EDGE rushers

[YogiBiz]

4 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

I think most mocks had him in that 11-20 range for the most part.

It wasn’t until the combine or senior bowl where the media forgot about him. 

[CWood21]

13 hours ago, Ozzy said:

The fear with George is turning out like Bjoern Werner, similar size and athletic profile potentially, Similar production yet Werner was better especially that final season by far.  Total in three years for both.

That might be one of the worst player comparisons I've ever seen.  Werner was a mediocre athlete with limited bend.  Karlaftis is significantly more explosive, and significantly more bendy.

[CWood21]

4 hours ago, jrry32 said:

I think Karlaftis can be an impact player. He won't be in that elite tier of impact rushers, but he can certainly be in the good/very good tier. I really think people underestimate just how impressive his power is for a 20 year old. This is a dude who isn't physically maxed out. When you combine that power with his explosive get-off and his technical prowess/savvy at his young age, I think it speaks of good things.

This.  The power part of the game is usually the last part of his game to develop.

[nicfre2011]

Just now, CWood21 said:

This.  The power part of the game is usually the last part of his game to develop.

I would certainly like to see him end up with the Chiefs via trade-up if we can't get to Jermaine Johnson.

[CWood21]

3 hours ago, Ozzy said:

Good quote and honestly very solid time for Karlaftis, super cool he ran outside shirtless showed off some toughness in the cooler weather as well.  Good showing for sure, I thought he would be more in the 4.8 range but no shocker he is not a 4.5 guy.  

Did you really expect a 4.5 40 time?  There was ONE this year (Amare Barno) amongst the EDGE prospects this year.  I believe among the LBers, the only ones were sub-250 pounds.  Karlaftis wasn't running a sub-4.5 40.  4.6 would have been ideal, 4.7 is pretty damn good. 

[jrry32]

1 hour ago, jrry32 said:

This is wrong again. I'll respond to this later with examples.

Let's look at the Iowa game:

1:24 - Wins with a speed rush, dips the shoulder, and chops down on the OT's arm

1:41 - Wins with bull rush and inside hands

2:21 - Starts with a speed rush (I can't tell what move he used due to the camera angle) and then counters to a long arm and a bull rush (I think he actually made a mistake squaring up. Should have continued to run the arc and used a long arm to soften the edge. If there's a weakness he has right now in his rush plans, it's being too impatient with his finesse rushes.)

2:31 - Wins with a long arm and a bull rush

2:42 - Wins with agility and an inside move

3:23 - Wins the corner with his get-off and a quick punch to put the OT on his heels and then a quick swat

3:44 - Uses an inside move and a club, but the OT has help inside

3:57 - Uses a spin move, but the double team neutralizes him

4:23 - Beats the OT with a quick swim and then swats the TE away

5:19 - Wins with a pure speed rush and then gets skinny through the HB/OT double team

6:15 - Wins with a speed rush; works his hands early to get the OT's hands off of him and then finishes with a club and rip to win the corner

6:49 - Goes back to the bull rush but is neutralized by a triple team

6:59 - Wins the corner again with speed and a club move 

7:51 - Wins the corner with nifty hand work and then a club to rip move

8:16 - Explodes off the ball, hand fights with the OT, gets the long arm into him, and then bulls him back into the QB's face before being blindsided by the OG coming to help

8:42 - Uses his speed to attack the edge and a long arm to soften the corner

I think this adequately shows how varied his approach is and the number of different moves he has.

Edited March 30, 2022 by jrry32

[CWood21]

1 hour ago, jebrick said:

I think explosiveness ( measured in VJ and BJ)  are the key for any edge rusher.  You can have explosiveness and fail in the NFL but there are no players without the explosive jump/first step who are even JAG edge rushers.  Karlaftis is explosive enough.  People might worry that he is maxed out and that is fair.

He doesn't even turn 21 for a few more days.  Get out of here with the notion that he's maxed out.

 

[CWood21]

10 minutes ago, nicfre2011 said:

I would certainly like to see him end up with the Chiefs via trade-up if we can't get to Jermaine Johnson.

Get in line.  He's a Packer if he's on the board at 22 IMO.

[lark25]

11 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Did you really expect a 4.5 40 time?  There was ONE this year (Amare Barno) amongst the EDGE prospects this year.  I believe among the LBers, the only ones were sub-250 pounds.  Karlaftis wasn't running a sub-4.5 40.  4.6 would have been ideal, 4.7 is pretty damn good. 

Barno is also 20lbs lighter and had a worse vert. That said, running a 4.36 at his size is still utterly insane.

I believe the only LB in the 250 range to run a 4.5 was Leo Chenal who is also massively underrated.

Most speed linebackers are in the 230s, which is fine but you can't expect a 266lb dude to run a 4.4 or 4.5 like the lbs 30lbs lighter!

[.Buzz]

 

[Ozzy]

6 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

Let's look at the Iowa game:

1:24 - Wins with a speed rush, dips the shoulder, and chops down on the OT's arm

1:41 - Wins with bull rush and inside hands

2:21 - Starts with a speed rush (I can't tell what move he used due to the camera angle) and then counters to a long arm and a bull rush (I think he actually made a mistake squaring up. Should have continued to run the arc and used a long arm to soften the edge. If there's a weakness he has right now in his rush plans, it's being too impatient with his finesse rushes.)

2:31 - Wins with a long arm and a bull rush

2:42 - Wins with agility and an inside move

3:23 - Wins the corner with his get-off and a quick punch to put the OT on his heels and then a quick swat

3:44 - Uses an inside move and a club, but the OT has help inside

3:57 - Uses a spin move, but the double team neutralizes him

4:23 - Beats the OT with a quick swim and then swats the TE away

5:19 - Wins with a pure speed rush and then gets skinny through the HB/OT double team

6:15 - Wins with a speed rush; works his hands early to get the OT's hands off of him and then finishes with a club and rip to win the corner

6:49 - Goes back to the bull rush but is neutralized by a triple team

6:59 - Wins the corner again with speed and a club move 

7:51 - Wins the corner with nifty hand work and then a club to rip move

8:16 - Explodes off the ball, hand fights with the OT, gets the long arm into him, and then bulls him back into the QB's face before being blindsided by the OG coming to help

8:42 - Uses his speed to attack the edge and a long arm to soften the corner

I think this adequately shows how varied his approach is and then number of different moves he has.

Isn't this arguably the best game he played all season?  Granted it is against a Iowa team with no real good experience OTs what so ever, if anything pretty suspect OTs on Iowa last year, Mason Richman has potential to be good but was pretty raw this year and inexperienced.

Good game by him with a ton of QB pressures, did have some issues though and most were with his lack of length.  And in space he is pretty questionable so I really doubt he could be a drop in coverage 3/4 OLB.  

 

:49 tries to bull rush and gets pushed to the ground

1:03 got cut and taken out of the play

1:10 got walled off and ran straight at for decent yardage

3:57 tries two spin moves in a row that totally get stoned

4:04 tries to go out wide, comes back into the play and does not have the length to make the tackle or affect the ball carrier.  

4:53 has a decent swim move gets penetration but then lacks the length to make the play and the tackle

5:19 gets good penetration but lacks the length to make the sack

8:00 just gets pushed out of the way completely

 

In the clips they say he does MMA training to work on his hands, quick hands sure seemingly but still it seems he gets penetration with quickness off the ball.  Sure he can smack around inexperienced weaker tackles but against Ohio State that does not work nearly as well and those two tackles are NFL players and both could be 1st round picks.  So yeah his hand usage is not nearly as effective against them.  They lock onto him and he does not get off them, so there is something to be said with who is he doing it against.  Looks like two different players, what he was against Ohio State and what he was vs Iowa.  All these amazing moves you claim he has do not really work against Ohio State so are they really successful moves if it greatly depends on who you are playing?  

 

If he is this amazing athlete shouldn't he be throwing dudes around like rag dolls?  Not to mention playing great against great competition?  

[Ozzy]

3 minutes ago, .Buzz said:

 

Wow, the first post in like what 40 posts that is not about George freaking Karlaftis, thank you.  And yes nice to have that type of athletic ability not to mention arm reach to make the play.  

[.Buzz]

Just now, Ozzy said:

Wow, the first post in like what 40 posts that is not about George freaking Karlaftis, thank you.  And yes nice to have that type of athletic ability not to mention arm reach to make the play.  

Just been digging in on him more lately with the smoke of him going top 2-3. 

[jrry32]

6 minutes ago, Ozzy said:

All these amazing moves you claim he has do not really work against Ohio State so are they really successful moves if it greatly depends on who you are playing?  

Sigh. I regret responding to you at all. Enjoy your night.

[Ozzy]

2 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

Sigh. I regret responding to you at all. Enjoy your night.

Pretend all you want he plays amazing against Ohio State.  He barely does anything in that game and the OTs who are actually talented, lock onto him and more often than not he cannot get away from the block or get free.  But pretend all you want he gets off the block with his great hand usage against them and is exactly the same as he was vs Iowa which was clearly weaker up front competition.  

Length engulfs him just like it did against Faalele, no tackles have length or strength in the NFL though.  The dude has some limitations and is not nearly as clean and perfect of a prospect as you make him out to be.  You see what you want to see and disregard everything else apparently.