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Zach Wilson decision looks bad now and Darnold looks like a gamer


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19 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

I also think there's also a lot of history to suggest that the better NFL QB's were guys that were taken later in the draft or by teams that were already decent/good that traded up to get them. Wilson, Brady, and Dak were all mid to late round picks. Lamar/Rodgers were late 1st round picks by good teams that already had a solid veteran starting QB. And the Chiefs traded up to get Mahomes with a very good team already in place. 

How often does the first QB off the board or the QB taken #1 overall end up being the best QB from their class or have a ton of NFL success? IIRC only Peyton/Newton have been MVPs and only Peyton/Eli have won Super Bowls with the team that drafted them. 

Aikman is the only other one I can think of. And that first year was ******* tragic.

But you also get the #1 slot versus the rest of the draft but yes I see your point. I think I grew up on your side and still am but I think transcendent talents can move the needle on those garbage teams, eventually. I used to always blame the team and sometimes I think it was talent too. That at all doesn't mean it doesn't help to get dropped into the right spot. That's very very very obviously a truism

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5 minutes ago, Norm said:

But you also get the #1 slot versus the rest of the draft but yes I see your point. I think I grew up on your side and still am but I think transcendent talents can move the needle on those garbage teams, eventually. I used to always blame the team and sometimes I think it was talent too. That at all doesn't mean it doesn't help to get dropped into the right spot. That's very very very obviously a truism

Agreed. Wilson/Lawerence will be interesting to monitor going forward because they're at opposite ends of the spectrums in a lot of ways. Lawerence is used to the pressure because he has been considered a prodigy for years but went to a market/team were they don't necessarily have a ton of expectations because they've never won and Jacksonville isn't exactly a huge media market. Whereas Wilson was a late bloomer that was in a great situation at a smaller school and was thrust into the biggest/harshest media market in the country where every little mistake he makes will be under a microscope. 

ETA: And Wilson's criticism's will be amplified even more if Darnold plays well while he struggles. 

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13 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Agreed. Wilson/Lawerence will be interesting to monitor going forward because they're at opposite ends of the spectrums in a lot of ways. Lawerence is used to the pressure because he has been considered a prodigy for years but went to a market/team were they don't necessarily have a ton of expectations because they've never won and Jacksonville isn't exactly a huge media market. Whereas Wilson was a late bloomer that was in a great situation at a smaller school and was thrust into the biggest/harshest media market in the country where every little mistake he makes will be under a microscope. 

ETA: And Wilson's criticism's will be amplified even more if Darnold plays well while he struggles. 

VERY different personalities though. Idk how that plays. TBH I think Lawrence did sure would have been better in NY market. I think most people agree. Maybe Wilson can weather it though

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1 minute ago, Norm said:

VERY different personalities though. Idk how that plays. TBH I think Lawrence did sure would have been better in NY market. I think most people agree. Maybe Wilson can weather it though

Agreed. Wilson played at a small mormon school where he was only sacked 10 times all season and the only real adversity he faced was against Coastal Carolina. Lawerence was in huge games almost every week and expected to be great from day 1. I think Lawerence was definitely better suited for the pressure that comes with playing in NY while Wilson would've thrived in a smaller market with less expectations, especially early on.

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13 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Agreed. Wilson played at a small mormon school where he was only sacked 10 times all season and the only real adversity he faced was against Coastal Carolina. Lawerence was in huge games almost every week and expected to be great from day 1. I think Lawerence was definitely better suited for the pressure that comes with playing in NY while Wilson would've thrived in a smaller market with less expectations, especially early on.

Good post.

Random. Just talking about Jamaal Williams in the pre game and how he went to BYU still kills me. Everyone thought I was joking

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It will be interesting to see how this progresses. They need to reprogram Wilson to see and accept more basic throws while designing an offense that makes them available and obvious. Otherwise you're going to see one playground heave after another off his back foot. 

Delivery looks a bit longer than I estimated in college. Wilson will have to work on that. It never ceases to amaze me how the quarterbacks look slightly different on transition. Mac Jones' delivery seems even more compact than at Alabama. He just needs the typical arm strength improvement that often accompanies these guys once it's their profession and they head toward mid 20s.  

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The difference between guys like Wilson and Mac Jones. 

One is on a team with the GOAT at HC who knows to not ask much from a rookie QB. He has Jones throwing dump offs most of the game, keeps it simple and effective.  It allows Jones to be comfortable and gain confidence.

Wilson comes out trying to air it out and makes some really dumb decisions. Saleh has to scale it back, it sucks that we have a rookie OC too. But they need to bring him in, keep it boring and allow him to make some easy completions and let the game slow down. Wilson has arm talent that only a couple QBs have, he wants to make those big throws, but you need to learn to walk before you run.  The one INT wasn't his fault, went through the WR hands. The other 3 completely his fault. The first INT, he actually had Elijah Moore break open, he instead forced it into Davis.  The out route was just terrible timing and dumb, idk what he was doing there. Then he has one where he just throws it out there, I guess he might have been able to hit Moore there but it was a bad throw. 

Jets need to keep it with quick  easy throws and run the ball. The run game might have some promise with Carter/Johnson.

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51 minutes ago, NYJets4716 said:

The difference between guys like Wilson and Mac Jones. 

One is on a team with the GOAT at HC who knows to not ask much from a rookie QB. He has Jones throwing dump offs most of the game, keeps it simple and effective.  It allows Jones to be comfortable and gain confidence.

Wilson comes out trying to air it out and makes some really dumb decisions. Saleh has to scale it back, it sucks that we have a rookie OC too. But they need to bring him in, keep it boring and allow him to make some easy completions and let the game slow down. Wilson has arm talent that only a couple QBs have, he wants to make those big throws, but you need to learn to walk before you run.  The one INT wasn't his fault, went through the WR hands. The other 3 completely his fault. The first INT, he actually had Elijah Moore break open, he instead forced it into Davis.  The out route was just terrible timing and dumb, idk what he was doing there. Then he has one where he just throws it out there, I guess he might have been able to hit Moore there but it was a bad throw. 

Jets need to keep it with quick  easy throws and run the ball. The run game might have some promise with Carter/Johnson.

Easier said than done friend, an untested QB and a good run game both need a good O line and it's hard to build around the run in today's NFL

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31 minutes ago, DigInBoys said:

Easier said than done friend, an untested QB and a good run game both need a good O line and it's hard to build around the run in today's NFL

Well it sucks cause Becton will be out for around 6-8 weeks.  AVT has been looking really good in run blocking, I really wanted to see him and Becton clearing lanes on that left side.

Its the coaching staff's job to work through this and develop Wilson.  Get him confident and throwing some easy completions, our WR corps isn't bad. Once Crowder returns which could be this week, idk why he didn't play, he will give Wilson a veteran WR who can consistently get open in the slot and move the chains.   I didn't think Wilson played bad week 1, he was under huge pressure, had no run game, the Panthers defense was playing fantastic, and he showed off the elite arm talent with some big throws to bring them back and that was after getting crushed multiple times. 

Its hard to tell either way, because its been 2 games. Its not about 1 bad game or 1 good game, being a good QB requires consistency.  I mean even Aaron Rodgers throws a stinker like last week. 

It does suck that the Jets have a brand new HC and brand new OC.  Its Lafleur's first OC gig and he has to develop a rookie QB.   Mike Lafleur is going to have growing pains as well, he comes from a good background but he was completely unproven as well. 

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2 hours ago, NYJets4716 said:

The difference between guys like Wilson and Mac Jones. 

One is on a team with the GOAT at HC who knows to not ask much from a rookie QB. He has Jones throwing dump offs most of the game, keeps it simple and effective.  It allows Jones to be comfortable and gain confidence.

Wilson comes out trying to air it out and makes some really dumb decisions. Saleh has to scale it back, it sucks that we have a rookie OC too. But they need to bring him in, keep it boring and allow him to make some easy completions and let the game slow down. Wilson has arm talent that only a couple QBs have, he wants to make those big throws, but you need to learn to walk before you run.  The one INT wasn't his fault, went through the WR hands. The other 3 completely his fault. The first INT, he actually had Elijah Moore break open, he instead forced it into Davis.  The out route was just terrible timing and dumb, idk what he was doing there. Then he has one where he just throws it out there, I guess he might have been able to hit Moore there but it was a bad throw. 

Jets need to keep it with quick  easy throws and run the ball. The run game might have some promise with Carter/Johnson.

Your defense has actually been pretty good all things considered over the first two games, it's just unfortunate that Wilson's first 3 games are against the Panthers, Patriots, and Broncos. The Broncos demolished Trevor Lawerence last week. 

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Just now, NYRaider said:

Your defense has actually been pretty good all things considered over the first two games, it's just unfortunate that Wilson's first 3 games are against the Panthers, Patriots, and Broncos. The Broncos demolished Trevor Lawerence last week. 

They played hard and are well coached it seems. We have a 5th round rookie CB who is playing really well in Michael Carter II, and a 6th round rookie CB starting with Brandin Echols who has looked solid.  The DL would have been dominant with Carl Lawson. Now they have really good DTs who can bring it. John Franklin Myers is a good player who should have a breakout season, he plays all over the line.   LBers you have CJ Mosley returning, then some bums. Hamslah has been starting as a rookie but looks bad.  I suspect that Goodson is going to start soon as he has NFL experience and is a better option.  Eventually Jarad Davis will return. 

We  have 7 rookies starting, so this is a super young team that is going to struggle badly at times. Some Jets fans didn't want to believe me that the Panthers defense is really good, they then dominate the Saints offense. That defense is flying around and has talent.   BB always owns rookie QBs so this was kinda expected TBH. I would have been shocked if Wilson tore up a BB defense in his 2nd start.  Hes the GOAt for a reason. Its so annoying having the Pats in my division, they are always well coached.

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4 minutes ago, NYJets4716 said:

We  have 7 rookies starting, so this is a super young team that is going to struggle badly at times. Some Jets fans didn't want to believe me that the Panthers defense is really good, they then dominate the Saints offense. That defense is flying around and has talent.   BB always owns rookie QBs so this was kinda expected TBH. I would have been shocked if Wilson tore up a BB defense in his 2nd start.  Hes the GOAt for a reason. Its so annoying having the Pats in my division, they are always well coached.

Yeah the Jets are at the beginning of a major rebuild, there will be a ton of growing pains this year. 7 rookie starters including a rookie QB, a rookie head coach, and a rookie offensive coordinator isn't exactly a recipe for success. Obviously still very early but I think Isaiah Spiller with your second 1st round pick or your 2nd round pick would be a nice addition. 

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Zach Wilson and Justin Fields will bust these guys just don’t look or act like grown men. 

Mac Jones will be the best QB from this class and Lance and Trevor will be fighting it out for spot #2.

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6 minutes ago, Kirill said:

Zach Wilson and Justin Fields will bust these guys just don’t look or act like grown men. 

Mac Jones will be the best QB from this class and Lance and Trevor will be fighting it out for spot #2.

Based off of a 2 game sample size from Wilson and a 1 half sample size from Fields? 

Lawerence has been absolutely terrible through his first two games. 

Mac Jones has been solid through the first two weeks but he's also in the best situation and McDaniels has done an excellent job of protecting him. His average depth of target so far this year has been 3.1 yards down field and 75% of his completions have been 5 yards or shorter. The only starting QB in the league with a shorter average depth of target this year is Carson Wentz. 

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