MVP leaders at this point.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

4 minutes ago, tonyto36 said:

Do you honestly believe the Patriots run the ball better when the Eagles have

1.  More rush attempts

2.  More yards

3.  Higher team YPA

4.  Higher YPA for #1 RB.

 

Patriots had a good two week stretch running the ball for monster games against the Bills and Dolphins because those two teams played two deep safeties and blitzed the gaps to attack Brady the entire time.  They game planned to completely ignore the running game.  

Of course for people who didn't actually see the game, there is no way they could possibly know this.  

I'm just telling you what the statistics say, nothing more and nothing less. If the Patriots were crap running the ball for 12 weeks and great running the ball for 2 weeks, the statistics would reflect that. But they don't. In fact, they indicate almost the opposite.

More attempts lead to more yards so that answers your questions #1 and #2. Higher team YPA --> I think I already addressed this with the Adjusted Line Yards stat. The Patriots are a full yard ahead of the Eagles in that category. 

Higher YPA for #1 RB --> That doesn't even make sense when we're talking about run games overall lol Dion Lewis is your #1 RB and he's NUMBER ONE in DVOA for RB's and NUMBER TWO in success rate. Who is the Eagles' #1 RB? Ajayi? Can't use him because his stats span multiple teams and he's still not top 10 in any category. Blount? He's even worse.

The stats are telling a very different story than what you're telling.

 

[BLick12]

11 minutes ago, tonyto36 said:

And Gillislee, our traditional running back, you'll fail to note is running a full 2.1 YPC less than last year.  2.1 LESS.

The guys you mentioned are not traditional runners.  The Patriots have had more success with them running because they're legitimate threats in the passing game and teams play to stop Brady first.  When the defense plays the Eagles they play to stop the run.  And in spite of this humongous difference, the Eagles still rush the ball better than the Patriots.

Man, you will literally make any excuse to try and prop Brady up further.  Traditional runner, lol. They are running backs that can catch, yes, those guys exist in the NFL too.  

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

14 minutes ago, tonyto36 said:

And Gillislee, our traditional running back, you'll fail to note is running a full 2.1 YPC less than last year.  2.1 LESS.

The guys you mentioned are not traditional runners.  The Patriots have had more success with them running because they're legitimate threats in the passing game and teams play to stop Brady first.  When the defense plays the Eagles they play to stop the run.  And in spite of this humongous difference, the Eagles still rush the ball better than the Patriots.

To the red - there is no statistic that indicates this is true. If there is, can you provide it?

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

Anyone saying the Eagles set up the pass with the run hasn't watched the Eagles play. We throw a ton in the first half and run more when we are leading in the second half. 

[BLick12]

1 minute ago, Darth Pees said:

I'm just telling you what the statistics say, nothing more and nothing less. If the Patriots were crap running the ball for 12 weeks and great running the ball for 2 weeks, the statistics would reflect that. But they don't. In fact, they indicate almost the opposite.

More attempts lead to more yards so that answers your questions #1 and #2. Higher team YPA --> I think I already addressed this with the Adjusted Line Yards stat. The Patriots are a full yard ahead of the Eagles in that category. 

Higher YPA for #1 RB --> That doesn't even make sense when we're talking about run games overall lol Dion Lewis is your #1 RB and he's NUMBER ONE in DVOA for RB's and NUMBER TWO in success rate. Who is the Eagles' #1 RB? Ajayi? Can't use him because his stats span multiple teams and he's still not top 10 in any category. Blount? He's even worse.

The stats are telling a very different story than what you're telling.

 

This kid is a lost cause. 

[lancerman]

5 minutes ago, showtime said:

Tom Brady will win this award, but a part of that comes down to his biggest competitors getting hurt.  Carson Wentz would have had a prime opportunity to win MVP, but his injury kind of eliminates him.  Antonio Brown was a contender, but his injury kind of eliminates him as well.  So it's pretty much Tom Brady by default.

Brady was ahead of both of them before they got injured. Wentz was closer, but Wentz only real big differentiation was the record which he lost at the time. Brown was always an outside shot. 

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

Just now, tonyto36 said:

TOTAL RUSHES

TOTAL YARDS

YARDS PER ATTEMPT

ALL SEEM MODERATELY RELEVANT

Do you know what context is or are you just going ignorantly make claims based on bulk stats?

[showtime]

Just now, lancerman said:

Brady was ahead of both of them before they got injured. Wentz was closer, but Wentz only real big differentiation was the record which he lost at the time. Brown was always an outside shot. 

I always thought Wentz was ahead of Brady until that Eagles vs Seahawks game.  I thought Brady pulled ahead after that, but then he stunk it up on Monday Night vs the Dolphins.  Who knows how Wentz would have played down the stretch, but it's reasonable to assume he would be #1 right now.  Since he's injured, that threat is no longer there, so Brady wins and nobody is really close to him anymore.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

2 minutes ago, tonyto36 said:

TOTAL RUSHES

TOTAL YARDS

YARDS PER ATTEMPT

ALL SEEM MODERATELY RELEVANT

I'm going to try a different approach here.

Do bulk passing yards indicate a team is better at passing the ball than another team? Do bulk passing attempts indicate that?

Yards per attempt is the only fair and relevant statistic there. However, what do you have to say about all of the statistics I provided that indicate that New England is clearly better at running the ball than Philadelphia? If all you have is YPA to against about 4 other stats that I provided, I don't think you're arguing a valid point.

[BLick12]

4 minutes ago, AZ_Eaglesfan said:

Do you know what context is or are you just going ignorantly make claims based on bulk stats?

I don't think tonyto is at the age when they teach context in school yet.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

Just now, BLick12 said:

I don't think tonyto is at the age where they teach context in school yet.

Generally when your only response is a crying meme, it indicates you've lost your argument.

[lancerman]

1 minute ago, showtime said:

I always thought Wentz was ahead of Brady until that Eagles vs Seahawks game.  I thought Brady pulled ahead after that, but then he stunk it up on Monday Night vs the Dolphins.  Who knows how Wentz would have played down the stretch, but it's reasonable to assume he would be #1 right now.  Since he's injured, that threat is no longer there, so Brady wins and nobody is really close to him anymore.

Yeah I think Wentz and Brady would have been close all year and Wentz would have had a better case the last few weeks if he kept his play up. But I think it really was Wentz and Brady. Everyone else was kind of a reach. 

[Nabbs4u]

25 minutes ago, tonyto36 said:

You:

 

 

The Eagles run to set up the pass.

The Patriots pass to set up the run.

Wentz is not and has never been as good as Brady at any point this season.  His surrounding cast has been better and that's equated to the overall offensive production being closer.   And even then Brady was ahead of Wentz in pretty much every way you can be until he hurt his achilles.   Switch quarterbacks and the Patriots might not even win the division.

You really don't get it, do you? You talk about how the Patriots Pass more then the Eagles, how the Eagles Run more then the Patriots, then boast about how Brady's passing stats are greater then Wentz's? It's a$s backwards thinking.

Yes as of 3 weeks ago Tom Brady was IMO the League MVP in front of Carson Wentz. However his play since over this time frame has only strengthen Wentz's case and other players.

Acting as though a QB with 59 more completions (short passing game to RB's) and 40+ more attempts before the Steelers game shouldn't have better bulk stats is assinine.

It is possible to boast about Tom Brady's fantastic season "without" trying to discredit Carson Wentz's. Try it sometime!

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

Quote

he Patriots have had a 100 yard rusher, once this season.  Before week 12 Dolphins, the season high was 76 yards.

We've rushed for less than 100 yards SEVEN times this season.   (Eagles have only twice)

Patriots have rushed for over 120 yards in a game three times this season.  (Eagles have eight times)

Patriots have rushed 20 or less attempts in a game 5 times this season.  (Eagles only once)

All of these are just bulk stats and give no indication how "well" a team ran the ball that day. If you ran the ball 5 times for 99 yards, you just satisfied almost all of your conditions there except you had 20 YPC and anyone could tell you that you ran the ball effectively.

The stats I provided for you, courtesy of Football Outsiders, adjust for these types of scenarios. So instead of looking at bulk stats like rushing attempts and rushing yards, you get a more accurate and more in-depth and contextual look at how each team is effective in certain areas of the game.

Quote

blick was insisting on harping on YPA and how Lewis is at 5.2 which shows how good the Patriots running game while ignoring Ajayi is even higher, which is why I emphasized pointing that bit out.

That's fine, I'm not really arguing that point. Lewis on the year has a 5.2 YPC, and Ajayi in 5 games as an Eagle has 5.8 YPC, largely weighted by 1 game. I would say that is a rather inconsistent comparison, as Ajayi is one bad game, or one game at his median YPC (4.5) away from being below Lewis' season YPC.

Quote

The stats show that the Eagles rush the ball more frequently, for a greater success rate. 

Incorrect. The stats show that the Eagles rush the ball more frequently, however the Patriots have a higher success rate, as I've pointed out above using the success rate % for each RB. The Eagles don't have a RB in the top 10. Dion Lewis is #1 in success rate. It's also accounted for in Adjust Yards, 1st level yards, and 2nd level yards, as well as stuff %. The Patriots are better in every category there.

Quote

The ONLY thing you've shown to indicate otherwise is the adjusted line yards stat which is ONE singular metric.  The Eagles use the run more frequently in their offense.  Have more success with it.  And rely it on it more than the Patriots.

I just gave you about 5 statistics right above this quote. Go ahead and read up on those. The Eagles run more frequently, but the Patriots are far more successful. There is no debating that fact.

Quote

Hush.  The adults are trying to have a discussion.

You relinquished the ability to call yourself an adult in this discussion when you started responding with memes.

[BLick12]

17 minutes ago, tonyto36 said:

 

 

 

 

I'm not going to spend time responding to you when you've contributed absolutely nothing and it's clear you're incapable of having a legitimate argument with.  Other posters who have posted legitimate reasons and data to support it, as well as indicated their capable of having a rational discussion with, I've responded to appropriately.

When you act like a 12 year old and do nothing but respond with personal attacks and actively avoid every point and counter point I've made, I don't know why you're surprised when I'm not going to waste my time putting effort responding to you.   You have contributed nothing to this thread except some personal attacks and pathetic finger pointing along with some incredibly boring trolling.   

When you decide to grow up and want to join the adults table, I'd be happy to completely crush your argument [again].

I already knew it before I started responding to this thread, but at least now everyone sees that you contribute absolutely nothing of substance.  My belittling yet accurate responses to you were all in relation to you posting gifs because you have no decent argument.  But hey, keep living in your own fantasy world and shame on me for arguing with a child.