Dan Marino in 2017

[LaserFocus]

6 hours ago, Iamcanadian said:

The NFL was a run first league in Marino's prime, but the reason they never made the SB under his QBing was put simply by Jimmy Johnson, the ex HC of the SB Cowboys, who took over as HC of Miami.

The first thing Jimmy did was talk to his new QB about running the ball a lot more so they could compete for SB's, but Johnson ,just could not convince Marino to change his style of QBing for the sake of a better team. According to Johnson, almost every time he called for a running play, Marino would simply change the call at the line of scrimmage to a pass and no matter how much Jimmy tried to convince Marino that that style of play could not produce championships, Marino continue to refuse to make any changes in how he played QB.

Johnson soon retired rather than put up with Marino!!!

Marino would be great in today's game where passing completely dominates, probably far more effective than his was in his own era, but that stubbornness IMO, would still limit him even today.

I would have to listen to Marino's side of the story on this one. Jimmy Johnson had Emmitt Smith in Dallas, a far cry from what Miami had in the backfield.

[Hunter2_1]

7 hours ago, Iamcanadian said:

The NFL was a run first league in Marino's prime, but the reason they never made the SB under his QBing was put simply by Jimmy Johnson, the ex HC of the SB Cowboys, who took over as HC of Miami.

The first thing Jimmy did was talk to his new QB about running the ball a lot more so they could compete for SB's, but Johnson ,just could not convince Marino to change his style of QBing for the sake of a better team. According to Johnson, almost every time he called for a running play, Marino would simply change the call at the line of scrimmage to a pass and no matter how much Jimmy tried to convince Marino that that style of play could not produce championships, Marino continue to refuse to make any changes in how he played QB.

Johnson soon retired rather than put up with Marino!!!

Marino would be great in today's game where passing completely dominates, probably far more effective than his was in his own era, but that stubbornness IMO, would still limit him even today.

You've seen them all, where would you put Marino? What did you notice whilst watching him? 

[Livewire]

He would tear defenses apart.

[Calvert28]

Marino had a talent that would still be dominant today. That arm of his was wicked.

[tom cody]

Marino would still be a good QB in today's game. Don't know if he'd have any success in the playoffs in this era either.

[Iamcanadian]

On 10/24/2017 at 9:44 AM, Hunter2_1 said:

You've seen them all, where would you put Marino? What did you notice whilst watching him? 

He would do better in this era where passing the ball has been made much easier through rule changes. Running the ball dominated his era. Still, you have to wonder if his stubbornness would still hinder his overall success.

After hearing from Jimmy Johnson on how Marino reacted to his attempt to change the team's style of play, my admiration for Marino took a hit, because I was always really impressed by Johnson as a HC. This was a side of Marino I never realized till Jimmy spoke out.

I am a big fan of QB's who can win the big games in the playoffs, it separates the men from the boys and Marino did not get the job done. Miami was a powerhouse team when they drafted Marino, who fell all the way to them after a poor senior season. He really had 2 of the greatest HC's of that period in Shula and then Jimmy Johnson, but could not bring the bacon home, but he was fun to watch.

I had my doubts about Peyton as a championship QB, but at least he won 2 although his last one was a result of his team's defense, Marino could not even do that on a very decent football team, so I cannot ever place him among the elite QB's in the game, even if his regular season stats are impressive. It takes more than stats to rank among the best IMO.

[lionslicer]

You can watch the entire 1985 game where the Dolphins beat the 85 Bears in the regular season and see how he performs against one of the greatest defenses of all time. It's an interesting look into history being able to watch that game in it's entirely. 

I didn't start watching football regularly until 2004, but I have watched a number of Marino games via Youtube and back when NFL Network actually showed old game film. The one thing I'm always surprised when I watch Marino is generally how mediocre he is at reading defenses (at least early in his career, he got smarter later on) and generally how average his accuracy was. He could have pinpoint accuracy, and then the next play throws a ball that wildly misses the receiver. He also took chances a lot, which would lead to incompletions. But regardless, his accuracy was an issue. 

And in terms of playing in today's NFL, his lack of defensive reading ability I think would hinder him. Not to say Marino  was stupid and couldn't read defenses at all, but he would throw into double coverage a lot or completely miss open receivers because of a hole in the zone, sometimes would throw into tight coverage, etc. He was very similar to Favre in that his arm was so good, he could squeeze the ball into ridiculously tight coverage regularly, which also lead to him throwing a lot of interceptions

So taking all of this into consideration, I think he'd still be great, because he's Dan Marino, but he wouldn't put up like 6000 yards and 60 touchdowns. Not being able to read defenses well and taking chances throwing into tight coverage today would bite him in the butt more often than not today because of the complexities of defenses today. Marino wasn't as unstoppable as some people seem to think. 

[SteelKing728]

On 10/23/2017 at 7:58 AM, everlong said:

Probably no difference. He would still put up pretty numbers and ultimately fail in the playoffs.

He would just need one big run in a given year, like Rodgers did. Definitely a possibility in this hypothetical.

[Jlowe22]

Marino would certainly be capable of putting up huge numbers in Today's game.  

However, he would not have 6k yards and 60 TDs.  Just because he had 5k and 48 in 1984 doesn't mean that linearly translates to 60 and 6k.  Marino had the right personnel around him in 84 to have one of those seasons, and defenses, while being able to maul guys, had never seen an offense like that.

I believe the biggest difference, would be that his INT numbers would be lower in today's game, and passer rating would be higher.  Marino had two absurd seasons in 84 and 86, but he never really came close to those numbers nay other year.  His numbers were still impressive for that era in other years, but they weren't impressive for this era.  Guys are already consistently putting up better numbers than he did in most years, and we've already seen several seasons with better numbers than his best season, which is what I think could be translated to.  Peyton 2013 statistically is about what I think his 84 season could have been in this era.  In fact, Peyton and Marino are similar in the sense that both are excellent regular season QBs that put up large numbers, but both struggled in the postseason.

So I think Marino would have been on par statistically with the best QBs of this era, but most certainly don't think he would have left them in the dust.  Marino was not a deity.

[pheltzbahr]

Underrated aspect of his game was his footwork in the pocket, probably best pocket presence of any QB ever.  Bought him a ton of completions/stats over the course of his career.

[Tetsujin]

I was born right after Marino's 1st season NFL, and he retired my freshman year of high school. I was privileged to see almost every game he played since I was little. 

Everyone talks about the quick releasse, but he's probably the most talented passer I can recall, with great pocket mobility.

[Carmen Cygni]

I watched or attended just about every game of Marino's starting from his rookie year in the original Orange Bowl, to Joe Robbie Stadium, to Pro Player Park, to Pro Player Stadium. Best pure passer in NFL history with an uncanny ability to maneuver the pocket and was never out of a game. Marino would dominate in any era of football as his abilities would translate easily and well. Marino would absolutely be a a top notch, elite QB today especially given the pass-friendly rules. Whereas receivers were allowed to be mugged all the way down the field during Dan's tenure but he still managed to throw them open with superb accuracy. Marino's early statistical outputs were astronomical in his time and he would also be head and shoulders against his supposed peers in any era. And yes, most definitely in the modern NFL. 

I blame one particular individual for Miami's inability to win a SB during Marino's time while also pointing a finger at another legend, Shula, for his nepotism and rationalizations to keep that guy around. And that culprit was the inadequate and incompetent DC Tom Olividotti. He was an awful defensive coach and was responsible for the many postseason meltdowns of the Dolphins. The Dolphins struggles were rarely if ever about Marino, it was Miami's incompetence to stop the opposition. 

 

[Carmen Cygni]

5 hours ago, lionslicer said:

You can watch the entire 1985 game where the Dolphins beat the 85 Bears in the regular season and see how he performs against one of the greatest defenses of all time. It's an interesting look into history being able to watch that game in it's entirely. 

I didn't start watching football regularly until 2004, but I have watched a number of Marino games via Youtube and back when NFL Network actually showed old game film. The one thing I'm always surprised when I watch Marino is generally how mediocre he is at reading defenses (at least early in his career, he got smarter later on) and generally how average his accuracy was. He could have pinpoint accuracy, and then the next play throws a ball that wildly misses the receiver. He also took chances a lot, which would lead to incompletions. But regardless, his accuracy was an issue. 

And in terms of playing in today's NFL, his lack of defensive reading ability I think would hinder him. Not to say Marino  was stupid and couldn't read defenses at all, but he would throw into double coverage a lot or completely miss open receivers because of a hole in the zone, sometimes would throw into tight coverage, etc. He was very similar to Favre in that his arm was so good, he could squeeze the ball into ridiculously tight coverage regularly, which also lead to him throwing a lot of interceptions

So taking all of this into consideration, I think he'd still be great, because he's Dan Marino, but he wouldn't put up like 6000 yards and 60 touchdowns. Not being able to read defenses well and taking chances throwing into tight coverage today would bite him in the butt more often than not today because of the complexities of defenses today. Marino wasn't as unstoppable as some people seem to think. 

No dude, just no. 

[Tetsujin]

When I was 12-13 years old, we'd all play street football. And every once and awhile, the guy in college will come out and play with us, just casually moving around and gunning it to everyone. But being out there and indulging us was all a little beneath him.

That's what it was like watching Marino play.

[lionslicer]

25 minutes ago, Carmen Cygni said:

No dude, just no. 

Thanks for adding so much to the conversation. What a riveting reply. I almost had to stand up and give you an applause for such insight. I have a new outlook on football now thanks to this reply.