Parsons. I wish with Parsons opt out that Toney had received more looks at SLB, but his build and athletic profile suggest he could at least give it a go. He did however get some looks at SLB in the Senior Bowl practices and held his own following some routes downfield and is defensive end background suggest high end blitzing ability, although from SLB it would be from a standing position instead of hand in the ground. Character wise this guy is a massive buy from what I've seen. If I were a GM I'd be all about bringing him in and him giving enough to succeed at whatever position possible, but he looks pretty maxed as a DE to me and will have to either learn SLB or land with a 3-4 team.

Jamie Newman -- There's work to be done, but that said the time frame I'm watching is from 2019 given he didn't play in 2020 so maybe he has worked privately over the last year working on some of those things. He isn't a hyper mobile QB, but he isn't a statue way more earlier Big Ben-y mobility (not contact balance) than he is a run threat like Cam Newton or whatever. His release looks fine, and he appears to get through reads but it's not a finished product. It's flashy tools like the occasional "oh wow that's definitely an NFL throw" and an athlete's body for Gruden to develop with a grown man's professional attitude and demeanor in interviews that shows seriousness and give a dang that might be why Gruden prefers, historically, veterans over young rookies.

Jaylon Moore -- Small school, but this big man can move. I think the leap to the NFL is an ask especially to remain at tackle, but imagining this body build moving on a pull at guard is draftable for sure. I think he'd be a hedge prospect to Jaylen Mayfield and if both pan out you just landed a talented right side at a value, but if only one pans out it's a versatile player with size and some movement and a nastiness. Ideally he'd develop at RG behind Good and Mayfield would pan out and start at RT.

Jonathan Adams, Jr. -- This guy is stiff in lower routes that ask for movement quickly like an in cut or slant, but if you have him go deeper then break in or out in Post/Vert/Corner routers then he will uniquely "Moss" guys. The construction of our WR depth chart shows to me only Bryan Edwards as a guy that has size and physicality, and Adams might fight for a latter spot on the roster because of that, or get work on the PS and refine his footwork to challenge in 2022. 7th rounders are tough as it's either "oh that guy is long gone" or "that guy probably doesn't make the roster" and it's a fine line, but I think this is close to what a 7th rounder looks like. Some potential to make the roster given construction of what we have if he earns that spot in camp, and something special, like Quinton Bell a Mayock 7th had athletic freakishness, Adams has those "Moss'd" style highlights. 

QB: Derek Carr, Marcus Mariota, Jamie Newman
RB: Josh Jacobs, Kenyan Drake, Jalen Richard or Theo Riddick
FB: Alec Ingold
WR: Henry Ruggs III, Bryan Edwards
WR: John Brown, Johnathan Adams
Slot: Hunter Renfrow, Willie Snead
TE: Darren Waller, Foster Moreau, Derek Carrier
LT: Kolton Miller
LG: Richie Incognito, John Simpson
OC: Andre James, Nick Martin
RG: Denzelle Good, Jaylon Moore
RT: Jaylen Mayfield, Brandon Parker

DE: Clelin Ferrell, Carl Nassib
NT: Alim McNeill, Johnathan Hankins
DT: Solomon Thomas, Maurice Hurst, Quinton Jefferson
LEO: Yannick Ngakoue, Maxx Crosby

SLB: Nick Marrow, Shaka Toney
MLB: Nick Kwiatkoski, Pete Werner
WLB: Cory Littleton, Tanner Muse

CB: Trayvon Mullen, Isaiah Johnson
CB: Tyson Campbell, Nevin Lawson
Nickle: Damon Arnette, Amik Robertson

FS: Jamar Johnson, Karl Joseph
SS: Johnathan Abram, Jeff Heath

LS: Trent Sieg
K: Daniel Carlson
P: AJ Cole

Edited by Trojan
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I don’t love it, but I like it. I like the trade down to 32 (although don’t like the player), love Campbell in the 2nd, like the Jamar pick, like the Werner pick, and Mayfield in the 3rd is super good value, even though I don’t like him much. 

Edited by BayRaider
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I really like the picks of Werner and Newman.  I like the trade down a lot.  But with all due respect I really would be disappointed our first pick was McNeil.  He’s a 3rd rounder in my eyes and while we are adding depth we aren’t adding any top end talent.

I see Johnson as a 3rd to 4th round prospect and a developmental FS. Definitely not someone I’d ever want starting year 1.

Edited by jimkelly02
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14 hours ago, Trojan said:

The Draft:
17. Trade down TB. 32 + 64 + 2022 3rd
32. Alim McNeill, DT NC State
48. Tyson Campbell, CB Georgia
64. Jamar Johnson, FS Indiana
79. Jalen Mayfield, RT Michigan
80. Pete Werner, LB The Ohio State
121. Shaka Toney, SLB/LEO Penn State
162. Jamie Newman, QB Wake Forest
167. Jaylon Moore, RG Western Michigan
200. Jonathan Adams Jr., WR Arkansas State

Alim McNeill -- I realize this is higher than most have him, but this is the must come away with player of the class for me of prospect we will definitely have an opportunity to get. When you watch NC State, when it's a good rep you rewind and see #29 lined up right over the center popping up with the speed as if he himself snapped the ball with a quick grip and the ability to 2 gap the center and control where the run lane is going to be. Against North Carolina (Tarheels with Javonte Williams Michael Carter, and a future NFL QB) NC State got silly wrecked, but you rewind and #29 was subbed out, or was dang close to making the play at the LOS but the talent around him allowed the RBs enough lateral space to escape. I won't hold that against Alim, because the reps he is in the game have a massive impact on how that defense plays. He collapses the pocket, dictates where LBs can shoot cleanly, and has a violence of pressuring the pocket inwards and creating disruption unexpected of a nose tackle. He seemed to line up near exclusively over the center, but you can see athleticism that if needed he could play 3 technique alongside Johnathan Hankins and be disruptive there as well, and then replace Hankins when you want a NT -- but still want some pocket collapsing in likely, but not sure bet, passing situations where a more traditional 3tech like Mo Hurst needs to be on the field. There's no prospect like McNeill in the class. Sure there are monster sized noses like Shelvin from LSU, Slaton from Florida, and Quinton Bohanna (who I like very late if the Raiders miss on Alim) from Kentucky, but it's not in the same class of athlete at all. Those are more Terrance Cody "oh that's a big boy" guys, than the "wow, that nose has moves" you see from Alim. He looks like a Fletcher Cox type to me, and I keep thinking second round, but for the Raiders I'd be scared to not draft him because I like him so much and to me that means trade down for more picks and reach. If we could go to 32 or around there, then the reach isn't a big one.


Tyson Campbell -- Sometimes looks over the wrong shoulder, but size wise and as a guy that is fairly consistently riding his WR down the sideline here is a scheme fit. Tyson Campbell would be a great CB2 for us, at least it looks that way to me, and would allow Damon Arnette to play the nickle when we want 3 corners and they can compete for the job when in base. This is the kind of investment that I feel like will help all three highly drafted young CBs take the leap together as a very talented group and make our traditional weakness a strength. Corner depth with the amount of injuries we've sustained at the position makes it all the more of a priority than on paper. Arnette over Amik in nickle, then Mullen, Campbell and  Johnson as boundaries with someone like Nevin Lawson being the veteran of the group looks good to me. I'm sure most are familiar with Campbell so I'll end this here.

Jamar Johnson -- Moved from cornerback to Safety this last year, and despite the limited experience displayed that which we need. A guy that can rove in the single high bait QBs and break on the ball. Before the snap he shows one thing, then changes plan with authority and moves into position ruining reads and allowing him to make plays on the ball. His projected weaknesses are essentially the opposite of Johnathan Abram and I think as a pair these two would work well with one another, and if Johnson's more CB tier of tackling just disrupts a guy enough a Abram or Karl Joseph could lay the wood and still make a stop. Jamar is in position, has range, and can sell one thing and jump another which is what we lack.

Jalen Mayfield -- Some have him as fringe first and often second round... but this guy is raw and lacks the supreme length. I think this is closer to correct range, but he has what could be built up to be a nasty guard or run game grader right tackle with coaching and I think Cable would be a fit to clean up a lot of the rawness. The versatility of Denzelle Good is another reason why I feel Mayfield could be that OL option for us as his ability to play guard or tackle would give flexibility to Mayfield to develop at whichever he can, if he can. If it takes a year to make the line up Simpson could play guard and Good at tackle and we'd be unspectacular, but passable. If Mayfield cleans up technique and independent hand usage and coordinates his feet with his strikes it will be a special bookend to Kolton though and that's what we should swing for in the third -- his nastiness is the difference between him and others in his tier of this deep class to me and it's exciting enough that I feel he's a pound the table guy for Gruden and Cable at appropriate value.

Pete Werner -- This guy isn't as athletically special as his team mates, or a few other LBs in the tier above, but he has experience across multiple LB positions, dependability in relation to health, and size and length needed to be a top notch versatile back up that will be fine if inserted into the lineup. The range of a Littleton or Kwiatkoski should help his more average range if needed as it wouldn't be his primary responsibility. That said he has demonstrated against Clemson and Alabama and other top schools the ability to blitz gaps, read and react to zone movement and fill the lane, and drop back into a zone and pinch slants and over routes. 

Shaka Toney -- He didn't play linebacker which is where I'd be drafting him to develop into the SLB position. That said he was an undersized edge player opposite athletic freaks like Yetur Gross Matos last year and Jayson Oweh this year and another athletic freak a year ago was at SLB in Micah Parsons. I wish with Parsons opt out that Toney had received more looks at SLB, but his build and athletic profile suggest he could at least give it a go. He did however get some looks at SLB in the Senior Bowl practices and held his own following some routes downfield and is defensive end background suggest high end blitzing ability, although from SLB it would be from a standing position instead of hand in the ground. Character wise this guy is a massive buy from what I've seen. If I were a GM I'd be all about bringing him in and him giving enough to succeed at whatever position possible, but he looks pretty maxed as a DE to me and will have to either learn SLB or land with a 3-4 team.

Jamie Newman -- There's work to be done, but that said the time frame I'm watching is from 2019 given he didn't play in 2020 so maybe he has worked privately over the last year working on some of those things. He isn't a hyper mobile QB, but he isn't a statue way more earlier Big Ben-y mobility (not contact balance) than he is a run threat like Cam Newton or whatever. His release looks fine, and he appears to get through reads but it's not a finished product. It's flashy tools like the occasional "oh wow that's definitely an NFL throw" and an athlete's body for Gruden to develop with a grown man's professional attitude and demeanor in interviews that shows seriousness and give a dang that might be why Gruden prefers, historically, veterans over young rookies.

Jaylon Moore -- Small school, but this big man can move. I think the leap to the NFL is an ask especially to remain at tackle, but imagining this body build moving on a pull at guard is draftable for sure. I think he'd be a hedge prospect to Jaylen Mayfield and if both pan out you just landed a talented right side at a value, but if only one pans out it's a versatile player with size and some movement and a nastiness. Ideally he'd develop at RG behind Good and Mayfield would pan out and start at RT.

Jonathan Adams, Jr. -- This guy is stiff in lower routes that ask for movement quickly like an in cut or slant, but if you have him go deeper then break in or out in Post/Vert/Corner routers then he will uniquely "Moss" guys. The construction of our WR depth chart shows to me only Bryan Edwards as a guy that has size and physicality, and Adams might fight for a latter spot on the roster because of that, or get work on the PS and refine his footwork to challenge in 2022. 7th rounders are tough as it's either "oh that guy is long gone" or "that guy probably doesn't make the roster" and it's a fine line, but I think this is close to what a 7th rounder looks like. Some potential to make the roster given construction of what we have if he earns that spot in camp, and something special, like Quinton Bell a Mayock 7th had athletic freakishness, Adams has those "Moss'd" style highlights. 

QB: Derek Carr, Marcus Mariota, Jamie Newman
RB: Josh Jacobs, Kenyan Drake, Jalen Richard or Theo Riddick
FB: Alec Ingold
WR: Henry Ruggs III, Bryan Edwards
WR: John Brown, Johnathan Adams
Slot: Hunter Renfrow, Willie Snead
TE: Darren Waller, Foster Moreau, Derek Carrier
LT: Kolton Miller
LG: Richie Incognito, John Simpson
OC: Andre James, Nick Martin
RG: Denzelle Good, Jaylon Moore
RT: Jaylen Mayfield, Brandon Parker

DE: Clelin Ferrell, Carl Nassib
NT: Alim McNeill, Johnathan Hankins
DT: Solomon Thomas, Maurice Hurst, Quinton Jefferson
LEO: Yannick Ngakoue, Maxx Crosby

SLB: Nick Marrow, Shaka Toney
MLB: Nick Kwiatkoski, Pete Werner
WLB: Cory Littleton, Tanner Muse

CB: Trayvon Mullen, Isaiah Johnson
CB: Tyson Campbell, Nevin Lawson
Nickle: Damon Arnette, Amik Robertson

FS: Jamar Johnson, Karl Joseph
SS: Johnathan Abram, Jeff Heath

LS: Trent Sieg
K: Daniel Carlson
P: AJ Cole

I actually like the trade down for Alim McNeil. I’m all for a NT that can rush the passer. You like Mayfield for us at RT? I’m hearing Jamar Johnson  More and more

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1 hour ago, Jeremy408 said:

I actually like the trade down for Alim McNeil. I’m all for a NT that can rush the passer. You like Mayfield for us at RT? I’m hearing Jamar Johnson  More and more

  Mayfield is my least favorite player in my mock, but it's fully because I view him as volatile. Very boom/bust, but I think he fits what we would be looking for and I do think he has a decent shot of panning out if he lands with the right coaching staff, and I view Gruden/Cable as fits for him. He is very young, has like a year and a couple games starting experience and needs to coordinate how it all comes together. Beyond that I think he looks like he fits on our right side and helps get push in the run game. I wouldn't select him and be fully confident he locks down a starting spot in 2021 for sure though.

2 hours ago, lester said:

That is truly a GOD AWFUL DRAFT...just a bunch of bodies...for a team like the Raiders who are devoid of TALENT it always amazes me when fans do thesecrazytrade downs

  Sorry I didn't post the guys you like. All these dudes are talented though. I don't know what you want in this class, but when I see a cash purge from the OL, my immediate thought isn't to invest the first round pick into it -- putting the money right back into the line. Following the money we threw a bunch of 3 tech defensive tackles contracts, none massive but definitely a shotgun approach. Where's the nose? It's Hankins and no one. Nose is a target for us, and the type of nose I feel like we want and need is Alim and there isn't another Alim McNeill. The only other path I see is Marvin Wilson or Christian Barmore and Barmore involves us taking him at 17, which is a no thanks to me, and Wilson is a crap shoot in the 2nd to 5th range that you are silly messed over if he's sniped as there is no one else (not looking for the big body that holds the point and nothing more, although for that I like Kentucky's Quinton Bohanna who for a handful of snaps a game can do more than expected but I'm not sure his handful of snaps over the year is worth a pick above the 7th // Alim will play in a lot more situations). Barmore is more raw and peaks and valleys of play to me than Alim. Wilson was good, but regressed. Alim McNeill has displayed consistent 2 gap play at a high level and rare penetration and pocket collapsing he is athletic for a nose and his leverage is perfect fit. I would find it hard to believe your critique is about Tyson Campbell for no talent.

13 hours ago, Humble_Beast said:

I want a high impact defender in the first- Micah, Collins, JOK, Horn, Farley

 

We added a high impact rusher on the DL unit for pass rush, would be wonderful to add a high impact player to the LB or DBS

  I like Alim McNeill more the Zaven Collins especially for our scheme and what we've invested. Zaven Collins and Micah Parsons I like, but I really like the idea of  (mid to late) Shaka Toney at that position although I'd expect it takes him a year to develop into that. Shaka Toney is still a very good athlete even if he isn't as freakish as Parsons. JOK I view as a replacement for Cory Littleton and we've invested in Littleton and restructured him locking him in for sure. That's not where I want to put draft capital. Horn I think is a penalty machine and Farley's back is a big no thanks. Tyson Campbell is a high impact DB, and Jamar Johnson might develop into one as well. Werner is a safe projection as depth to all three LB positions, and Toney is an upside projection to SLB or depth at LEO  behind Yannick and Maxx.

12 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

I really like the picks of Werner and Newman.  I like the trade down a lot.  But with all due respect I really would be disappointed our first pick was McNeil.  He’s a 3rd rounder in my eyes and while we are adding depth we aren’t adding any top end talent.

I see Johnson as a 3rd to 4th round prospect and a developmental FS. Definitely not someone I’d ever want starting year 1.

  I started with McNeill as a high third, then he's moved up to a mid to early second rounder for me. Due to the nature of how he was rotated and how NTs play out in the NFL he might not project to full time role, but I see a lot more penetration and quickness from him than I ever expect for a nose. I think he legitimately can play 3-tech next to Hankins, then replace Hankins and play next to a Maurice Hurst, or Solomon Thomas. His pro day testing numbers look comparable to Javon Hargrave, who yes was later pick, but if you watch the Youtube condensed games titled something like North Carolina OL v. NC State, and then Miami OL v. NC State the impact this guy has is top talent. It's not a highlight video of wow play one after another, but basically every rep you see it go right, you rewind and it's #29. When it's bad he's subbed out or the talent surrounding him surrendered lateral movement. North Carolina is stacked offensively, and definitely isn't a cherry picked game. It's just a better than normal projection as it's two NFL backs and a future NFL QB with a lot of slipperiness in Howell. His height at like 6'1 or 6'2 or whatever it is is natural leverage and you see him squatting down in front of the center heads up and his center of gravity is extremely low and the explosion up and to punch or latch is fast and effective, he has a couple moves too I saw him duck down and slide under, swim move over and attack with his hands in addition to a bullrush. The way he two gaps is important to the scheme as well. This is a talented player, and if we did get him in the 3rd or whatever I'm all about it. I'm comfortable in the late first though, and talent tier drop  -- to me -- looks roughly where we are at 17 so a trade down to a team valuing a specific guy might give us an opportunity to get another selection. Jamar Johnson is inexperienced I agree with that, but I'm not a big fan of this safety class. Johnson has displayed more range and the ability to mess up reads than the other guys, the other one I like is Elijah Molden but he is a nickel convert and I'm not sure we'd use him right given we kept messing up Lamarcus Joyner.

15 hours ago, BayRaider said:

I don’t love it, but I like it. I like the trade down to 32 (although don’t like the player), love Campbell in the 2nd, like the Jamar pick, like the Werner pick, and Mayfield in the 3rd is super good value, even though I don’t like him much. 

Liking roughly half is a good thing, thanks.

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5 minutes ago, Trojan said:

  Mayfield is my least favorite player in my mock, but it's fully because I view him as volatile. Very boom/bust, but I think he fits what we would be looking for and I do think he has a decent shot of panning out if he lands with the right coaching staff, and I view Gruden/Cable as fits for him. He is very young, has like a year and a couple games starting experience and needs to coordinate how it all comes together. Beyond that I think he looks like he fits on our right side and helps get push in the run game. I wouldn't select him and be fully confident he locks down a starting spot in 2021 for sure though.

  Sorry I didn't post the guys you like. All these dudes are talented though. I don't know what you want in this class, but when I see a cash purge from the OL, my immediate thought isn't to invest the first round pick into it -- putting the money right back into the line. Following the money we threw a bunch of 3 tech defensive tackles contracts, none massive but definitely a shotgun approach. Where's the nose? It's Hankins and no one. Nose is a target for us, and the type of nose I feel like we want and need is Alim and there isn't another Alim McNeill. The only other path I see is Marvin Wilson or Christian Barmore and Barmore involves us taking him at 17, which is a no thanks to me, and Wilson is a crap shoot in the 2nd to 5th range that you are silly messed over if he's sniped as there is no one else (not looking for the big body that holds the point and nothing more, although for that I like Kentucky's Quinton Bohanna who for a handful of snaps a game can do more than expected but I'm not sure his handful of snaps over the year is worth a pick above the 7th // Alim will play in a lot more situations). Barmore is more raw and peaks and valleys of play to me than Alim. Wilson was good, but regressed. Alim McNeill has displayed consistent 2 gap play at a high level and rare penetration and pocket collapsing he is athletic for a nose and his leverage is perfect fit. I would find it hard to believe your critique is about Tyson Campbell for no talent.

  I like Alim McNeill more the Zaven Collins especially for our scheme and what we've invested. Zaven Collins and Micah Parsons I like, but I really like the idea of  (mid to late) Shaka Toney at that position although I'd expect it takes him a year to develop into that. Shaka Toney is still a very good athlete even if he isn't as freakish as Parsons. JOK I view as a replacement for Cory Littleton and we've invested in Littleton and restructured him locking him in for sure. That's not where I want to put draft capital. Horn I think is a penalty machine and Farley's back is a big no thanks. Tyson Campbell is a high impact DB, and Jamar Johnson might develop into one as well. Werner is a safe projection as depth to all three LB positions, and Toney is an upside projection to SLB or depth at LEO  behind Yannick and Maxx.

  I started with McNeill as a high third, then he's moved up to a mid to early second rounder for me. Due to the nature of how he was rotated and how NTs play out in the NFL he might not project to full time role, but I see a lot more penetration and quickness from him than I ever expect for a nose. I think he legitimately can play 3-tech next to Hankins, then replace Hankins and play next to a Maurice Hurst, or Solomon Thomas. His pro day testing numbers look comparable to Javon Hargrave, who yes was later pick, but if you watch the Youtube condensed games titled something like North Carolina OL v. NC State, and then Miami OL v. NC State the impact this guy has is top talent. It's not a highlight video of wow play one after another, but basically every rep you see it go right, you rewind and it's #29. When it's bad he's subbed out or the talent surrounding him surrendered lateral movement. North Carolina is stacked offensively, and definitely isn't a cherry picked game. It's just a better than normal projection as it's two NFL backs and a future NFL QB with a lot of slipperiness in Howell. His height at like 6'1 or 6'2 or whatever it is is natural leverage and you see him squatting down in front of the center heads up and his center of gravity is extremely low and the explosion up and to punch or latch is fast and effective, he has a couple moves too I saw him duck down and slide under, swim move over and attack with his hands in addition to a bullrush. The way he two gaps is important to the scheme as well. This is a talented player, and if we did get him in the 3rd or whatever I'm all about it. I'm comfortable in the late first though, and talent tier drop  -- to me -- looks roughly where we are at 17 so a trade down to a team valuing a specific guy might give us an opportunity to get another selection. Jamar Johnson is inexperienced I agree with that, but I'm not a big fan of this safety class. Johnson has displayed more range and the ability to mess up reads than the other guys, the other one I like is Elijah Molden but he is a nickel convert and I'm not sure we'd use him right given we kept messing up Lamarcus Joyner.

Liking roughly half is a good thing, thanks.

I like the Newman pick too. I usually just comment/give feedback on the first three rounds.

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3 hours ago, lester said:

That is truly a GOD AWFUL DRAFT...just a bunch of bodies...for a team like the Raiders who are devoid of TALENT it always amazes me when fans do thesecrazytrade downs

If your going by to be that negative offer an opinion of substance, instead of just trashing it.

ESPECIALLY if you just joined the board last week lol 

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20 minutes ago, Trojan said:

I started with McNeill as a high third, then he's moved up to a mid to early second rounder for me. Due to the nature of how he was rotated and how NTs play out in the NFL he might not project to full time role, but I see a lot more penetration and quickness from him than I ever expect for a nose. I think he legitimately can play 3-tech next to Hankins, then replace Hankins and play next to a Maurice Hurst, or Solomon Thomas. His pro day testing numbers look comparable to Javon Hargrave, who yes was later pick, but if you watch the Youtube condensed games titled something like North Carolina OL v. NC State, and then Miami OL v. NC State the impact this guy has is top talent. It's not a highlight video of wow play one after another, but basically every rep you see it go right, you rewind and it's #29. When it's bad he's subbed out or the talent surrounding him surrendered lateral movement. North Carolina is stacked offensively, and definitely isn't a cherry picked game. It's just a better than normal projection as it's two NFL backs and a future NFL QB with a lot of slipperiness in Howell. His height at like 6'1 or 6'2 or whatever it is is natural leverage and you see him squatting down in front of the center heads up and his center of gravity is extremely low and the explosion up and to punch or latch is fast and effective, he has a couple moves too I saw him duck down and slide under, swim move over and attack with his hands in addition to a bullrush. The way he two gaps is important to the scheme as well. This is a talented player, and if we did get him in the 3rd or whatever I'm all about it. I'm comfortable in the late first though, and talent tier drop  -- to me -- looks roughly where we are at 17 so a trade down to a team valuing a specific guy might give us an opportunity to get another selection. Jamar Johnson is inexperienced I agree with that, but I'm not a big fan of this safety class. Johnson has displayed more range and the ability to mess up reads than the other guys, the other one I like is Elijah Molden but he is a nickel convert and I'm not sure we'd use him right given we kept messing up Lamarcus Joyner.

Liking roughly half is a good thing, thanks.

I cant nor want to pick too many holes in McNeil’s game.... he’s good there’s a lot to like.  I just personally think he’s a good starter but nothing crazy.  I want more potential from a 1st round pick.  That’s just me though.

I understand your logic... pump up depth.  I just want higher end talent even if it’s less guys.  To each his own, not saying I’m right.

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4 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

I cant nor want to pick too many holes in McNeil’s game.... he’s good there’s a lot to like.  I just personally think he’s a good starter but nothing crazy.  I want more potential from a 1st round pick.  That’s just me though.

I understand your logic... pump up depth.  I just want higher end talent even if it’s less guys.  To each his own, not saying I’m right.

Agree with you that he's a 3rd Round Run Stuffing DT. With that said, I'm sure he'll be an excellent player for that purpose. 

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5 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

If your going by to be that negative offer an opinion of substance, instead of just trashing it.

ESPECIALLY if you just joined the board last week lol 

lol..Joined last week ...so what...that draft is nothing but 2nd and mostly 3rd tier players..the Raiders are allready filled with those type of players...on fact a few wont EVEN BE DRAFTED..try watchin some college Football then you might know

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  • 2 weeks later...

The ideal, but I expect no one to be there but there's probably a path to it happening
17. Devonta Smith, WR Alabama || Falls for size concerns
48. Azeez Ojulari, SLB/LEO Georgia || If teams that address edge go Paye Phillips Rousseau Owey, then one or two teams go for a bigger body like Payton Turner or Boogie Basham then maybe he slips.
79. Alim McNeill, NT North Carolina State || If teams don't value the NT position maybe
80. Tyson Campbell, CB Georgia || If teams are higher on other DB prospects and maybe the goofy proday numbers let some guys rise above him
162 +167 + 2022 pick in trade up:  Aaron Banks, G Notre Dame || If guard isn't valued and teams keep hitting up the OT prospects with the fall back of they can be guard, and then Wyatt Davis goes ahead of him and maybe Trey Smith if teams are comfortable with his lungs then maybe. The trade up has a variable 22 pick to give more wiggle room but I was thinking 4th round is the target range for best value.  Also needs the team to be comfortable with Good/Jones-Smith/Parker can emerge with a viable RT.
121. Jevon Holland, S Oregon -- Would need teams being scared of his opt out and his nickle/S tweener traits.
200. Dayo Odeyingbo, DE Vanderbilt -- Would need teams scared of his achilles injury

QB: Derek Carr / Marcus Mariota
RB: Josh Jacobs / Kenyan Drake
WR: Devonta Smith / Bryan Edwards
WR: Henry Ruggs / Willie Snead
Slot: John Brown / Hunter Renfrow
TE: Darren Waller
LT: Kolton Miller
LG: Richie Incognito / John Simpson
OC: Andre James / Nick Martin
RG: Aaron Banks
RT: Denzelle Good/Jaryd Jones-Smith/Brandon Parker

DE: Clelin Ferrell  / Carl Nassib / Dayo Odeyingbo
NT: Alim McNeill / Johnathan Hankins
3T: Solomon Thomas / Quinton Jefferson / David Irving
LEO: Yannick Ngakoue / Maxx Crosby

SLB: Azeez Ojulari
MLB: Nick Kwiatkoski / Nicholas Marrow as reserve all over
WLB: Cory Littleton

CB: Trayvon Mullen / Isaiah Johnson
CB: Tyson Campbell / Nevin Lawson
Nickel: Damon Arnette / Amik Robertson

FS: Jevon Holland / Jeff Heath
SS: Johnathan Abram / Karl Joseph
 

Edited by Trojan
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