Frankie2Gunz Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 2 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said: We’ve been talking about this for years now and it’s the same thing. How does respond to adversity? Last year he responded by tanking the 2nd half of the season Look, I'm frustrated with our dumpster fire organization too. It's a horrible situation for all involved, the players, fans, coaches but the least of this franchises problems are Carr. What are you basing "Carr tanking in the 2nd half". I would say that is totally incorrect, rather his teammates gave up. Did Carr have some terrible games (ATL), sure he did but our D was a complete embarrassment all season long. This season is now lost, you could see that last week against the Bears as it was pretty clear that everyone around the league, including the Raiders players and staff knew Gruden was finished. Two weeks ago everyone was clamoring for Carr for MVP, now you're calling for his head with zero backup plan in place. "Duces" is the best response you have. Give me a break.... Flat out foolishness. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie2Gunz Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 44 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said: There will always be adversity in the nfl and esp with this team. as you can see lol. it will be a while before we’re perfect enough for y’all to not have any excuse to save him And you think this is a great environment for an unproven rookie QB? If 99 percent of rookie QB's came to this dumpster fire organization they would fail. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 32 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said: And you think this is a great environment for an unproven rookie QB? If 99 percent of rookie QB's came to this dumpster fire organization they would fail. If we drafted a quarterback, I could see him having a bad preseason outing and people on this forum would go bonkers lol 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humble_Beast Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 First: DC went from MVP---- - Gruden news- OL falls apart Post Gruden: Its all DC fault now. It's time to move on and start fresh. lol Like many have said, most rookie QB would flop hard with this franchise. It's not for the faint of heart 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 1 hour ago, Frankie2Gunz said: Look, I'm frustrated with our dumpster fire organization too. It's a horrible situation for all involved, the players, fans, coaches but the least of this franchises problems are Carr. What are you basing "Carr tanking in the 2nd half". I would say that is totally incorrect, rather his teammates gave up. Did Carr have some terrible games (ATL), sure he did but our D was a complete embarrassment all season long. This season is now lost, you could see that last week against the Bears as it was pretty clear that everyone around the league, including the Raiders players and staff knew Gruden was finished. Two weeks ago everyone was clamoring for Carr for MVP, now you're calling for his head with zero backup plan in place. "Duces" is the best response you have. Give me a break.... Flat out foolishness. Not everyone was in the carr is a mvp orgy just cause he had a million yards esp not me. You want a backup plan wait for my mock. It changes every year cause there’s always new prospects, fa etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie2Gunz Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 (edited) 15 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said: Not everyone was in the carr is a mvp orgy just cause he had a million yards esp not me. You want a backup plan wait for my mock. It changes every year cause there’s always new prospects, fa etc etc What was your plan for the previous three seasons when it came to QB? Aren't you one of the tank for Tua homers LOL Edited October 16, 2021 by Frankie2Gunz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrOaktown_56 Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 I like Carr but if you can get Rodgers or Wilson you do it. Especially Wilson. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted October 16, 2021 Author Share Posted October 16, 2021 17 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said: I like Carr but if you can get Rodgers or Wilson you do it. Especially Wilson. His name is Malik Willis. The next QB1 of the NFL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 49 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said: What was your plan for the previous three seasons when it came to QB? Aren't you one of the tank for Tua homers LOL No I never liked tua Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darbsk Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 It seems to me that we're stuck between a rock and hard place somewhat. We don't have a huge cache of draft picks and only really Carr I would think could fetch real capital, maybe Crosby or Ruggs. We have the semblance of a decent defence starting to take shape and the weapons on offence are looking decent. I voted No to the rebuild simply from the fact that I think we need supplementary players and a coach with a clear, defined vision rather than to tear it all down yet again. Carr in my opinion is good enough to go far providing he has a decent supporting cast. Russell Wilson is I think, the best QB in the NFL but even he is struggling when he doesn't have the tools around him, no QB can simply drag a poor team to a title, so even if we trade for a guy like Rodgers or Wilson we still need to sort the OL and add a couple defensive playmakers. There's no easy one simple move here. We need multiple moves and a long term strategy. I would keep Carr in place at least in the short term and if we deem that a great talent is available in the draft we take him and sit him to learn behind Carr and until the OL gets remade - even the greatest prospects like Lawrence look poor when they're thrown in a hopeless situation. If a guy that we don't love us there then we continue to build and develop the roster until such time as there is a kid there that we can get without mortgaging the future and we have a supporting cast in place that can help him when he does get in. As much as I love Wilson I'm not sure mortgaging the future for him and throwing him into a situation similar to that which he's unhappy with right now is the best way. If we swapped Wilson for Carr right now than we'd be a better team but we're not challenging for a title, not from what I've seen and we severely limit our resources to improve. It's tempting, especially as I like Wilson so much but I think the more logical, better long term solution would be continue to build the roster, develop a philosophy we want on offence that is sustainable and when the time us right pull the trigger on a young kid with huge potential that we can ease them in knowing that he doesn't have to get thrown to the wolves and the expectations aren't immediately on him. For every Herbert there are many Rosen's, Bortles and Darnolds so it's not simply a case of picking a QB high in the draft, it has to be the right guy and at draft position that we can get to without mortgaging the future or handicapping us down the line too much. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidersedge Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 There is a chance Mark just keeps Mike Mayock for another year or two while he plans his official rebuild but in the meantime Mayock now a chance to prove himself as the GM. This upcoming draft class isn't a great option for QB, it would be ideal to just keep Derek Carr. Also it seems like the defense is trending up with Gus Bradley and his staff so maybe Mayock goes out and finds a young offensive minded Head Coach who would want to keep Bradley as DC, which shouldn't be an issue. He's one of the better veteran DCs in the league. Shane Steichen who coached with Bradley with the Chargers is an option he's currently Eagles OC. Kellen Moore, Dallas OC Eric Bieniemy, Chiefs OC Joe Brady, Panthers OC Of course Mark could just say screw it and do a complete house cleaning but I'm not sure that's needed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 16 hours ago, Frankie2Gunz said: Naw, if you think Carr is the problem with this dumpster fire of a franchise you're clearly asleep at the wheel. 2 things: 1) I literally said Carr is no part of the problem. But he's far from the solution. He's a QB who will keep you in the middle. He's inconsistent and struggles late in seasons. 2) You have got to find another word than "dumpster fire". You have worn that word out you use it so much. Get some variety. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 15 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said: I’m loving this cause bp was the first carr supporter iirc and you are holding down bps old position. but you have to really put emotions away and read what bp is saying. Bp does have a point. I still view this as a make or break year for carr etc etc. after all this drama if carr balls out he’s a keeper if not deuces If anything, this is more make or break for Carr. He should have a lot more control now and can play looser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted October 16, 2021 Share Posted October 16, 2021 9 hours ago, Jeremy408 said: They've literally been down double digits in 4 out of 5 games Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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