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Bobby816

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This game is exactly why I keep saying we're going to need more than just a pretty offense to win in the AFC. Not only are the Chiefs & Bills high scoring teams, they both have top-10 defenses as well. Chargers, Pats, and Bengals have high scoring offenses. They all have young QBs as well, so there is no telling how much they can build over the next couple of years. Hopefully we can build a defense that can contain them as our offense grows.  

 

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34 minutes ago, rickyt31 said:

This game is exactly why I keep saying we're going to need more than just a pretty offense to win in the AFC. Not only are the Chiefs & Bills high scoring teams, they both have top-10 defenses as well. Chargers, Pats, and Bengals have high scoring offenses. They all have young QBs as well, so there is no telling how much they can build over the next couple of years. Hopefully we can build a defense that can contain them as our offense grows.  

 

Well…

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3 hours ago, rickyt31 said:

This game is exactly why I keep saying we're going to need more than just a pretty offense to win in the AFC. Not only are the Chiefs & Bills high scoring teams, they both have top-10 defenses as well. Chargers, Pats, and Bengals have high scoring offenses. They all have young QBs as well, so there is no telling how much they can build over the next couple of years. Hopefully we can build a defense that can contain them as our offense grows.  

 

Hate to break it to you… but you’re not containing those offenses. Even if we upgrade the D big time. We need to try and score with them to be in that league. There won’t ever be a day where we can win games low scoring against the KCs, BUF, CIN, etc. So we better plan on getting offense to even be in games if we want to be a competitive playoff team.

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19 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Hate to break it to you… but you’re not containing those offenses. Even if we upgrade the D big time. We need to try and score with them to be in that league. There won’t ever be a day where we can win games low scoring against the KCs, BUF, CIN, etc. So we better plan on getting offense to even be in games if we want to be a competitive playoff team.

It takes both sides. Contain doesn't mean shut down. It's stopping them from scoring 40+ points so Wilson isn't asked to score 50+ to win. I'm probably the only one in here who watched the Saints miss the playoffs a lot although Brees was killing it. So yes, offense is important but we're not going far unless the defense is in the top-10 as well. 

Look at how not having a defense worked for the Chargers this season. 

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26 minutes ago, rickyt31 said:

It takes both sides. Contain doesn't mean shut down. It's stopping them from scoring 40+ points so Wilson isn't asked to score 50+ to win. I'm probably the only one in here who watched the Saints miss the playoffs a lot although Brees was killing it. So yes, offense is important but we're not going far unless the defense is in the top-10 as well. 

Look at how not having a defense worked for the Chargers this season. 

Look how having the #1 defense did for BUF? They just lost giving up 42 points. Bc a lot of these good teams you can hope to contain and get key stops on. But you’re surely not stopping them all together. So you have to keep up with them point wise. We’re never going to be able to keep these top teams low scoring, even if we invest heavily on defense. We can try and score with them though, if we invest on the offense. 

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1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

Gabriel Davis with 250yds and 5 TDs in 2 playoff games. Wasn’t it you @KingOfNewYorkwho said he isn’t exactly a good weapon? Or that I wouldn’t think he’s a good option if he was a Jet? False if you remembered I actually really liked Davis in that draft. Mocked him to us I believe a couple times.

That’s not what I said. I said if I mentioned Gabriel Davis and everyone not named Diggs as weapons you’d say they weren’t. One game isn’t going to change that or create a narrative. It actually proves my point further that you can find receivers all over the draft and if your QB, Line and OC are worth anything they’ll make it work.

Nice try tho. 

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5 hours ago, rickyt31 said:

This game is exactly why I keep saying we're going to need more than just a pretty offense to win in the AFC. Not only are the Chiefs & Bills high scoring teams, they both have top-10 defenses as well. Chargers, Pats, and Bengals have high scoring offenses. They all have young QBs as well, so there is no telling how much they can build over the next couple of years. Hopefully we can build a defense that can contain them as our offense grows.  

 

Yup, we’ll continue to underrate the need for a quality defense all to score 35 and lose. 

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3 hours ago, KingOfNewYork said:

That’s not what I said. I said if I mentioned Gabriel Davis and everyone not named Diggs as weapons you’d say they weren’t. One game isn’t going to change that or create a narrative. It actually proves my point further that you can find receivers all over the draft and if your QB, Line and OC are worth anything they’ll make it work.

Nice try tho. 

Except we don't have a proven QB, LIne or OC. So we need the help. When we have a great OL, a franchise QB that can throw and pass and a star OC we can talk about not needing to have as many weapons.

I understand your point, I don't argue it. Its just flawed in that your using established QBs as the example. Take Pringle for KC for example... you put him on the Jets and he's fighting for a roster spot bc he doesn't have a QB making him look better. We don't have a QB, OC or other weapons to make guys like that look legit. 

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4 hours ago, KingOfNewYork said:

Yup, we’ll continue to underrate the need for a quality defense all to score 35 and lose. 

Looking at regular season rankings…turnovers and sacks seem to be more important than total defense.  Cincy gets pressure and forced 3 TOs.  SF relies on its DL to generate pressure. Chiefs don’t have a great defense but gets TOs.  Bills have a great defense and get TOs. Dallas won in the regular season by getting a ton of TOs.

 

We need an edge and LB badly then we need another weapon at WR and need a TE. Should be a simple for us, we’ll see how long it takes though. 
 

TE, S in FA, DE, OL, WR, LB with our first 4 picks. Every other pick you bring in your guys to compete (like how they did with CB). 

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6 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Look how having the #1 defense did for BUF? They just lost giving up 42 points

Mahomes had 190 yds and 1 TD pass late in the 4th Q.  Buffalo's D contained him until they fell apart.  The Jets D falls apart on the opening kickoff.  SF beat GB because of their D and ST.  You can say the same about the Bengals.  Maybe the old adage that offense wins games and defense wins championships still holds true.

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26 minutes ago, jetsfan4life51 said:

TE, S in FA, DE, OL, WR, LB with our first 4 picks. Every other pick you bring in your guys to compete (like how they did with CB). 

I can get on board with that.  Although I think JD targets RG in FA making OL less of a high pick need.  Of course, this all depends on Becton.  I'd also like to see a TE like McBride in round 2.  So, TE, S, RG in FA and DE, WR, TE, LB with the first 4.

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47 minutes ago, xrade said:

Mahomes had 190 yds and 1 TD pass late in the 4th Q.  Buffalo's D contained him until they fell apart.  The Jets D falls apart on the opening kickoff.  SF beat GB because of their D and ST.  You can say the same about the Bengals.  Maybe the old adage that offense wins games and defense wins championships still holds true.

All 4 of the teams left in the playoffs are top 13 offenses

3. KC

7. SF

9. LAR

13. CIN

 

Looking at Defenses...

SF is the only team left with a great defense. They rank 3rd.

But let's dive into the other teams left...

LAR: 17th best

CIN: 18th best

KC: 27th best

 

So all 4 teams left have top 13 offenses (3 top 10)

When 3 of the 4 teams left are in the bottom half of the league in defense. KC sitting as the 6th worst in the whole NFL.

 

So it's safe to say Offense wins. Yes you need timely defensive plays and have a bend don't break mentality But it stands true that offense wins in this league.

 

I'm not at all saying we should only focus on the offense bc the defense needs work. But if there's a side of the ball we should focus on more its offense. We cant keep playing checkers when the rest of the league is playing Chess. JD has addressed this and that's why I have confidence in him this offseason. He's spent a lot of our valuable picks on offense. And I think he continues to do that. I've said that I'd like a split with our top picks. Use 1/2 the 1st rounders on each side of the ball. Use 1/2 the 2nd rounders on each side of the ball. I'm not saying draft only offense with the valuable picks. But as I'll continue to say... making sure Wilson has the best chance to be a franchise QB for us is the main focus of this team. Getting a star edge, 2 LBs, 2 Ss, and a CB doesn't make Wilson's odds of being a franchise QB any better. No fan base should know this more than us. We took a rookie QB and 2nd year QB to back to back AFCCG led by defense. He had weapons, but not elite ones but it was enough to win enough to make a run (remember we barely made the playoffs each year). We got tricked into thinking he was legit, when we all knew we weren't winning bc of Sanchez. Let his weapons go, and we tanked again.

 

Just look at the skill around the QBs left in the playoffs.... Kupp, OBJ, (Woods if he wasn't injured), Jefferson, Akers, Kittle, Samuel, Aiyuk, Mitchell, Kelce, Hill, Chase, Mixon, Higgins, Boyd.

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You need to find the right balance. You likely won’t win in the playoffs with the 27th ranked defense unless you have a top 3 offense in the league.

That said, I still think the primary focus right now should be building the offense, given the investment we have made in Wilson. If he doesn’t succeed, we are more than likely looking at another decade of this.

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3 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Except we don't have a proven QB, LIne or OC. So we need the help. When we have a great OL, a franchise QB that can throw and pass and a star OC we can talk about not needing to have as many weapons.

I understand your point, I don't argue it. Its just flawed in that your using established QBs as the example. Take Pringle for KC for example... you put him on the Jets and he's fighting for a roster spot bc he doesn't have a QB making him look better. We don't have a QB, OC or other weapons to make guys like that look legit. 

Those Quarterbacks do not come in established. They develop and build up chemistry and hopefully become great or they dont but these guys dont just come in and be great, receivers, QBs, none of them. 

I'm not saying throw scraps out there for our Quarterback but I do think there's this overblown narrative around weapons for a Quarterback when Allen's more productive receiver wasn't the All-Pro they traded for a 1st rounder for but his 4th round pick from a couple years ago. And on the other side it wasn't a 1st or even 2nd round pick that, not even 3rd or 4th but a 5th round pick that carries that team at the skill position. 

If Zach is only going to be good because he has the best weapons then he's never gonna be great because they moment those guys are incapable of carrying him then we are back to square one. That's why no matter what they put around a Jimmy G or Tannehill  you'll still be questioning whether you have a guy or not. 

LaFleur showed that no matter who he has out there he'll find a way to create opportunities to make plays, which is all you want from your OC. Zach did the same and kept us in games late in the season without his 3 best targets down the stretch and no tight end and barely any running game. That says so much more to me than throwing to Chase and Diggs. That tells me that when Davis and Moore return and we do a bit more upgrading up front that we just might have something on offense. 

Sorry for the tangent. 

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