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NFL Snooze News: Volume Four, Por Favor


Heimdallr

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28 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

we’ve already got a pretty good slot Cb and pair of safetys.

All of who are free agents next year, therefore likely more expensive than Fitzpatrick beyond 2019, and none of them are as good as Fitzpatrick.

Save cap space, add more talent, and get younger? Not a hard decision. 

 

And i I certainly don’t understand why DB wouldn’t be a position of concern beyond this year. With Waynes, Alexander, Harris, and Kearse set to hit free agency, plus the team’s cap situation, none of them should be assumed to be back. Especially given the value of defensive backs. There are legit concerns that Rhodes is on the decline, even if it’s a slow decline. We have no idea how good Hughes really is. At this point he’s a complete unknown. And Holton Hill simply can’t be relied on. That really only leaves the team with Harrison Smith as a known commodity in the defensive backfield heading into 2020. 

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4 minutes ago, SemperFeist said:

All of who are free agents next year, therefore likely more expensive than Fitzpatrick beyond 2019, and none of them are as good as Fitzpatrick.

Save cap space, add more talent, and get younger? Not a hard decision. 

As three key starters along the OL and DL get older, more costly and potentially less effective, I don’t know if I’d sacrifice the trenches for another DB because that may be the trade off. Where does he even play this year and what kind of message does that send to Harris, Alexander and Kearse who have all played well in their roles. I don’t think the move helps us this year.

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41 minutes ago, Klomp said:

Sounds a lot like what we thought about Matt Kalil going into his second year.

Look, I'm not saying we never should pursue trades. But slam dunks are rarely actually slam dunks. This wouldn't be a sure thing. And losing draft capital does slightly concern me when we're a team closer to the back half of its championship window.

That being said, I didn't realize Fitzpatrick was only in his second year. That makes him a little more intriguing, but I still wouldn't classify the potential move as a sure thing for whoever acquires him.

Neither is the random guy picked after about pick fifty or sixty next year. 

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Just now, vikingsrule said:

As three key starters along the OL and DL get older, more costly and potentially less effective, I don’t know if I’d sacrifice the trenches for another DB because that may be the trade off. Where does he even play this year and what kind of message does that send to Harris, Alexander and Kearse who have all played well in their roles. I don’t think the move helps us this year.

What trenches are being sacrificed? 

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6 minutes ago, PrplChilPill said:

What trenches are being sacrificed? 

You’re looking at not having a first or second round pick next year. So how do you improve LT, DE and DT knowing MN is going to be in a tough cap spot. Specifically, How do you replace Griffen and maybe Reiff? And the DT spot doesn’t look great long term. How do you make these roster improvements with just one top 60 pick? Relative to the rest of the league, MN has to be in the top 5 for secondary depth. Ready to get in a bidding war to improve upon that?

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1 hour ago, Klomp said:

Sounds a lot like what we thought about Matt Kalil going into his second year.

Look, I'm not saying we never should pursue trades. But slam dunks are rarely actually slam dunks.

I didn't say Fitzpatrick was a slam dunk, or a sure thing. I said he was a better bet than a 2nd round pick next year would be. And that's true.

1 hour ago, Klomp said:

And losing draft capital does slightly concern me when we're a team closer to the back half of its championship window.

Fitzpatrick is the same age (turns 23 in November) as many of the players who'll be drafted in 2020. He's 2 months younger than Kris Boyd and 3 months older than Mike Hughes. He's nearly 18 months younger than Garrett Bradbury.

He has 3 years left on his rookie contract, for cap hits of ~$2M per year (lower than the full value of his current deal since the signing bonus would stay as dead money on the Dolphins' cap). As a first round pick, he'd be eligible for a 5th year option. Since he was the 11th overall pick, his 5th year option would be cheaper than the top 10 picks, so would likely be ~$10-11M for that 5th year (Wayne's is making $9M but the price would inflate in the intervening years). 

So the Vikings would have control over Fitzpatrick from ages 23-26 for a total of $16M/4 in 2019-22, versus a 2nd round pick of similar age (maybe a year younger) for a cost of ~$6M/4 (Irv Smith got $5.7M/4) from 2020-23. 

Given how good Fitzpatrick has been in the NFL already, and how uncertain the CB depth chart is next year, locking up a starting caliber player for that kind of money seems like a good idea. 

1 hour ago, vikesfan89 said:

I could see getting him for the best season but I wonder how much he would actually help this season unless there is a major injury. Players don't just jump into Zimmer's defense and produce especially with good talent already in place

This is a good point. I'd be excited to get him mainly because it makes it easier to figure out the DB depth chart next year, when Waynes, Alexander, Harris and Kearse all need to be extended or replaced. 

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41 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

Where does he even play this year and what kind of message does that send to Harris, Alexander and Kearse who have all played well in their roles. I don’t think the move helps us this year.

Also a fair point, and I agree that the move would mostly be for next year.

But if a team is going to give away premium talent for pennies on the dollar, I think the Vikings should at least be interested. 

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3 minutes ago, Krauser said:

Also a fair point, and I agree that the move would mostly be for next year.

But if a team is going to give away premium talent for pennies on the dollar, I think the Vikings should at least be interested. 

I’d think 90% of the league would be interested which is just going to jack up the cost. When you’ve got a top 5 secondary it just doesn’t seem like a justifiable use of resources. Spielmans trades for players have typically been to help the team now, I struggle to see a role for him right now. 

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1 hour ago, vikingsrule said:

So how do you improve LT, DE and DT knowing MN is going to be in a tough cap spot.

All of those positions are still under contract. You can draft in the mid rounds for developmental players, which the Vikings have shown a strong ability to do along the d-line. 

And you could also potentially add S, CB, and NB to that list with the addition of just one pick. So, now you’ve got LT, DT, DE, CB, S, and NB to replace/improve with 2 picks. 

One of those picks is likely going to go towards a DB anyways. Fitzpatrick is a better player than any DB you’re likely going to find between 20 and 64 in the draft. 

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2 hours ago, vikingsrule said:

You’re looking at not having a first or second round pick next year. So how do you improve LT, DE and DT knowing MN is going to be in a tough cap spot. Specifically, How do you replace Griffen and maybe Reiff? And the DT spot doesn’t look great long term. How do you make these roster improvements with just one top 60 pick? Relative to the rest of the league, MN has to be in the top 5 for secondary depth. Ready to get in a bidding war to improve upon that?

They have no depth next year in the DB field. I said I'd deal a second.... If that's not enough, I'd deal a second and one of their late picks. If that's not enough, I probably don't deal a first, because of the injury possibility of current players, and not knowing how bad all the holes are. But I consider it. 

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20 hours ago, Krauser said:

The scratch off ticket is the unknown that might pay out big. Is that supposed to be Vedvik? Or the draft pick that was used to acquire him?

Minkah Fitzpatrick is as close to a sure thing as you can get in a 2nd year player: drafted 11th overall out of Alabama, only 22 years old, played well as a rookie, no injury or off field concerns. He's a much better bet than any 2nd round pick from next year's draft will be. 

I agree completely. 

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20 hours ago, Krauser said:

Minkah Fitzpatrick is as close to a sure thing as you can get in a 2nd year player: drafted 11th overall out of Alabama, only 22 years old, played well as a rookie, no injury or off field concerns. He's a much better bet than any 2nd round pick from next year's draft will be. 

yes, probably so. and hopefully a low 2nd at that.

any disciplinary problems along the way for him? any immature acting out? would he take well to Zimmer's DB intensive coaching style?
 

does Spielman still have any connections to the MIami front office, or are his old peers long gone?

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3 hours ago, vike daddy said:

any disciplinary problems along the way for him? any immature acting out?

Not that I know of. 

Quote

would he take well to Zimmer's DB intensive coaching style?

Probably? Alabama's coverage scheme under Saban is complex, lots of parallels with Belichick. I guess that would translate fairly well to Zimmer's system. 

3 hours ago, vike daddy said:

does Spielman still have any connections to the MIami front office, or are his old peers long gone?

Long gone, I'm sure. That was 15 years ago. 

Doubt the Vikings will make much of a play for him, but it'd be great to see it happen. 

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Ian Rapoport of NFL Media also reports that a first-round pick is a must for the Dolphins in a Fitzpatrick trade, but has a rosier report in terms of Miami’s chances of landing that compensation. He reports that there’s been “real and serious” interest and that a deal could come to fruition this week.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/09/15/report-five-teams-have-shown-interest-in-minkah-fitzpatrick-trade/

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