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The Mega Offseason Workout/OTA/Training Camp Thread


RaidersAreOne

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5 minutes ago, Geezy said:

How you gonna lift with a broken hand/wrist? 

“Arnette said he weighted 175 pounds at most last season. Now, he’s likely around his listed playing weight of 195.“

That’s a big difference. What starting corner is playing at 175LBs in the NFL?

Edited by Jeremy408
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1 minute ago, Geezy said:

How you gonna lift with a broken hand/wrist? 

Depends on the body part, extent of the injury, where the fracture is, ...   To lose twenty plus pounds it had to be in the upper body but mostly in the lower body.  Plenty of work you can do for the lower body with no hands.  Even if you are doing cardio there is work you can do that would mimic heavy lifting rather than steady state type of cardio.  He said he used bands which will help but he would still lose some mass in the upper body.  The Covid is probably what caused the most weight loss.  You get a bad case and even a 130 pound woman will lose 15-20 pounds.

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5 hours ago, drfrey13 said:

We do not have an off the ball SLB or a 3-4 LB.  WE have neither.  If they were cheap enough I would sign both.  What is so hard to understand about this concept.  Ingram is available and we were talking to him I was hoping we would sign him.  Now we were talking to Wright and even if we had signed Ingram I would want to sign him.  Ingram is a vet that will have a similar role to what we expect out of Koonce.  Wright is just a really good all around LB that can play all 3 spots and knows the system probably better than anyone else on the team.  Both players are worth signing for the right price.  Now if Wright gets a 2 year $18 million deal I will not be happy with the signing and would probably rather role with Koonce and deal with the growing pains.  See how perspectives can change when the circumstances change.  Ingram got $4 so to me that was worth it especially after finding our that Nassib is probably our #3 DE.  If there is a player for the right price that is better than what we have we should sign them.  Not a tough concept to grasp.  If you have a better idea then feel free to let us know but as it stands right now the only people we have for the position are tweener safeties, our MLB from last year, and a rookie from Buffalo.  Not really inspiring.  Kwiat might be able to do it and I brought that up a long time ago as an off the ball SLB.  Koonce may end up being a good edge player in a 3-4 role but I do not think it happens this year.  Wright can do both but is not the best in pass rush.  So you can have Wright and bring Koonce in as a situational pass rusher.  

Here is a good write up with some videos.  Bradley has a lot of different concepts for his front 7 and needs chess pieces.

https://tapedontlie.substack.com/p/gus-bradleys-fronts-and-stunts

Glad you finally seem to have grasped the concept that Bradley has a lot of different fronts, I’ve been telling you this for a while now while you seem fixated on the 4-3 under especially when you thought we would be playing it in obvious passing situations.

If we had signed Ingram for $4m as you wanted, would we have the cap to be able to sign Wright? Seems like you are just playing Madden, wanting to sign all the highly rated players with zero thought of the cap implications, anybody can do that. 

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15 hours ago, drfrey13 said:

Depends on the body part, extent of the injury, where the fracture is, ...   To lose twenty plus pounds it had to be in the upper body but mostly in the lower body.  Plenty of work you can do for the lower body with no hands.  Even if you are doing cardio there is work you can do that would mimic heavy lifting rather than steady state type of cardio.  He said he used bands which will help but he would still lose some mass in the upper body.  The Covid is probably what caused the most weight loss.  You get a bad case and even a 130 pound woman will lose 15-20 pounds.

I lost 30 pounds after wrist surgery and a lot of it was muscle/good weight. But i couldn't work out for 6 months without pain.

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21 hours ago, Jeremy408 said:

Here's the way I see it: Jeffersons the floor. Then it goes like this... 

Thomas has the highest ceiling but the lowest floor

Philon has a higher floor than Thomas but a lower ceiling

McCoy(even the 2019 version) would be exactly what we need if hes healthy and hes still the same as that 

 

 

Yeh, I'm in basic agreement with that assessment. Thomas has the highest potential but the biggest bust potential too. We know Jefferson can be average to a bit above average with the hope for a little more. Philon is a total question mark to me, dont know what to expect at all. Even a 80% McCoy would still be our best pass rushing DT since Desmond Bryant probably, sad though that is. 

I think we may be just about OK but the thing is if you're familiar with my posts at all you'll know I push for DTs in draft and FA every year 😁 so for me we've done something but not quite enough for me to really turn that position into a strength. If things work out we've turned the position into a 'not critical' but still not a strength unless all our dreams come true and 2016 Gerald McCoy turns up and Thomas absolutely rocks. 

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11 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

I lost 30 pounds after wrist surgery and a lot of it was muscle/good weight. But i couldn't work out for 6 months without pain.

For us normal people having a drop off would be normal.  We lift for fun or health.  We also do not have a multi million dollar facility built for us and staffed with some of the best professionals to keep us where we need to be.  Most of us are also not multi millionaires who need to work out as a part of our job and should be paying professionals to guide us in the offseason.  It would be a tax write-off for him.  His problem I believe came from not treating the situation like professional and the whole covid situation.

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5 minutes ago, Darbsk said:

Yeh, I'm in basic agreement with that assessment. Thomas has the highest potential but the biggest bust potential too. We know Jefferson can be average to a bit above average with the hope for a little more. Philon is a total question mark to me, dont know what to expect at all. Even a 80% McCoy would still be our best pass rushing DT since Desmond Bryant probably, sad though that is. 

I think we may be just about OK but the thing is if you're familiar with my posts at all you'll know I push for DTs in draft and FA every year 😁 so for me we've done something but not quite enough for me to really turn that position into a strength. If things work out we've turned the position into a 'not critical' but still not a strength unless all our dreams come true and 2016 Gerald McCoy turns up and Thomas absolutely rocks. 

Yeah I feel that! We haven’t really had a good defense of tackles for like 12 years.
 

My whole thing is when it comes to this year specifically is that it wasn’t a very good defense of tackle class. Also some thing that I took into account is the fact that it’s really hard to hit on 3T especially in year one. So I could at least see their strategy behind the whole thing

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14 hours ago, Dessie said:

Glad you finally seem to have grasped the concept that Bradley has a lot of different fronts, I’ve been telling you this for a while now while you seem fixated on the 4-3 under especially when you thought we would be playing it in obvious passing situations.

If we had signed Ingram for $4m as you wanted, would we have the cap to be able to sign Wright? Seems like you are just playing Madden, wanting to sign all the highly rated players with zero thought of the cap implications, anybody can do that. 

I have criticized the team for making stupid signings for years.  I actually created a post showing how if we were smart with the cap we could have played Madden and signed a bunch of high profile free agents for the same price.  I knew Bradley had a diverse front seven and have said he is missing chess pieces.  A 3-4 OLB and 4-3 SLB are two of them.  Because he is diverse does not mean you just say will we can just not use those looks because we so many others.  We will have Koonce next year to help.  That does not help this year so signing a plyer for 1 year made sense.  We could cut Richard, Dickerson, and not sign Thomas and we would have enough to sign both players if Wright is willing to take a reasonable deal.  Getting rid of those players does not hurt us.  Now since Ingram is no longer available we should go after Wright.  Playing Madden is just throwing money at whoever the big name players are.  I wanted to bring in to vets that know our system and DC that play positions we are lacking.  Both would get reasonable deals but if either wanted to break the bank I would let them walk.  Just because I say go after them does not mean give them whatever they ask.  If I said you could get Ingram for 1 year $4 million at the beginning of FA most of us would jump all over that.  If Wright is close to that number I think most in here would agree with me.  

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1 hour ago, drfrey13 said:

 

For us normal people having a drop off would be normal.  We lift for fun or health.  We also do not have a multi million dollar facility built for us and staffed with some of the best professionals to keep us where we need to be.  Most of us are also not multi millionaires who need to work out as a part of our job and should be paying professionals to guide us in the offseason.  It would be a tax write-off for him.  His problem I believe came from not treating the situation like professional and the whole covid situation.

Yeah this I agree with

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1 hour ago, drfrey13 said:

 

For us normal people having a drop off would be normal.  We lift for fun or health.  We also do not have a multi million dollar facility built for us and staffed with some of the best professionals to keep us where we need to be.  Most of us are also not multi millionaires who need to work out as a part of our job and should be paying professionals to guide us in the offseason.  It would be a tax write-off for him.  His problem I believe came from not treating the situation like professional and the whole covid situation.

He actually admitted that lol

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20 hours ago, drfrey13 said:

Depends on the body part, extent of the injury, where the fracture is, ...   To lose twenty plus pounds it had to be in the upper body but mostly in the lower body.  Plenty of work you can do for the lower body with no hands.  Even if you are doing cardio there is work you can do that would mimic heavy lifting rather than steady state type of cardio.  He said he used bands which will help but he would still lose some mass in the upper body.  The Covid is probably what caused the most weight loss.  You get a bad case and even a 130 pound woman will lose 15-20 pounds.

He could have just hired a professional nutritionist/ Chef

Edited by Bitty 2.0
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3 hours ago, Jeremy408 said:

He actually admitted that lol

It was the injury and the other circumstances.  I phrased it that way because I think those had more to do with it than the injury.  It was still a factor and you are correct that he admitted to all three in the interview you posted.

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47 minutes ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

He could have just hired a professional nutritionist/ Chef

There is plenty he could have done and did not.  That is the part I believe he was referencing when he said he did not approach like a professional.  @Jeremy408 posted an interview where he goes over what he went through.

Edited by drfrey13
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10 hours ago, Jeremy408 said:

Yeah I feel that! We haven’t really had a good defense of tackles for like 12 years.
 

My whole thing is when it comes to this year specifically is that it wasn’t a very good defense of tackle class. Also some thing that I took into account is the fact that it’s really hard to hit on 3T especially in year one. So I could at least see their strategy behind the whole thing

Yep, I can appreciate that if they really didn't have a DT rated high at any particular spot when they picked and they had other players at different positions rated higher and it wasn't a particularly outstanding class on paper. A guy I really liked was Nixon and would have drafted him but every team passed on him numerous times so it's not just us, we did draft Hall and Hurst a few years ago and I thought Hall might be something though he was way overdrafted (again) so they haven't totally ignored the position.

I just feel that DT is a position like pass rusher or QB.......if you don't have one you need to draft at least one every year until you get one, they are crucial positions. Especially as you say as they take a year or 18 months of seasoning. My plan would have been draft Nixon (or whoever we feel is the best 3T) and sign a vet like Atkins who's been there and done it that he can sit behind and learn for a year or two. That way you can let him get his feet wet without totally relying on the rookie and you can spell the vet so he doesn't get burned out. I hope a guy like Stills or Thomas can do that with McCoy but of course they are both long shots as well.

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