Uncle Buck Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) 11 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said: It wasn’t shady. What they did is something worse than that. It isn’t football related, but look it up. A quick Google search is all you need. Just looked it up. Geez, I hadn't heard about any of this! If what I read is correct, this is darn near human trafficking. Every person that coordinated this stuff needs to be in prison. It's horrible. How has no one been brought to justice before this??? Did Daniel Snyder do anything about this? If not, he should be forced to sell the team. Also, @Jags and @Adrenaline_Flux, after reading this, I can understand why you felt the way you did about my earlier post. I had no idea this kind of thing was going on. In light of the situation, you guys were correct and my comment was out of place. No offense was intended. My apologies. Edited October 14, 2021 by Uncle Buck 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naptownskinsfan Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 1 minute ago, Uncle Buck said: Just looked it up. Geez, I hadn't heard about any of this! If what I read is correct, this is darn near human trafficking. Every person that coordinated this stuff needs to be in prison. It's horrible. How has no one been brought to justice before this??? Did Daniel Snyder do anything about this? If not, he should be forced to sell the team. Also, @Jags after reading this, I can understand why you felt the way you did about my earlier post. I had no idea this kind of thing was going on. No offense was intended. Sorry about that. Nothing. You got a verbal Wilkinson report, with no paper trail, with a $10 million fine for Snyder, him being replaced by his wife for a “suspension” and mandatory sensitivity training for all senior executives. Oh, and if I remember my timelines here correctly, after this event, Bruce Allen regained control of both football and business operations, so he suffered little here as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Buck Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Just now, naptownskinsfan said: Nothing. You got a verbal Wilkinson report, with no paper trail, with a $10 million fine for Snyder, him being replaced by his wife for a “suspension” and mandatory sensitivity training for all senior executives. Oh, and if I remember my timelines here correctly, after this event, Bruce Allen regained control of both football and business operations, so he suffered little here as well. That's pathetic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Buck Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) 16 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said: Nothing. You got a verbal Wilkinson report, with no paper trail, with a $10 million fine for Snyder, him being replaced by his wife for a “suspension” and mandatory sensitivity training for all senior executives. Oh, and if I remember my timelines here correctly, after this event, Bruce Allen regained control of both football and business operations, so he suffered little here as well. They need to get word out more on this. I don't follow the WFT very closely, so I was under the impression that the $10M fine and suspension of Snyder was purely over his unwillingness to change the name of the team. You would think that if the other owners had any sense of decency they would all vote to force Snyder out of his ownership of the team. This is going to (or certainly should) be a huge story all across the country. EDIT: In an earlier post, I stated "this is darn near human trafficking. I would like to amend that statement to say that THIS IS human trafficking! Edited October 14, 2021 by Uncle Buck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter2_1 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 5 hours ago, Uncle Buck said: As much as you have to love the idea of naked cheerleaders in general, sneaking into the locker room and/or showers and taking pictures of them without their knowledge and sharing the pictures via email is reprehensible. How could they have had naked pictures of the team's cheerleaders unless they were doing something VERY shady? I could see this as becoming an even bigger story than any of the email stuff. The people involved in this need to go to jail. It's like a power or control thing. They can just log on to a [certain] website to find topless women, and more. But they had to make it their cheerleaders didn't they, to show off to their fellow powerful rich colleagues 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlowe22 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 9 hours ago, mission27 said: In this case the term isn't intended to convey any judgement positive or negative tbh Gruden's comments are obviously distasteful but probably not that different from how a lot of people especially in football joke around with their friends and blow off steam Gruden clearly has always been more bold and caviler than others and had the misfortune of being associated with the WFT scandal Its really bad PR and not survivable but also not particularly surprising comin His ability to lead the locker room after that is non existent. What i dont agree with is throwing him under the bus and turning a blind eye to others, if theres evidence of other people in the NFL saying similar things. Maybe theres not, maybe Gruden is the only one. But i find that hard to believe. I know how people joke and communicate within their circle of friends, and its hard to believe hes the only one here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter2_1 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 12 minutes ago, Jlowe22 said: His ability to lead the locker room after that is non existent. What i dont agree with is throwing him under the bus and turning a blind eye to others, if theres evidence of other people in the NFL saying similar things. Maybe theres not, maybe Gruden is the only one. But i find that hard to believe. I know how people joke and communicate within their circle of friends, and its hard to believe hes the only one here. Yeah he's not spending 11 years calling people F's and sending topless pics to other men if he's not getting anything back whatsoever lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mission27 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 9 hours ago, Adrenaline_Flux said: I understand the desire to put in a bit of levity with a serious topic, but I don't think that was a particularly sensitive comment to make and honestly is a bit creepy to read. It's no wonder there aren't more women on the forum. the "although we are all attracted to beautiful women" comment similarly is a bit much too, imo Tbh though, why are cheerleaders there? To be gawked at by guys, making the NFL $$$. Some probably think the whole thing is creepy but lets call it what it is. Honestly I'd rather be on the side with Jerry Jones and cheerleaders than the side with fundamentalists like Tim Tebow and the Taliban, so folks should know where I stand, but to each their own. UncleBuck's point as far as I could understand was, there's really nothing wrong with gawking at cheerleaders or looking at pics of cheerleaders your friend sent you from Google. But if you're an executive with an NFL team and you have videos covertly taken, edited, and distributed of your naked employees that's way over the line and criminal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrenaline_Flux Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 58 minutes ago, mission27 said: Tbh though, why are cheerleaders there? To be gawked at by guys, making the NFL $$$. Some probably think the whole thing is creepy but lets call it what it is. Honestly I'd rather be on the side with Jerry Jones and cheerleaders than the side with fundamentalists like Tim Tebow and the Taliban, so folks should know where I stand, but to each their own. UncleBuck's point as far as I could understand was, there's really nothing wrong with gawking at cheerleaders or looking at pics of cheerleaders your friend sent you from Google. But if you're an executive with an NFL team and you have videos covertly taken, edited, and distributed of your naked employees that's way over the line and criminal. Just because a woman decides to be a cheerleader doesn't give you the right to objectify them on a football forum or anywhere else. and maybe, just maybe, making a joke about "who doesn't like to look at naked cheerleaders?!" is insensitive and creepy when this Gruden investigation stems from an investigation into the WFT and how they have treated their cheerleaders (which as someone else said, literally takes a 5 second Google search to find out the details on). also, just so we're clear, cheerleaders aren't there just to be gawked at. If you believe that that sounds like a you problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrenaline_Flux Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 I'm going to say this next thing just once, and only once, because I don't want to derail the thread and take it away from football, but I think it's important to say if we want to make sure this is an inclusive and safe environment for football fans. I do know and believe that Buck and anyone else in this thread do mean well. I do take issue with that initial joke (which Buck has acknowledged was insensitive after having details pointed out to him) and saying things like "we all find beautiful women attractive" and "cheerleaders are only there to be gawked at" as those are the type of things with toxic masculinity undertones that when in an unchecked setting like the NFL (where it's historically been a boys club; only within the past decade has there been more women in day-to-day activities and only the past decade has there been more consideration given to the LGBTQIA+ community) is what leads to people believing it's okay to treat women the way the cheerleaders have been treated and leads to people, like Gruden, thinking that the disparaging rhetoric they use in e-mails is perfectly okay and that there will never be any consequences for what they're saying and doing. I'm not trying to pile on anyone or say anyone is bad. I don't think anyone involved in this discussion here is bad. However, I do think there needs to be more careful consideration when it comes to the rhetoric used and the things we say and that we need to have the self awareness and ability to reflect on ourselves and have the empathy to try to think how our posts may read to someone else of a different background if they were to stumble upon it. If I were a woman thinking of joining Football's Future, would I really want to if the first thing I saw was that comment? If I were gay or asexual, how would I feel if I read a comment that insinuates everyone is attracted to beautiful women? These may seem like small comments and not a big deal, but it's the undertone that if left unchecked is dangerous and it's another case of intent vs impact. I know none of you have bad intent and I do know the intention is levity in the situation and it's well known that most people on this site are heterosexual men, but the impact is that they're insensitive comments and are ones that are triggering or off-putting for people who aren't in that majority on the site or on anyone who may stumble upon it and decide this website is not the one for them if that's the type of discussion and mindset being reflected and displayed by its users. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter2_1 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, mission27 said: Tbh though, why are cheerleaders there? To be gawked at by guys, making the NFL $$$. Some probably think the whole thing is creepy but lets call it what it is. Yeah it's kinda weird. I don't think they'll be around much longer, but we had this thing with removing grid girls from F1. Seemed out dated and they're just there to be gawked at by middle aged men, but when they interviewed a lot of them, they said they enjoyed the work, enjoyed the pay, didn't feel objected etc. Let's ask the people directly affected, is the fairest thing we can do. Edited October 14, 2021 by Hunter2_1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kramxel Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Since the NFL has already said, they won't be coming out with new emails, I'm guessing they're keeping them in stock, to see if everyone else falls in line, or just to pull the rug to whomever they don't like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-ALL-DAY Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 4 minutes ago, kramxel said: Since the NFL has already said, they won't be coming out with new emails, I'm guessing they're keeping them in stock, to see if everyone else falls in line, or just to pull the rug to whomever they don't like. That's assuming the leak is coming from someone the NFL can control. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kramxel Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Just now, J-ALL-DAY said: That's assuming the leak is coming from someone the NFL can control. I though that was pretty much official at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-ALL-DAY Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Just now, kramxel said: I though that was pretty much official at this point. I'm not positive of that. Why was the Gruden bit leaked in the first place? And then why did the Schefter part get leaked? What was the point of that? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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