O-7: Who Is a Building Block and Who May Not Be

[SimbaWho]

Spending big bucks at this juncture is risky. The talent pool is low on the team, not ready to compete or support any signings really even if a few big signings were made together, depth is so bad that if one of those guys/signings go down with injury we're right back where we started.

Doesn't mean don't sign anyone, or don't bring in a big talent on a 1 year deal but no reason right now to dedicate a lot of money when Lions are clearly at the very least 1 more year away from competing.

This was a dirty laundry year, everyone knew it, the guys running the show wanted to see what they had before they really started placing building blocks and moving guys/contracts around. They'll be a HUGE roster turn over next year. We'll see TONS of new faces.

Alim McNiell looks promising as a future starter. Jalen Maybin-Reeves is having a come to moment where he looks like an average starter. Tracy Walker is having a great year but is a guy I'm not sure we should pay and should move before injury, etc. 

Basically Lions are toughin it out and hoping to find a diamond in the rough at DB or, really basically anywhere. Injury's stole alot of the growth part all fans wanted to see at CB/Oline. Hope they're players at the TDL cause they need picks to build up cause they're lacking all over the board right now at every position group outside maybe punter.

[LionArkie]

3 hours ago, Sllim Pickens said:

Rosters turn over about every four years aside from a few key players.  Tampa Bay currently has 4 players on their roster that were there in 2017. The 2017 Super Bowl winning Patriots had about 3 players left from the 2014 super bowl team. Green Bay has 5 starters on their roster that were there in 2017.  Last year they had 8 starters that were there in 2017.  

Waiting for players to fully develop means they will be gone. Rookie contracts are 4 year deals. 3 years for the UDFA CBs we signed that are playing well. We currently have 12 players under contract for 2024 and one that includes Goff, Big V, and Romeo Okwara who all likely will be cut by then.  It does include a potential 5th year for Okudah but as of now he has not earned that. That will be the last year for all of our current rookies other than Sewell will have a 5th year option.  The only players we have under contract in 2025 are Ragnow and Decker with Sewell's 5th year option.  If you want to look at 2023, that will be the final year we have Flowers, Brockers, Swift, Cephus, J Okwara, Jonah Jackson, Parker and Jacobs. In 2023 this roster will look very different than it does now.  In 2022 this roster will look very different than it does now and we can compete.   This team can be playoff capable next year if rebuilt right.  We are 0-7 but our starting LT has not played a snap. Our best defenders are rookies better, and second year guys that are getting better.  Our best offensive weapons have 1 year (TJ Hockenson) and 2 years (Swift) remaining after this year on their current contracts.  We have 58 million in dead cap.  If we utilize that cap next year, along with another draft class, we can easily flip 0-7 to 11-6.   Think if this current team had 50 million more to spend.  

The ideas that teams take 5 years to build and then they should be good for a long time is just not true.  Rosters turn over quick in the NFL and its why every year a couple bad teams from the prior year make the playoffs the next year and why super bowl losers often don't make the playoffs the next year.  Its hard to build a sustainable team.  The ones that seem to be sustainable are those who have stud QBs on rookie deals or contracts that are less than 12% of the cap.  We likely have 3 years to win with the current players. After that, it will be a whole new group anyways.  

Bolded is the thing for me. We don't have those. I don't necessarily disagree with you, but who are we building around today? The OL, while a fantastic start and much needed they don't throw balls and they don't catch balls, nor do they tackle. I'm not saying to not address WR, because they should, I just think they should use FA to go after maybe a cheaper contract while they are building and build the team vs build a player.

[LionArkie]

Just to further what I'm saying, I agree you can't take five years. But with most teams taking 1-2 years to rebuild they have a few solid pieces in place. I don't think we do outside of the OL, which is not a bad place to start. Also we are not year 1, imo, we are year 0.  Next year is our real re-build year. So, I'm thinking around 2023 go for those bigger contracts and make your playoff push. No way I see it next year, nor understand why you would shell out that kind of money next year.

[jrry32]

On 10/28/2021 at 7:24 PM, diehardlionfan said:

Cephus is not going to be a number 1 guy. That doesn’t mean he can’t grow into a number two role. He’s shown some promise this year.

Respectfully, Cephus isn't a #2 imo. He's ideally a #4, maybe a #3 if you have a guy who can play inside and out.

[detroitroar]

Slayton may be available. I'd love to grab him for a low rounder.

[detroitroar]

6 hours ago, jrry32 said:

Respectfully, Cephus isn't a #2 imo. He's ideally a #4, maybe a #3 if you have a guy who can play inside and out.

I think Cephus can definitely be a number 2. He isn't there yet, but he's shown he can get deep, he works the middle well, and has great hands. 

[Nnivolcm]

2 hours ago, detroitroar said:

I think Cephus can definitely be a number 2. He isn't there yet, but he's shown he can get deep, he works the middle well, and has great hands. 

I have seen nothing from Cephus that makes me think I won't be thinking we need WRs as long as he is our #2. 

[jrry32]

7 hours ago, Nnivolcm said:

I have seen nothing from Cephus that makes me think I won't be thinking we need WRs as long as he is our #2. 

Yep. He doesn't get separation with consistency. And if you're not going to get separation, you need to be absolutely dominant in contested catch situations. Cephus isn't. He has good hands and can make some great catches, but he's not a guy who has a trump card or the ability to consistently win.

[Louis Friend]

Cephus is a solid #3 for me. And ARSB can be the slot WR with more playing time and targets. We still need a #1 and #2 WR, IMO. I think we draft a number one but I can see us addressing a solid #2 in FA. Like we did with Nate Burleson, Golden Tate and Marvin Jones. 

[Lions017]

On 10/30/2021 at 6:17 PM, jrry32 said:

Yep. He doesn't get separation with consistency. And if you're not going to get separation, you need to be absolutely dominant in contested catch situations. Cephus isn't. He has good hands and can make some great catches, but he's not a guy who has a trump card or the ability to consistently win.

Absolutely. Is he good enough to have on your roster? Sure. He can play inside and out. That's useful. The problem is that he doesn't do anything at an elite or even a great level. He's just decent enough at everything to be useful, but not good enough at anything to really be a dangerous weapon. 

[Louis Friend]

We don't really have a trade deadline thread going, but I think Brandin Cooks would be a nice target. He doesn't have a long big contract. We could get rid of him in '22 if needed, but he has history with Ray Agnew and Jared Goff. Would give us at least one short term target on offense to see what we have in Goff for another year or so. 

[Lions017]

2 hours ago, Louis Friend said:

We don't really have a trade deadline thread going, but I think Brandin Cooks would be a nice target. He doesn't have a long big contract. We could get rid of him in '22 if needed, but he has history with Ray Agnew and Jared Goff. Would give us at least one short term target on offense to see what we have in Goff for another year or so. 

I'm not sure...he's signed for one more year, right? So if you're going to give up a third round pick or whatever it would cost to get him, there's no guarantee that he will be around when this team enters its competitive window. He's way better than anything we have, but if he's fed up with the Texans for not winning...he'll hate it here. 

[Louis Friend]

4 minutes ago, Lions017 said:

I'm not sure...he's signed for one more year, right? So if you're going to give up a third round pick or whatever it would cost to get him, there's no guarantee that he will be around when this team enters its competitive window. He's way better than anything we have, but if he's fed up with the Texans for not winning...he'll hate it here. 

By most accounts, he's fed up with the Texans because they traded away Mark Ingram for a draft pick. Reportedly, hes a strong locker room guy. 

[Karnage84]

1 hour ago, Lions017 said:

I'm not sure...he's signed for one more year, right? So if you're going to give up a third round pick or whatever it would cost to get him, there's no guarantee that he will be around when this team enters its competitive window. He's way better than anything we have, but if he's fed up with the Texans for not winning...he'll hate it here. 

I think you could get him for a 5th or something. He probably would prefer to go to a more competitive environment but if he had to be on a bad team, I do think he'd prefer to be on one with a less toxic environment than what is going on down in Houston. 

Regardless of what you think of Sheila and the Ford's, Cal McNair seems like a real treat and the disaster that is the Deshaun Watson case just seems to add up to it. We just got punched in the mouth against the Eagles. It was a tough week coming after a very emotional challenge against Stafford and the Rams. It is what it is. I still see a team that (up until this week) has been fighting for their coaches and have been in most of these games, even when they shouldn't. The losing sucks but it feels like we are moving in the right direction. Going to take a while... but I feel like we'll get there. Could just be the kool-aid but we'll see.