Mr Bad Example Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 On 7/31/2021 at 7:48 PM, thrILL! said: Seriously. The year we went 10-6 with Majik Man after years of ineptitude felt like a SB win lol. I still maintain Majkowski could've been a very good QB if he hadn't wrecked his shoulder. I was just arguing against QB wins being a stat, but I think it's fair to point out that he was 19-18-1 as a starter from 87-90; Alan Risher went 2-1 in the strike games, and everyone else they trotted out went 4-18. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 On 7/31/2021 at 9:10 AM, Isherwood said: The thing about the "all-in" discourse is that it's always assumed that by pushing your chips in, you automatically win the big one, when that's just not true. Nothing is guaranteed. I've seen more than one prominent packers blogger on twitter say about our tenuous cap situation: "well, I'll take the championship and not care about the fallout next year" - okay, that's great...still gotta win that championship. I'm old enough to remember "the dream team" Eagles. I'm old enough to remember that the Harbaugh Niners were going to be a menace for a decade. The LoB Seahawks were supposed to be more than a fart in the wind. Nothing is guaranteed in this league. There were a few years where our team overachieved based on the arm of Rodgers, to be sure. But for the most part this team has been built to be a contender that just hasn't quite made it there. It should have gone all the way in 2011, 2014, and 2020. They were the better team every one of those times and lost. They weren't without weaknesses, but no roster can be perfect. The fact is that they shot themselves in the foot when it mattered most. You can't assume that by going "all-in" you're guaranteed any better than what you got. We're about to see if that's true this coming year, because we're just about as cash strapped as you can be. One of the biggest issues is the narrative has been that we never even get close to all in and that just makes fans want it even more. There's some "logic" to it. But you're absolutely right. It's still really tough and still takes some good luck. One of my favorite fanisms is like oh of we won 1SB we could be bad for five years and I wouldn't care. Now they really believe that, I think they do. But they're just ******* wrong. They'll just keep wanting another one and expecting more after the success. It's human nature. Also losing late in the NFCC sucks but at least you feel in it for a long time often. I know it's not the end goal obviously but I'm the moments before that loss, it's a lot more intense than watching some rebuild that can only win 8 games. Here's to hoping it works, but it won't make anyone feel any better if we don't do it, but that's what they like to pretend. The whole "at least we tried" fallacy. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bad Example Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 12 hours ago, Mazrimiv said: Bigger mistake for GB passing on Badgers in the draft? Kevin King over TJ Watt or Terrell Buckley over Troy Vincent? I'm guilty of being a Badgers homer, so the moment of these two picks being announced is a toss up for the most disappointed I've been while following Packers drafts. I thought they could've had Chris Chambers over Robert Ferguson as well. I'd say King over Watt would be the more egregious error - Watt is a stud, King is just OK. Vincent was a better player than Buckley, but fun fact Buckley had more ints (50-47) and tds (8-3; 6 tds on int returns) than Vincent did in his career...Buckley wasn't good for the Packers but when you look at his career, he was productive. Chambers was a bit up-and-down but Ferguson was just terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bad Example Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 10 minutes ago, Norm said: One of my favorite fanisms is like oh of we won 1SB we could be bad for five years and I wouldn't care. Now they really believe that, I think they do. But they're just ******* wrong. They'll just keep wanting another one and expecting more after the success. It's human nature. The people who say that would be marching down Lombardi Ave with torches the second GB started out 0-1. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 1 minute ago, Mr Bad Example said: The people who say that would be marching down Lombardi Ave with torches the second GB started out 0-1. For sure. I do really believe that they actually believe their own bull**** and wouldn't be mad if we sucked after a win but they're just wrong. There's no way they could help themselves. I'll just keep blaming Tom Brady since he is the cause of everything. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 51 minutes ago, Mr Bad Example said: I still maintain Majkowski could've been a very good QB if he hadn't wrecked his shoulder. I was just arguing against QB wins being a stat, but I think it's fair to point out that he was 19-18-1 as a starter from 87-90; Alan Risher went 2-1 in the strike games, and everyone else they trotted out went 4-18. I see that one as a QB stat, but it is a less important stat to use, honestly, a lot like wins for a pitcher. If you don't get the run support, you don't win games. At the same time, if your ERA is 8.7, you probably aren't winning games either. The QB has such an impact on the game, that I have no problem with taking their W-L into consideration. At the same time, you still have to recognize it for what it is. Or we are going to have to follow that Phillip Rivers and Eli Manning are better than Troy Aikman, Len Dawson, Steve Young and Bart Starr, and that Chris Chandler and Jim McMahon are just as good as Kurt Warner, all of which is laughable IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bad Example Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 4 minutes ago, ThatJerkDave said: I see that one as a QB stat, but it is a less important stat to use, honestly, a lot like wins for a pitcher. If you don't get the run support, you don't win games. At the same time, if your ERA is 8.7, you probably aren't winning games either. The QB has such an impact on the game, that I have no problem with taking their W-L into consideration. At the same time, you still have to recognize it for what it is. Or we are going to have to follow that Phillip Rivers and Eli Manning are better than Troy Aikman, Len Dawson, Steve Young and Bart Starr, and that Chris Chandler and Jim McMahon are just as good as Kurt Warner, all of which is laughable IMO. I think in cases like Majkowski vs other GB starters from 87-90 you're truly getting an apples-to-apples comparison - he was the only thing that was really different in the games he started vs the games other people started. Which makes it a bit more valid than the situations you listed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 12 hours ago, packfanfb said: Yea I just don't think there's a sure thing in that group as a dependable starter. This is obviously going to be a different year in terms of adding player personnel. We are already "all in" so we might as well use that extra money to go overboard at a few positions. CB is a position where you don't take chances IMO. I'd be okay with King if I felt he wasn't made of paper. I absolutely get that. But looking at the CB free agents right now, doesn't seem too great. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/cornerback/available/ Most of these guys look washed up to me. Let's get a good look at what Stokes can do as an outside corner before we hit the panic button. I am still in the camp of Ka'dar, and I have only heard positive things about Kabion Ento. I think there is a spot in the league for these guys, but they have to get some PT to show that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 6 minutes ago, Mr Bad Example said: I think in cases like Majkowski vs other GB starters from 87-90 you're truly getting an apples-to-apples comparison - he was the only thing that was really different in the games he started vs the games other people started. Which makes it a bit more valid than the situations you listed. He was definitely the only thing with a pulse we had under center between Dickey and Favre. I am not sure he would have been much more than a Matt Cassel or Case Keenum though. Looking at the pro football reference similar players, and I think it fits. They also had Joey Harrington and Rick Mirer as comparisons. I think Majik was a little better than those two. None of these guys were truly abysmal, but you probably want to get better at the position. Perhaps a fully healthy Majkowski is better. But his big season still had 20 INTs, and he finished his career with 66TD:67INT. Even accounting for the less efficient offenses of the time, he would have to be more efficient than that. Sure was a fun player to watch though. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MajkDo00.htm https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/C/CassMa00.htm https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/K/KeenCa00.htm https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HarrJo00.htm https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MireRi00.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, ThatJerkDave said: He was definitely the only thing with a pulse we had under center between Dickey and Favre. I am not sure he would have been much more than a Matt Cassel or Case Keenum though. Looking at the pro football reference similar players, and I think it fits. They also had Joey Harrington and Rick Mirer as comparisons. I think Majik was a little better than those two. None of these guys were truly abysmal, but you probably want to get better at the position. Perhaps a fully healthy Majkowski is better. But his big season still had 20 INTs, and he finished his career with 66TD:67INT. Even accounting for the less efficient offenses of the time, he would have to be more efficient than that. Sure was a fun player to watch though. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MajkDo00.htm https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/C/CassMa00.htm https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/K/KeenCa00.htm https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HarrJo00.htm https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MireRi00.htm I was just a kid . Wasn't he up there in the MVP race one year, I swear my father told me that Jesus he threw way more picks than I knew. I honestly don't think I've ever watched him play a game. I'll need to find one one day just to see what he was like. Double edit: "Majkowski was selected to the Pro Bowl that season and finished second in the MVP voting that year." Edited August 2, 2021 by Norm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 58 minutes ago, Norm said: I was just a kid . Wasn't he up there in the MVP race one year, I swear my father told me that Jesus he threw way more picks than I knew. I honestly don't think I've ever watched him play a game. I'll need to find one one day just to see what he was like. Double edit: "Majkowski was selected to the Pro Bowl that season and finished second in the MVP voting that year." Yeah, it was a crazy fun year. That was where we get "Upon further review... The Bears Still Suck!" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 11 minutes ago, ThatJerkDave said: Yeah, it was a crazy fun year. That was where we get "Upon further review... The Bears Still Suck!" What was he like stylistically. Did he have a gun? Some of those guys had pop guns like Keenum and Cassel. Whereas I felt like Mirer and Harrington had the skills. It was just the rest of it. Now I'm going to look up highlights if such a thing exists. Been watching USA volleyball and drinking so it can't get any worse lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 Highlights, just highlights look a little Favreian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 Yeah it's uncanny lol. The open left hand and then ball pat. The way he turns on it. The planted foot slant throw. The back foot deep middle.. Crazy. The wreckless scramble. Maybe it's just me seeing the jersey but oh man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 Just now, Norm said: Highlights, just highlights look a little Favreian Minus the arm though. I am watching him right now, and he didn't have that absolute cannon like Favre, Elway, Cutler had. By no means was he weak, probably an average NFL arm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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