Nzd07 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 I'd argue yes. I think Adrian Peterson is probably the most talented runner I've seen since Barry, but he had issues staying healthy, unlike Henry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Another point of comparison we can look at is how effective Brown and Henry were relative to the rest of the league. Henry's success comes at a time when NFL defenses are devoting the LEAST amount of resources to stopping the run in the entire history of the sport. This is because passing has become so incredibly effective. A Derrick Henry rush gains less yards per play than a Zach Wilson, Jared Goff, or David Mills pass. Meanwhile, in Jim Brown's era, the rushing attack was the dominant aspect of offense. In 1960 Jim Brown averaged 5.8 Yards per Rush, and the team that led the league in Yards per Play was... Cleveland at 5.8. INTs were thrown at a super high rate, so the average ANY/A for the league was 4.2 yards. In 1960, a Jim Brown run was close to one of the best plays you could run in the entire sport. In 2021, a Derrick Henry run is a mediocre play. In fact, it is below average. A Derrick Henry rush gains less yards than an average play by the Lions or Steelers, two putrid offenses. What distinguishes Henry is his insane workload and durability, so he's able to pile up a lot of cumulative stats. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DUKE Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 18 minutes ago, AngusMcFife said: Another point of comparison we can look at is how effective Brown and Henry were relative to the rest of the league. Henry's success comes at a time when NFL defenses are devoting the LEAST amount of resources to stopping the run in the entire history of the sport. This is because passing has become so incredibly effective. A Derrick Henry rush gains less yards per play than a Zach Wilson, Jared Goff, or David Mills pass. Meanwhile, in Jim Brown's era, the rushing attack was the dominant aspect of offense. In 1960 Jim Brown averaged 5.8 Yards per Rush, and the team that led the league in Yards per Play was... Cleveland at 5.8. INTs were thrown at a super high rate, so the average ANY/A for the league was 4.2 yards. In 1960, a Jim Brown run was close to one of the best plays you could run in the entire sport. In 2021, a Derrick Henry run is a mediocre play. In fact, it is below average. A Derrick Henry rush gains less yards than an average play by the Lions or Steelers, two putrid offenses. What distinguishes Henry is his insane workload and durability, so he's able to pile up a lot of cumulative stats. Thank you, I keep seeing all this goat talk and how amazing it is on social media, and don't get me wrong, Henry is a really good back, but the only thing that really stands out about him is his durability SO FAR. If he flames out from the workload in the next couple of years, then he's just another good back in NFL history. He's averaging 4.8 ypc this season. That's very good, but it's also 12th amongst RB in the league and 13th overall (Lamar Jackson #1 overall at 6.1 ypc). Huzzah to his durability and consistent production over that many carries, that IS remarkable, but I tend to think he's going to pay the price for this in the next 1-3 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43M Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 There is no modern day version of Jim Brown. Jim Brown was so far ahead of his time and a revolutionary player. He was almost literally a man among boys. Derrick Henry is a specimen....but not exactly revolutionary or a talent we have never seen before. I understand the direct player comparison....but what made Jim Brown EXTRA special was the fact that he on a different level than almost every player in his league. That being said, if prime Jim Brown played in todays league, I imagine he'd look alot like Derrick Henry. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Brown to Henry is a very good comparison...even though Brown is the GOAT. Maybe at ANY position. I'd love it if Henry wins MVP. With the OP on this one. Tired of QBs winning every year. 'Cause that's just stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43M Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Just now, Heinz D. said: Brown to Henry is a very good comparison...even though Brown is the GOAT. Maybe at ANY position. I'd love it if Henry wins MVP. With the OP on this one. Tired of QBs winning every year. 'Cause that's just stupid. While I would like to see another position win...I certainly wouldnt call it stupid. Most teams only go as far as their respective QBs take them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 minute ago, 43M said: While I would like to see another position win...I certainly wouldnt call it stupid. Most teams only go as far as their respective QBs take them. I get your point...but it's become such a pass-heavy league, with the rules slanted so far towards the QBs...I think the league would benefit from a more broad-minded appraisal of MVP. Let's be real, it wouldn't really change anything, substantially. If Miles Garrett gets 20 sacks--make him the MVP. Why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlowe22 Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 MVP should be a QB award, OPOY should be the best non -QB offensive player. They'll get recognition without being silly and pretending any position is more valuable than a QB. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diamondbull424 Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Heinz D. said: I get your point...but it's become such a pass-heavy league, with the rules slanted so far towards the QBs...I think the league would benefit from a more broad-minded appraisal of MVP. Let's be real, it wouldn't really change anything, substantially. If Miles Garrett gets 20 sacks--make him the MVP. Why not? Meh. If Miles Garrett gets 26 sacks, yet Mahomes finishes with 60 TDs, I’d give it to Mahomes, or Allen, or Brady, or Jackson, etc. JMO. Edited October 20, 2021 by diamondbull424 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said: Meh. If Miles Garrett gets 26 sacks, yet Mahomes finishes with 60 TDs, no give it to Mahomes, or Allen, or Brady, or Jackson, etc. JMO. Yeah...it's such a weird topic/argument. Realistically, right now, 26 sacks is by far the more impressive accomplishment than 60 TDs. It's hard to parse just what is what, and who should get rewarded for what. But...I still think the league should take a more leveled approach to MVP...and not just give it to a QB every year. That would almost certainly be beneficial to the league, as a whole. Give it to a WR! Whowouldathunkit!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diamondbull424 Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 (edited) In terms of the question, I think both RB are very comparable. Though I think Henry is better than Jim Brown. Just like I think Campbell was better than Jim Brown. Brown IMO is sort of overrated because he played in a league without the requisite talent/athleticism to stop him. Just like no one considers the GOAT QBs from that generation as legitimate GOAT QB options, neither do I consider Brown to be that dude. Conversely had Brown had access to the modern day sports medicine, I’d imagine he’d be a top caliber back in the league. In terms of style however, I do think Henry is comparable to Brown. Edited October 20, 2021 by diamondbull424 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diamondbull424 Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, Heinz D. said: Yeah...it's such a weird topic/argument. Realistically, right now, 26 sacks is by far the more impressive accomplishment than 60 TDs. It's hard to parse just what is what, and who should get rewarded for what. But...I still think the league should take a more leveled approach to MVP...and not just give it to a QB every year. That would almost certainly be beneficial to the league, as a whole. Give it to a WR! Whowouldathunkit!!!! I just think the QBs are the stars that drive the league now. They’re the position group, of the skill positions, to be the least likely to go down with an injury. They’re likely to have the longest pro career. So I disagree that it would be better for the league to spread the love with the MVP award. You want your top stars front and center to win the award. I think that does more for revenue and popularity of the league. So I think I’d simply keep the MVP more of a QB award, while OPOY becomes mainly a skill position award. DPOY remains the same. Then I’d simply add something like a Trenches award for the most dominant OL/DL in the NFL. Would allow the OL to get in on the action a little. Would be limited only to DT and OL so a guy like Myles Garrett wouldn’t qualify. Obviously Watt and Donald would’ve dominated, yet perhaps an Orlando Pace or Ogden might’ve had a shot at winning the award at some point in the past. I think some acknowledgment for the trench work could certainly benefit the league as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkippyX Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 Someone mentioned Wilt earlier and I think he is a good comparison for Jim Brown. Wilt averaged 30 and 22 for his career including 50.4 and 25.7 in year 3. In his first 7 years he averaged 39.6 and 24.8 Later in his career he was challenged to be more of a team player and his assists went way up. He led the league in assists in 67-68 (total assists, not per game) He was just a giant among men. Russell was the 2nd best center of the era at 6'10" 215. Wilt was 7'1" 275 This picture says it all on just how big Wilt was: Some people like to take shots at him because he did not beat the All-Star HoF roster team in Boston enough. This is like saying Ray Lewis did not win enough Super Bowls. 🤡 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awsi Dooger Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 Henry isn't anywhere near as agile or adaptable as Jim Brown. As others have mentioned, the league doesn't care about stopping the run these days. This is equivalent to raving about some NBA player who repeatedly sunk 3-point distance shots before there was a 3 point line. Be my guest. Fire away from out there all you want. All time running backs show it early. The raves are immediate. It's not 4th year in the league before your own team decides you need the ball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstar12 Posted October 20, 2021 Share Posted October 20, 2021 His durability and stamina is insane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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