Week 9 GDT: Raiders (5-2) at Giants (2-6)

[ronjon1990]

1 minute ago, NYRaider said:

Signing Jackson is 100% an incitement that the staff does not believe the other WR's, ie, Jones/Ateman/Stoner can fill Henry Ruggs role. We lost John Brown and Willie Sneed yet didn't sign anyone, why? Because the staff believed in Ruggs/Edwards/Renfrow.

Right.....because Zay wasn't on the active roster when we were only carrying 4 WRs prior to the trade deadline when we could have been wheeling and dealing for someone? 

Love how you totally lumped him in with 2 PS guys for the hell of it lol

[NYRaider]

Just now, ronjon1990 said:

Right.....because Zay wasn't on the active roster when we were only carrying 4 WRs prior to the trade deadline when we could have been wheeling and dealing for someone? 

Love how you totally lumped him in with 2 PS guys for the hell of it lol

Well Zay Jones gets a great chance this week like he did last year against the Bills and the Chargers. Hopefully he doesn't lay an egg in a loss like he did in those 2 games.

[ronjon1990]

Just now, NYRaider said:

Zay Jones has never produced, Nelson Agholor came in as a vet min free agent and was our #1 WR. Waller was someone we signed off the practice squad, Renfrow was a 5th round pick. I'd like to believe that our staff has a pretty good eye for who's doing well and we've seen those guys who have came out of nowhere produce in actual games like Waller, Renfrow, and Agholor. The biggest reason we drafted two WR in 2020 was because no one in 2019 stepped up, Zay literally produced nothing for us when he had a golden opportunity. And if we lose/the season goes poorly you will all be crying about how Carr didn't have enough talent around him.

And given that we lost literally 4/5 of our starting O-line and are making mid season signings to replace a starter and have absolutely zero run game...... we'll be correct. 

 

And when was Zay's "golden opportunity"? The 5 game stretch of 100% of the snaps you literally pulled out of your ***?

[NYRaider]

Just now, ronjon1990 said:

And when was Zay's "golden opportunity"? The 5 game stretch of 100% of the snaps you literally pulled out of your ***?

Zay Jones golden opportunity to earn playing time was in 2019 when we had Trevor Davis, Tyrell Williams, Hunter Renfrow (rookie), Marcel Ateman, Keelan Doss, and Rico Gafford at WR. He could've stepped up and helped our passing offense but didn't do enough at practice to be seen as a consistent starter and in games against great teams such as the New York Jets and Detroit Lions where he played over 90% of our snaps he had 5 receptions for 27 yards.  

Can you give me an example of when Zay Jones has played well for us?

[ronjon1990]

5 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Well Zay Jones gets a great chance this week like he did last year against the Bills and the Chargers. Hopefully he doesn't lay an egg in a loss like he did in those 2 games.

You mean the Chargers game where he played 53 whole snaps with a backup QB that threw 28 passes and we went heavy on the run game? 

I thought you said he had extensive playing time with Carr?

 

[NYRaider]

6 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

And given that we lost literally 4/5 of our starting O-line and are making mid season signings to replace a starter and have absolutely zero run game...... we'll be correct. 

Maybe in year 12 or 13 he'll get over the hump and become a franchise QB, just gotta hold on.

[NYRaider]

1 minute ago, ronjon1990 said:

I thought you said he had extensive playing time with Carr?

In 2019 Zay Jones: 

vs Lions (91% of snaps): 3 receptions, 21 yards, 1 TD

vs Chargers (67% of snaps): 1 reception, 10 yards

vs Bengals (71% of snaps): 3 receptions, 25 yards

vs Jets (90% of snaps): 2 receptions, 5 yards

vs Chiefs (69% of snaps): 2 receptions, 14 yards

vs Titans (84% of snaps): 1 reception, 5 yards

vs Jaguars (67% of snaps): 1 reception, 5 yards

vs Chargers (52% of snaps): 3 receptions, 14 yards

vs Broncos (82% of snaps): 2 receptions 21 yards

In 2020 Zay Jones:

vs Bills (89% of snaps): 4 receptions, 32 yards

A 10 game sample size with Carr, seems like we have a pattern?

[ronjon1990]

4 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Zay Jones golden opportunity to earn playing time was in 2019 when we had Trevor Davis, Tyrell Williams, Hunter Renfrow (rookie), Marcel Ateman, Keelan Doss, and Rico Gafford at WR. He could've stepped up and helped our passing offense but didn't do enough at practice to be seen as a consistent starter and in games against great teams such as the New York Jets and Detroit Lions where he played over 90% of our snaps he had 5 receptions for 27 yards.  

Can you give me an example of when Zay Jones has played well for us?

2019? When we got him in on the field in week 7 and he played 461 snaps for us through the rest of the year, averaging 46 snaps a game that would have been something around 69% of the snaps per game and received a grand total of 27 targets across 10 games? 

That "golden opportunity"?

[Jeremy408]

27 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

Yes, and? 

You don't get to have it both ways. Signing Jackson isn't an indictment on Jones so much as it is acknowledging that Stoner and Ateman were literally promoted from the practice squad because we had 3 active guys. 

And again, not a single person doubted that Zay would play less than Jackson or Odell or whomever we signed. 

 

On 11/2/2021 at 11:34 AM, NYRaider said:

I don't get the OBJ love. Huge cap hit this year, 2 yr/$30M left on his deal, for a WR who has 500 yards and 3 TD over the last two seasons combined.

 

On 11/5/2021 at 4:37 PM, NYRaider said:

If Mike Mayock and Mark Davis want to win this season, they have to put the full court press on OBJ.

@ronjon1990

[NYRaider]

Just now, ronjon1990 said:

2019? When we got him in on the field in week 7 and he played 461 snaps for us through the rest of the year, averaging 46 snaps a game that would have been something around 69% of the snaps per game and received a grand total of 27 targets across 10 games? 

That "golden opportunity"?

I'd say that playing 70% of a teams snaps that has limited talent at your position is a golden opportunity to prove that you can be a guy for that team in that offense. Michael Crabtree, Nelson Agholor, and Darren Waller were all viewed as busts or washed when we signed them. The difference is that when they got a chance to see the field, they actually produced. 

[NYRaider]

24 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

I did not want to trade for OBJ but clearly signing him as a free agent on a minimum deal vs taking on a huge multi year contract are completely different things, or does the salary cap not exist? 

 

Just now, Jeremy408 said:

 

@ronjon1990

Are your mother and father brother and sister?

[ronjon1990]

9 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Zay Jones golden opportunity to earn playing time was in 2019 when we had Trevor Davis, Tyrell Williams, Hunter Renfrow (rookie), Marcel Ateman, Keelan Doss, and Rico Gafford at WR. He could've stepped up and helped our passing offense but didn't do enough at practice to be seen as a consistent starter and in games against great teams such as the New York Jets and Detroit Lions where he played over 90% of our snaps he had 5 receptions for 27 yards.  

Can you give me an example of when Zay Jones has played well for us?

How bout this:

 

You show me where Zay played 5 straight games of 100% of the snaps. Hell, I'll cut you some slack too. Show me 5 straight games he's played for us where he played more than 75% of the snaps for us. 

Or, we can go your alternative excuse and look for catch %. Show me those 5 straight games (and I won't even make you show meaningful play time that you claim happened) anywhere in his career where he had the 100% catch rate you claim. 

You do either of those, I'll give you whatever example you want. 

[NYRaider]

1 minute ago, ronjon1990 said:

You show me where Zay played 5 straight games of 100% of the snaps. Hell, I'll cut you some slack too. Show me 5 straight games he's played for us where he played more than 75% of the snaps for us. 

Weeks 8 through 15 in 2019 he played over 2/3 of our offensive snaps: 91%, 67%, 71%, 90%, 69%, 84%, and 67%. Over that stretch he had 13 receptions for 85 yards.

[Jeremy408]

On 11/6/2021 at 4:37 PM, ronjon1990 said:

2019? When we got him in on the field in week 7 and he played 461 snaps for us through the rest of the year, averaging 46 snaps a game that would have been something around 69% of the snaps per game and received a grand total of 27 targets across 10 games? 

That "golden opportunity"?

You can't rationalize with someone who 

1. Presents out of context stats(some that aren't even accurate)

2. probably going to switch tomorrow if theyre wrong

3. Switch perspectives halfway through the week

4. Accuse you of saying stuff that you didn't say

5. Put you on the "do not reply list" when they get embarrassed

6. Probably never played football at any real competitive level other than turkey bowl or maybe flag

7. Tries to change the subject to make a point

It's the same pattern every time

Edited November 8, 2021 by Jeremy408

[ronjon1990]

Just now, NYRaider said:

Weeks 8 through 15 in 2019 he played over 2/3 of our offensive snaps: 91%, 67%, 71%, 90%, 69%, 84%, and 67%. Over that stretch he had 13 receptions for 85 yards.

Look, I know you're grasping for straws, but you claimed 100%. 

I said I'd be willing to settle for 75%. 

But 67, 71, 69, and 67 are all below that. 

Try again.