Our Nightmare is Over: Fields is the guy

[BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW]

1 hour ago, beardown3231 said:

Unless it's an injury, Fields will not be benched this year

If you're saying he SHOULDN'T be benched no matter what, I'd agree. The team needs him to get live game experience for the future.  

BUT.  Who knows what Nagy's employment security is?  He benched Trubisky in that Rams game, then again the quick hook last year only to go back to him later.  Good idea or bad I wouldn't rule anything out.  I think much of Nagy's frustrating PR is him trying to cover his *** from committing to anything in case it doesn't work, as much as it is actual gamesmanship with this weeks opponent. 

Not saying what I would do, just trying to figure out what Nagy is up to, so I guess he gamed the fans at least. 

[G08]

I think this is Fields through and through. Likely will try to build an offense around what he does well, I still anticipate some Ohio State concepts to be worked in during the season. 

I'm good with it, use this season to build a new scheme around what Fields does well. 

[beardown3231]

19 minutes ago, RunningVaccs said:

If you're saying he SHOULDN'T be benched no matter what, I'd agree. The team needs him to get live game experience for the future.  

BUT.  Who knows what Nagy's employment security is?  He benched Trubisky in that Rams game, then again the quick hook last year only to go back to him later.  Good idea or bad I wouldn't rule anything out.  I think much of Nagy's frustrating PR is him trying to cover his *** from committing to anything in case it doesn't work, as much as it is actual gamesmanship with this weeks opponent. 

Not saying what I would do, just trying to figure out what Nagy is up to, so I guess he gamed the fans at least. 

Both: he will be the starter and should be. Nagy said yesterday the only chance is due to injury (yes I know he kept saying Dalton is the starter but I think we all knew he was BS'ing). I still don't believe Trubisky was benched vs LAR- that happened so late in the game and the game was out of reach. 

[dll2000]

2 hours ago, RunningVaccs said:

Not so sure this was mandated. I think Nagy believes in getting any little performance advantage he can no matter how stupid it looks (still better than the John Fox gibberish) and also wants an out if fields struggles so he can bench him without it being a benching. I think it all just got too obvious and was more of a distraction and joke than any kind of advantage. Probably always was, but Nagy has a hard time letting go of a plan or tactic when he likes it, no matter how bad it's looking on the ground.

I was open to that when I just saw tweet, but did you watch the full video of Nagy changing his mind?  

It absolutely was not his idea.  Someone twisted his arm. 

[dll2000]

1 minute ago, dll2000 said:

I was open to that when I just saw tweet, but did you watch the full video of Nagy changing his mind?  

It absolutely was not his idea.  Someone twisted his arm. 

And I don’t think it was Pace.  Pace may have been instrument.  But it was someone else with juice to do it. That is a short list.   Likely George or Ted or both. Or maybe someone from new investors that are behind Arlington Heights deal.  

[dll2000]

15 hours ago, Heinz D. said:

Did you not watch the Lions game? Or is that snark? 😉

Yeah, you gotta wonder what Nagy is thinking, right? 

Hard to say if Pace is going anywhere else...but, yeah, this was NOT Nagy's decision. No way in hell it was. I'm eagerly awaiting finding out just who brought the hammer down on poor, egotistical Matt...

I was just kidding around with those comments.  

[BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW]

13 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

I was open to that when I just saw tweet, but did you watch the full video of Nagy changing his mind?  

It absolutely was not his idea.  Someone twisted his arm. 

Admit I did not, will find it and watch.   For all the cash and drive behind big sports organizations, it's astonishing how many big decisions come down to an owner's crazy whim so who knows if George suddenly found his football decision making and liked what he saw against Lions. 

[dll2000]

1 minute ago, RunningVaccs said:

Admit I did not, will find it and watch.   For all the cash and drive behind big sports organizations, it's astonishing how many big decisions come down to an owner's crazy whim so who knows if George suddenly found his football decision making and liked what he saw against Lions. 

I think it was a saving decision on Nagy’s behalf.   The pitchfork mob was coming and he refused to see it. 

[BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW]

22 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

I think it was a saving decision on Nagy’s behalf.   The pitchfork mob was coming and he refused to see it. 

You made me watch a press conference, ack, and honestly I can't see much making me think it was him or from above.   You might be better at reading between the lines, but I'm not seeing signs of outside influence.  The painful part for me is him talking about Lazor calling plays and saying how good it felt. Yeah Matt,  I too have always enjoyed giving up my favorite part of my job and watching someone do it better. 

[dll2000]

1 hour ago, RunningVaccs said:

You made me watch a press conference, ack, and honestly I can't see much making me think it was him or from above.   You might be better at reading between the lines, but I'm not seeing signs of outside influence.  The painful part for me is him talking about Lazor calling plays and saying how good it felt. Yeah Matt,  I too have always enjoyed giving up my favorite part of my job and watching someone do it better. 

Watch it in conjunction with his previous one where he said the exact opposite just 24 or 48 hrs before and watch body language and voice inflection on each.

 

 

[soulman]

3 hours ago, Bfan said:

Hey guys if you want to believe it was mandated from above that Fields starts, that everything that goes wrong with the offense is Nagy's fault, and everything that goes right is because of Lazor that is your choice. I just don't have enough stomach lineing left for that level of acid production so I'll just watch the game and see what happens.

IMHO that's a little too overboard.

I don't believe anyone is saying that all bad things belong to Nagy or that all good thing belong to Lazor.  But what's pretty obvious is that with two different yet relatively inexperienced QBs Bill Lazor has been able to organize effective game plans and play calling that resulted in a more efficient offense and more scoring. 

That can't be denied any longer and it hasn't been by anyone here or in the national media so it's also safe to assume it hasn't been ignored by Pace and GMcC either.  I'm not certain that it was "mandated" either other than to come to the conclusion that it was time to end Plan A and move on to Plan B with Fields starting.

When virtually every other rookie QB drafted in round one is starting and producing reasonable results but your rookie QB it tends to bring up those questions about the logic of holding Fields back especially when your own OC says he's ready to start then together they go out and prove it with Fields playing the entire game and winning.

For all we know it's been Pace whose been insistent on sticking with Plan A and he had a change of heart.  That would still mean the decision to change came down from up top but not necessarily as a "mandate" but rather as a collaborative decision even the rest of the coaching staff agreed with.  It's all just speculation and none of it really matters.

Edited October 7, 2021 by soulman

[dll2000]

3 hours ago, Bfan said:

Hey guys if you want to believe it was mandated from above that Fields starts, that everything that goes wrong with the offense is Nagy's fault, and everything that goes right is because of Lazor that is your choice. I just don't have enough stomach lineing left for that level of acid production so I'll just watch the game and see what happens.

It is not about wanting to believe one way or other for me.  I am going off properdance of evidence.

1) Offense does demonstrably better with Lazor having greater influence we have several games of data for that now.  True or False? 

2) Offense does mostly poorly under sole influence of Nagy.  True or False? 

3) Nagy was adamant just earlier this week and after game film that Dalton start and then suddenly changed his mind for reasons.   True or False?   

Now that being said my opinion is that Nagy is not best coach for the job based on a wide variety of things I have observed over last several years.   But going off just the above why would we keep Nagy if Lazor is demonstrably the better coach between the two?   

Nagy's administrative skills are not so valuable that we can't live without him and him having title of HC means he can monkey wrench better plans and is a potential anchor on Lazor's game plans and Field's development.  

If it was up to me I would fire Nagy now and make Lazor interim head coach and keep rest of staff.   Rip the band aid off now.   If Lazor shows improvement and development of Fields hire him full time. If not you have a ton of time to do a thorough search for a replacement.    

I will say that team does do better when he is paying attention to flow of game and not calling plays and he does a decent job of managing game when he is not calling plays.  That is a credit to Nagy.   Again that is not so valuable that someone else couldn't do it or it couldn't be done by cooperation within the staff.     HS teams do it all the time without benefit of advanced communication tech and tv replays.

 

 

 

[dll2000]

I mean Nagy is a nice guy.  I don't want him to be fired personally.   It is just where we are at for reasons of his performance.

 

[soulman]

3 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

I will say that team does do better when he is paying attention to flow of game and not calling plays and he does a decent job of managing game when he is not calling plays.  That is a credit to Nagy.   Again that is not so valuable that someone else couldn't do it or it couldn't be done by cooperation within the staff.     HS teams do it all the time without benefit of advanced communication tech and tv replays.

Since I have my doubts they'll fire Nagy during the season this should be his challenge for the remainder of the year.  Coach your team coach.

It's fine to have all things funnel through him as long as the reason for doing it is to keep him in the loop and not because he has veto power over decisions that make perfect sense to his staff.  If they're selling collaboration then it needs to be total collaboration not just collaboration when Matt Nagy feels like it.

I get the part that he enjoys calling plays and that it's fun for him.  But he's not very good at it and this is about winning games not making certain Matt Nagy is enjoying himself.  There are still more than enough critical decisions for him to make during the course of a season to keep him occupied with that instead.

IMHO if he survives this season it will be because the less he does to guide the offense on game days and the more he coaches the entire game results in a better team whose winning more often or at the very least competing to win in every game right on down to the final gun. That can get him another year.

[dll2000]

10 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

It is not about wanting to believe one way or other for me.  I am going off properdance of evidence.

1) Offense does demonstrably better with Lazor having greater influence we have several games of data for that now.  True or False? 

2) Offense does mostly poorly under sole influence of Nagy.  True or False? 

3) Nagy was adamant just earlier this week and after game film that Dalton start and then suddenly changed his mind for reasons.   True or False?   

Now that being said my opinion is that Nagy is not best coach for the job based on a wide variety of things I have observed over last several years.   But going off just the above why would we keep Nagy if Lazor is demonstrably the better coach between the two?   

Nagy's administrative skills are not so valuable that we can't live without him and him having title of HC means he can monkey wrench better plans and is a potential anchor on Lazor's game plans and Field's development.  

If it was up to me I would fire Nagy now and make Lazor interim head coach and keep rest of staff.   Rip the band aid off now.   If Lazor shows improvement and development of Fields hire him full time. If not you have a ton of time to do a thorough search for a replacement.    

I will say that team does do better when he is paying attention to flow of game and not calling plays and he does a decent job of managing game when he is not calling plays.  That is a credit to Nagy.   Again that is not so valuable that someone else couldn't do it or it couldn't be done by cooperation within the staff.     HS teams do it all the time without benefit of advanced communication tech and tv replays.

 

 

 

This is why Nagy is so bummed though.   

I mean media gave credit to Freddie Kitchens over Hue Jackson for offensive turn around in Cleveland after a horrendous start and Hue was quickly shown the door once that narrative took hold.   We even had same situation where Hue was insisting on playing Tyrod over number overall pick for awhile.   Though he got excited when Mayfield went in while Nagy was insisting he would go back.   

Clearly they overestimated Kitchens skill set though.   He wasn't ready to be a HC.

Nagy is probably lucky Bears haven't done Hard Knocks or the like, like Hue did.   People would spin those clips hard now.