2021 Week Two GDT Steelers vs Da Raiders!

[warfelg]

1 minute ago, Dcash4 said:

I just did it, and well, its not pretty. 

It's more of an L from week to week. He attacks one sideline and then its a straight line across from sideline to sideline across the 10 yard mark. 

It's also interesting because if you look at his overall year chart, he has an above average QB rating when targeting the middle of the field at all levels. Obviously smaller sample size, but it's not like thats a deadzone where good footballs go to die. 

So this is where it gets interesting:

it’s not personnel. Pat and Ebron can dominate there. 
it’s not play calling because Pat and Ebron were open there plenty. 
it’s not the opposing defense strength because guys got open and they are jamming the box. 
 

it’s the QB not even trying it. Ben is tying one arm of the offense behind its back and not letting it make a fist with the other hand. We’re literally trying to slap our way out of a gun fight. 

[Dcash4]

11 minutes ago, warfelg said:

So this is where it gets interesting:

it’s not personnel. Pat and Ebron can dominate there. 
it’s not play calling because Pat and Ebron were open there plenty. 
it’s not the opposing defense strength because guys got open and they are jamming the box. 

it’s the QB not even trying it. Ben is tying one arm of the offense behind its back and not letting it make a fist with the other hand. We’re literally trying to slap our way out of a gun fight. 

I'll definitely raise my hand and say I thought he would be different this year. Physically, I don't think he is an issue -- I maintain that from last year. I thought, by everything he said and the action of taking a paycut, that he would accept Canada a the playcaller and follow suit. We even SAW it in that third pre-season game. Through 2 actual games, you couldn't tell the difference between Canada and Fichtner because, well, Ben. 

I gotta take a break from them early in this week. I'm still really heated that they are literally FAKING MOTION. I can't get over that. Just out there checking a box to say, yup! We do motion!

[warfelg]

3 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

I'll definitely raise my hand and say I thought he would be different this year. Physically, I don't think he is an issue -- I maintain that from last year. I thought, by everything he said and the action of taking a paycut, that he would accept Canada a the playcaller and follow suit. We even SAW it in that third pre-season game. Through 2 actual games, you couldn't tell the difference between Canada and Fichtner because, well, Ben. 

I gotta take a break from them early in this week. I'm still really heated that they are literally FAKING MOTION. I can't get over that. Just out there checking a box to say, yup! We do motion!

Yup yup yup. And I am gonna pound my chest a little (not at you but in general) over nailing this. 
 

This next part is an in general thing, not directed at you:

But I do tend to have a good track record. And every offseason people bring the heat on my takes. Just look at my 5 up/5 down thread post about the direction of the offense. I don’t pull this stuff out of no where. I research. Most the time I just don’t care to post it because I know others will ignore it. Too many Steeler fans yearn for nostalgia and fear the future and change. 
 

Now….do I love Harris as the RB? Yes. Do I think we should have gone to the top 10 for Fields. I’m more and more confident in that. 

[Dcash4]

2 minutes ago, warfelg said:

Yup yup yup. And I am gonna pound my chest a little (not at you but in general) over nailing this. 
 

This next part is an in general thing, not directed at you:

But I do tend to have a good track record. And every offseason people bring the heat on my takes. Just look at my 5 up/5 down thread post about the direction of the offense. I don’t pull this stuff out of no where. I research. Most the time I just don’t care to post it because I know others will ignore it. Too many Steeler fans yearn for nostalgia and fear the future and change. 
 

Now….do I love Harris as the RB? Yes. Do I think we should have gone to the top 10 for Fields. I’m more and more confident in that. 

Hey I research too! 😎

I thought this year would be different because we saw this before w/ Haley. They neutered Ben's decision making and he became a far more efficient QB. We saw the actions they took before Ben committed, we saw the pay reduction, we heard about the offense design in the offseason and we saw it in camp/pre-season......and then we get to the first two games and.....it's gone. They either don't have buy in from Ben or Canada isn't going to stand up to him like Haley did. 

And considering that Canada was out of football completely 2 years ago and this is his first NFL gig -- he very honestly might be laying down to the franchise QB too much because he doesn't want to get into a turf war. 

[warfelg]

Also who’s call was it to throw down 9 with :20 left that got Johnson hurt?

[CKSteeler]

11 hours ago, Dcash4 said:

I know your a Big Ben burner account, but please recognize the issue that continually carries over. Ever seen a Matt Canada offense? This isn’t it. 

It looks like the same offense they've been running since Todd Haley was hired by Mike Tomlin a decade ago. You know, the whole lack of play-action and avoiding the middle of the field? That all started well before Fitchner and well before it was supposedly Ben's offense.

11 hours ago, Dcash4 said:

You do get that’s the easiest out he can give, right?

What answer would you like him to give? Because the second he offers anymore insight, he's supposedly angry at his offensive coordinator. He was specifically asked if he was running the no-huddle on their one successful scoring drive of the first half and said no, and you turned that into Ben throwing Canada under the bus.

 

11 hours ago, Dcash4 said:

 

But I’m sure that’s a Tomlin issue too. 39 year old 18 year bet ben wouldn’t have any say in that. 

I mean, yes it is a Tomlin issue. He gives his vets vet days off every week, and people only focus on Ben because it fits their narrative. The standard is the standard.

Mike Tomlin is the guy in charge of the entire ship. If Ben refuses to change, it's on the head coach to force him to change. Not the first year offensive coordinator. So either Tomlin is avoiding those battles himself, or those battles aren't happening because Mike Tomlin has his own preferences for the offense.

Like I said above, most of the things people complain about with this offense predate Fitchner by years. Todd Haley is the one who took the middle of the field out of the offense. Todd Haley is the one who turned every deep shot into a go route. Todd Haley removed the play-action. The only thing that's really changed over the last two years is we've seen even more passes at or behind the line of scrimmage and within two or three yards of it. Mostly to compensate for awful OL play.

I'm not happy with the offense or Ben's play. This isn't what they promised all off-season and I was complaining about the team avoiding the middle of the field before you were even posting here because as I've stated - those are problems that go back three offensive coordinators now. I was complaining about the lack of play action and easy designed throws way before you.

[warfelg]

 

[Totty]

1 hour ago, warfelg said:

Also who’s call was it to throw down 9 with :20 left that got Johnson hurt?

First, I want to say good game to you guys.  I really hope Alualu and Johnson are okay.  Even if Alualu is looking like a season ender.  You guys have some great pieces on defense that had our hole forum concerned.  Carr is on another level RN and we are bound to call off this could at some point.  

That said, I didn't understand that call either brother.  For me, if I am a Steelers fan, THAT is the most concerning thing going forward.  There were fans in the crowd (Steeler and Raider fans) asking the same thing.  I was stunned.  I mean this in no way derogatorily when I say with that score and that amount of time left, your players shouldn't have been put at risk like that.  

I hope you guys finish strong.  Cheers!

[Dcash4]

38 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

It looks like the same offense they've been running since Todd Haley was hired by Mike Tomlin a decade ago. You know, the whole lack of play-action and avoiding the middle of the field? That all started well before Fitchner and well before it was supposedly Ben's offense

Strange…there’s one constant in all this…

(incoming Tomlin comment) 

Can you seriously just admit that ben has SOME level of blame on the schematic outcome we see on Sundays? Jesus, the entire thing isn’t Tomlins fault. He absolutely wears blame - and it can be a lot. But two things can be true at the same time: Ben can be the one pulling the trigger on a decade worth of inept concepts offensively and Tomlin can be allowing it. 

Like the practice thing: yea, it can be Tomlins fault for doing it (I’m a literal broken record on this every season) but the guy who supposedly wears all the blame to the press not standing up and saying “coach I gotta get more reps” is also to blame. 

You say you have been complaining about this long before me. Well, congratulations on being selectively blind for all these years.

54 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

and people only focus on Ben because it fits their narrative.

I’d love for tou to describe my narrative. Change the word “Ben” to “tomlin” and you have yourself described pretty well. 

[warfelg]

9 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

Like the practice thing: yea, it can be Tomlins fault for doing it (I’m a literal broken record on this every season) but the guy who supposedly wears all the blame to the press not standing up and saying “coach I gotta get more reps” is also to blame. 

It’s interesting and this is why I want Tomlin to outlast Ben. I wanna see what happens with a young QB. Because generally Wednesday is where you work your bread and butter plays. Thursday is install gameplan. Friday is work on wrinkles. Saturday is travel/walkthrough. So not only is Tomlin saying Ben doesn’t need the bread and butter but Ben is saying he doesn’t need it either. 
 

So I want to see Tomlin with a young QB (that’s good. Not Mason) who practices every day and puts in the fundamentals. Someone who won’t miss what Orlovski is talking about there. 

[warfelg]

 

[Steeler Hitman]

14 hours ago, warfelg said:

Because for a while we’ve used his type that way. It’s not Chases fault. It’s the gameplan.

also Ben hasn’t taken one shot more than 10 yards down field in the middle since pre-elbow surgery. Huge issue. 

One area that I will agree with your criticism of Big Ben. No intermediate passing attack. I don't think it is arm strength or whatever. Is it confidence or lack thereof? 

[warfelg]

1 hour ago, Steeler Hitman said:

One area that I will agree with your criticism of Big Ben. No intermediate passing attack. I don't think it is arm strength or whatever. Is it confidence or lack thereof? 

I think it’s that, and my own theory: It looks like he lost his touch. His passes are either lollipoped or Rockets. His intermediate ball used to be elite. It’s just not there since the surgery. I wouldn’t be shocked to learn he lost some feeling. 

[Dcash4]

2 hours ago, warfelg said:

It’s interesting and this is why I want Tomlin to outlast Ben. I wanna see what happens with a young QB. Because generally Wednesday is where you work your bread and butter plays. Thursday is install gameplan. Friday is work on wrinkles. Saturday is travel/walkthrough. So not only is Tomlin saying Ben doesn’t need the bread and butter but Ben is saying he doesn’t need it either. 

From my experience and the stuff I read, those are backwards. Day 1 is install and large block play (1st and second down), days 2 and 3 are more specific to situational football (3rd down, 2 minute, 4 minute, and redzone). 

The Steelers could very well flip them, I don't know that for sure, but my knowledge is that Ben is missing the more vital of days....which is why I hammer this yearly when we look like we just run the same things over and over again. Because if he is missing install....then we probably are just staying the same week to week instead of introducing new features that your QB1 isn't getting reps on. 

Day 1 of practice on a week was always install for me. It's when you set up and learn how that defense will play you. How the line will hunt. Who are your keys. What type of sight adjustments you need to make based on coverages. What plays you will run to counter, etc. If your QB1 is missing that day WEEKLY....goodnight. 

I just think about it every time Ben and Diontea are not on the same page. DJ reads one thing, Ben reads another. I always wonder if DJ and Mason would be on the same page because they got early week reps. Take a day off in the NFL, there just are not enough reps to get you through every progression and every option of every concept. So if Ben is missing that in the week and getting it on Sunday...it's too late. Sunday isn't a "teaching" day. 

The Steelers very well could do things different, but from my experience they would be doing things backwards. I would be less mad at this though, if Ben was missing install - which IMO is the most valuable and vital day. 

Just random articles where I looked up to see if there was a general schedule: One, two, three, four. Again, these don't need to be uniform team to team, so the Steelers could be different. I just think that would be weird. 

That's a random aside that goes back to my hatred of his off-day....but I agree with you. I'd like to see what someone a little more dedicated to the weekly grind would look like. I would at least believe we could evolve. We won't as we are right now. And I will never understand why Tomlin or Ben don't stand up and say, hey this isn't working. 

[August4th]