Jump to content

SNF: KC @ BAL


Who wins?  

9 members have voted

  1. 1. Who wins?

    • Chiefs
      6
    • Ravens
      3

This poll is closed to new votes

  • Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.
  • Poll closed on 09/20/2021 at 12:30 AM

Recommended Posts

3 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

How do they get grades if they're not grading players?!

Don't you get it, man? The instant analysis doesn't mean anything, PFF just throws it out there to trick everyone into thinking that they don't know what they're talking about. Then later, when the All 22 comes out, they dedicate 6 men to each game and get the grades correct. Fooled ya!

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

Im admitting there is no benefit for their company.

Thats what DVOA is for. Gotta use all these resources in conjunction. 

There's no individual dvoa though. Right? 

Like I will usually know that yeah Patrick Peterson covered #1s and Tramon at ARI was dime/nickel but when GB signed him back again, Tramon had a much higher grade and people lost their minds because they are stupid and can't think that far. PFF is fine for people who aren't morons I guess maybe it's my point lol. 

Every after GB grade someone will post the top 5 highest and usually, it seems, 3 make sense and two in like lol wut. Because it's some role player or like Love in garbage time. Now maybe their methodology makes sense there. The way they do it. But when every SNF game they rank dudes and crap, it's like oh no people think those things are real true grades like who's the best at Madden or some ****. 

Wait nevermind, Madden uses that now too and the top downloaded roster is from a pff dude (which isn't bad honestly but yeah)

I don't hate PFF I just hate you for loving it (kidding obviously)

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Matts4313 said:

They get paid for their opinion on football players after doing extensive film study. They employee former football players, coaches and scouts. 

They are, by very definition, experts.

They admit to this fact. They attempt to get all obtainable information on play call and design. 

Obviously they are not perfect, but that doesnt invalidate their opinion. Football is off-script often, so its not a leap to assume a player should be able to adjust their decision making on the fly. 

 

No, they watch broadcasts while having zero idea of what schemes or plays were called. They are no more of an expert than you or I watching the Skycam on ESPN3.

It doesn't invalidate their opinion and I didn't say it did. But it remains merely an opinion and one that is not particularly more well-informed than the average viewer.

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Norm said:

I don't hate PFF I just hate you for loving it (kidding obviously)

 

Love seems a little strong. Its more that I use them along with other tools to form an opinion. 

4 minutes ago, Blue said:

No, they watch broadcasts while having zero idea of what schemes or plays were called. They are no more of an expert than you or I watching the Skycam on ESPN3.

It doesn't invalidate their opinion and I didn't say it did. But it remains merely an opinion and one that is not particularly more well-informed than the average viewer.

This is false no matter how many times you say it. They dont *always* know the scheme/play, but they have trained experts watching the all-22 takes and have even called the teams/coaches/players before to get clarification on plays.

 

You are acting like they are just fans. Thats a non-starter. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Blue said:

No, they watch broadcasts while having zero idea of what schemes or plays were called. They are no more of an expert than you or I watching the Skycam on ESPN3.

It doesn't invalidate their opinion and I didn't say it did. But it remains merely an opinion and one that is not particularly more well-informed than the average viewer.

I'm pretty sure they have people assigned to watch and they don't just do they snap live. There's a system and they rewind blah blah. I still don't like it but it looks like they have way way way more employees now to do that crap. But that's the age. We need it now. 

Idk why I like the PFF argument so much though. I can see both sides (one is obviously wrong though lol) but it's fun to me. 

It's this whole ******* Rosetta stone idea of trying to simplifying football to all numbers so we don't have to watch it anymore. Don't watch college JUST GOOGLE THE GUYS RAS blah blah. It's just bothersome. I used to think I was a nerd until I met modern football fans lol

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

Love seems a little strong. Its more that I use them along with other tools to form an opinion. 

How much can PFF sway you? I feel like it can't push me a direction. Only justify my bull**** lol

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Norm said:

How much can PFF sway you? I feel like it can't push me a direction. Only justify my bull**** lol

Depends. Normally it will be one of a few sources I will quote in an argument/debate. That plus my individual thoughts would make it roughly 20% of my opinion. 

Edited by Matts4313
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

Love seems a little strong. Its more that I use them along with other tools to form an opinion. 

This is false no matter how many times you say it. They dont *always* know the scheme/play, but they have trained experts watching the all-22 takes and have even called the teams/coaches/players before to get clarification on plays.

 

You are acting like they are just fans. Thats a non-starter. 

Oh I don't think they're fans. I just don't think they're a bunch of ex pros.. I'll watch ex NFL guys break take on YouTube all the time and guys who never got close to it. But at least I can see what they see while they're explaining it. I'm not being nuts I don't think man

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

Love seems a little strong. Its more that I use them along with other tools to form an opinion. 

This is false no matter how many times you say it. They dont *always* know the scheme/play, but they have trained experts watching the all-22 takes and have even called the teams/coaches/players before to get clarification on plays.

 

You are acting like they are just fans. Thats a non-starter. 

It's not false. It's true. They are just fans who watch the games more than once. There's nothing wrong with that and presenting it as your opinion.

The problem is that PFF presents themselves as being some sort of experts when they're not. If you genuinely believe current NFL coaches and players are telling PFF their schemes and assignments on plays on request, I don't know what to tell you. Certainly nobody is going to admit to that or name names whether it's true or not, but I absolutely don't believe it.

This is a site that claims to grade players based on the result of the plays, not technique or athleticism or whatever, then calls a 54%, 6.4 YPA, 0 TD and 4 interception effort on par with a 75%, 9.4 YPA, 3 TD and 1 interception game. That's absurd no matter how you slice it.

12 minutes ago, Norm said:

I'm pretty sure they have people assigned to watch and they don't just do they snap live.

I'm not suggesting they only watch it live.

Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

it feels like you are arguing to argue and you know what my point is...

No I'm actually confused.

How do they grade each player to release a "highest graded player" chart an hour after the game if that's not what their final grades are? What point are those grades then and how is the average user supposed to know that's different from the grade that is posted when the All-22 is released a couple days later?

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, Blue said:

The problem is that PFF presents themselves as being some sort of experts when they're not. If you genuinely believe current NFL coaches and players are telling PFF their schemes and assignments on plays on request, I don't know what to tell you. Certainly nobody is going to admit to that or name names whether it's true or not, but I absolutely don't believe it.

What so hard to believe? Coach Billy B does it on youtube like every single week, why would he not correct an analyst if they asked? 

Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

No I'm actually confused.

How do they grade each player to release a "highest graded player" chart an hour after the game if that's not what their final grades are? What point are those grades then and how is the average user supposed to know that's different from the grade that is posted when the All-22 is released a couple days later?

The point of the instant analysis is to create revenue and word of mouth advertising, I would assume. 

I mean, their end game is still to sell their product to customers and they best way to do that in 2021? Viral marketing. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

They dont *always* know the scheme/play, but they have trained experts watching the all-22 takes and have even called the teams/coaches/players before to get clarification on plays.

 

You are acting like they are just fans. Thats a non-starter. 

Where exactly do you get the "trained experts" part?   No being smart....I genuinely want to know.     And what exactly are the experts at?    

PFF always has ads looking for new analysts, and Ive read the PD, and while it asks for people with a football background, it focuses more heavily on statistical prowess rather than an understanding of the game.   I think thats why they excel at advanced stats, but their grades are very flawed.

Via wikipedia....

Quote

PFF has been criticized by the analytics community regarding the accuracy and veracity of its ratings.[9] In contrast to the purely quantitative ratings released by sources like Football Outsiders, TeamRankings, and numberFire, PFF uses qualitative and opinion-based grading as the root of its 0-100 Player Grades -- not its advanced statistics. As such, the 0-100 Player Grades are not truly quantitative and could be seen as being prone to bias, poor sample sizing, or other issues.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro_Football_Focus

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...