If He Were to Retire Today is Matt Ryan a HOF Quarterback?

[N4L]

On 9/23/2021 at 12:52 PM, scar988 said:

Let's be honest, he played in an era with the best of the best. Brady, Manning, Rivers, Roethlisberger, Eli, Brees, and he was consistently in the mix with Roethlisberger and Rivers for that QB5 spot. If anything, you could say that Young and Aikman weren't even top 5 QBs most years they played and they still got in. This isn't a legit argument.

The issue I have with this argument is that it absolutely affirms that he was never "elite" for his era, and that the way things are trending with how many good, young QBs there are in the league now, Ryan's resume will not age well

[Uncle Buck]

On 9/23/2021 at 2:30 AM, brownie man said:

I say no

My friend who's a Falcons fan says yes. 

 

I think hes for sure Ring of Honor and you should probably retire "2", but I don't think he's HOF worthy. Not enough winning. 

 

Thoughts? 

I would probably agree with you on this one. 

Ring of Honor - Yes
Retire Number - Nah
Hall of Fame - Probably more of a "Hall of Very Good" kind of guy.  I don't see him as quite a HOF'er. 

[Malfatron]

nope, not even close, bud

[Malfatron]

On 9/23/2021 at 5:26 AM, Mr Bad Example said:

Ryan is sort of the Rich Man's Stafford, has a little more hardware (MVP, SB appearance). 

except not as good as Stafford

[scar988]

3 hours ago, N4L said:

The issue I have with this argument is that it absolutely affirms that he was never "elite" for his era, and that the way things are trending with how many good, young QBs there are in the league now, Ryan's resume will not age well

It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Elite. 

From the Hall of Fame website: 

Quote

VISION

It’s not just the past, it’s the future; It’s not just about Canton, it’s the world; It’s not just a great museum for football, it’s a message of Excellence EVERYWHERE!

CREED

We protect the Game by making it SAFER

We grow the Game by promoting its VALUES

We elevate the Game by LOVING those who helped build it

PURPOSE

To help EVERY fan experience a Hall of Fame Life by creating “The Most Inspiring Place on Earth!”

Last I checked, Matt Ryan fits the bill of Vision. He's an excellent player through his career. He promotes the values of the game on and off the field. He fits the mission. 

He has the stats needed to fit the bill of long term excellence. He has the career in the playoffs to fit it too, regardless of winning the super bowl or not, Ryan has played well enough to win in almost every playoff game he was in. No one crushed them outside of the 2011 game vs. NYG and the game vs Green Bay where the Falcons had a shot and they got behind at the half due to a receiver slipping in the end zone on a pick six. It was down hill from there. The Falcons lost a lot of games in the playoffs due to bad luck. 

More importantly, the people who vote on it, will likely believe that he belongs in because they voted in similar people with similar resumes.

 

Ryan's resume of longevity and consistency and performance over a decade and a half will be more than enough. Some people are sitting here arguing against a guy who's likely to finish in the top 4 passing all time.

[Chargers]

I think he's in the same peer group as the 2004 class except without the Rings. None of those QBs are seen as better than the Manning, Brady, Brees, Rodgers that Ryan played with and only 2 of the '04 group have rings so I'd say he won't make it. 

The picture I'm slowing getting of what a HOF QB is going to looking like post 2010's is to win early with bulk stats later in career or have  a element to your game that makes your talent undeniable. 

[Soko]

A decisive no, for me. 

The HOF is not meant for the insanely consistent, always reliable, good but hardly ever the best, type players. I think for guys that aren’t consistently argued (or at least, for a few years) as the best in the league, have to have a monumental case in their favor. Like huge playoff success, crazy longevity, etc. Brees for example, wasn’t the usual of the “big four” to be viewed as the best in the league, but he was always in that same grouping. 

I don’t think Matt Ryan fits the bill. His best argument will be he played more recently and thus will have better stats than most of his predecessors. Don’t like that as a HOF argument.

 

[Mr Bad Example]

Brees also had "ridiculously prolific" in his favour as well. 

[Heinz D.]

With Ryan...my heart says NO, but my brain says YES.

The NFL is goofy. All these good QBs from this era will be in the HOF at some point. 

[BayRaider]

Id say yes, but it's certainly close and I respect anyone who says no. Before 2016 I'd say no. His MVP year and 2018 edge him in. 

Even if some are unconvinced, the guy likely has a few seasons left to convince you. 

[BayRaider]

6 hours ago, Yin-Yang said:

The HOF is not meant for the insanely consistent, always reliable, good but hardly ever the best, type players.

Unfortunately the Hall has much lower standards than fans. I'm going by the Hall's standards and people I see consistently get in. 

[Soko]

1 hour ago, BayRaider said:

Unfortunately the Hall has much lower standards than fans. I'm going by the Hall's standards and people I see consistently get in. 

Who are the QBs that “consistently get in” without hardware? In the last 40 years or so, what’s it just been, Kelly? With almost a half a decade’s worth of SB appearances (and near-make, heartbreaks). 

[Mr Bad Example]

12 hours ago, Yin-Yang said:

Who are the QBs that “consistently get in” without hardware? In the last 40 years or so, what’s it just been, Kelly? With almost a half a decade’s worth of SB appearances (and near-make, heartbreaks). 

 If we're talking QBs that haven't won a SB (which is a stupid standard, anyway) there's been run - Fouts, Marino, Kelly, Moon, Tarkenton (who went in years ago...deservely so). 

My issue is more that "Super Bowl" seems to make "Hall of Good" QBs into Hall of Famers - Griese, Aikman, Eli Manning.* The obsession with SBs is leaking down to RBs and WRs (specifically Jerome Bettis and Hines Ward)

 

* I wouldn't even put Eli in the "Hall of Good"; more in the "Hall of Durable"

[Soko]

5 hours ago, Mr Bad Example said:

 If we're talking QBs that haven't won a SB (which is a stupid standard, anyway) there's been run - Fouts, Marino, Kelly, Moon, Tarkenton (who went in years ago...deservely so). 

My issue is more that "Super Bowl" seems to make "Hall of Good" QBs into Hall of Famers - Griese, Aikman, Eli Manning.* The obsession with SBs is leaking down to RBs and WRs (specifically Jerome Bettis and Hines Ward)

 

* I wouldn't even put Eli in the "Hall of Good"; more in the "Hall of Durable"

I’m not about rings being the only/main argument. I was more responding to the guy saying there’s a long, consistent record of guys like Matt Ryan getting in the HOF. There hasn’t been, not recently.

Kelly went to almost a half a decade’s worth. Marino was special, even compared to most HOFers. Moon was a great player with a special legacy/story, and longevity to boot (he’s not someone I’d have voted in, but that’s besides the point).

If we are indeed just going by the standard set in the last 40 years or so, hardware certainly seems to matter.

[scar988]

7 hours ago, Mr Bad Example said:

 If we're talking QBs that haven't won a SB (which is a stupid standard, anyway) there's been run - Fouts, Marino, Kelly, Moon, Tarkenton (who went in years ago...deservely so). 

My issue is more that "Super Bowl" seems to make "Hall of Good" QBs into Hall of Famers - Griese, Aikman, Eli Manning.* The obsession with SBs is leaking down to RBs and WRs (specifically Jerome Bettis and Hines Ward)

 

* I wouldn't even put Eli in the "Hall of Good"; more in the "Hall of Durable"

Let's not forget to Mention Lynn Swann who has half of Roddy White's production.