Talent vs. Character Concerns

[biggie.]

Let's say you have two prospects in the draft.

Player A is an athletic freak of nature and was thoroughly dominant in college, even against elite programs. However, he has barely passing grades and consistently gets into off the field trouble. Runs his mouth off too much on social media.

Player B is a model citizen. Played for all four years in college as a team captain and got stellar grades en route to his degree. However, he is physically limited and isn't the biggest playmaker.

With these in mind, who would you rather draft? Take the risk and go for the troublemaker with immense upside or the safer pick with a low ceiling?

Edited November 8, 2021 by biggie.

[TitanSlim]

Maybe because I’m scarred by the Isaiah Wilson fiasco but I’m going with Player B. 

[Blackstar12]

Depends if you already have a talented roster you take player B. If not I see why teams choose option A.

[NYRaider]

Depends on the locker room/organizational culture but I'm taking player A and doing the most to keep him in check.

[Bearerofnews]

A easily. 

[DontTazeMeBro]

1 hour ago, biggie. said:

he has barely passing grades

Don’t care at all. Theres no legitimate alternative to college football. And college in general is a scam.

1 hour ago, biggie. said:

Runs his mouth off too much on social media.

Don’t care that much about this either. People are too sensitive and that’s their problem.

1 hour ago, biggie. said:

gets into off the field trouble.

Now this could be an issue. If they’re beating the **** out of women. Stealing. Selling drugs. Committing sex crimes. Nope. Gotta stay away from that. Some fights. An unregistered glock. Running from the cops. I could get past that. But then you said consistently. So that would be tough. If he’s a good teammate with good work ethic I’d probably take him. It’s hard to find talent.

[biggie.]

2 hours ago, DontTazeMeBro said:

Don’t care at all. Theres no legitimate alternative to college football. And college in general is a scam.

Don’t care that much about this either. People are too sensitive and that’s their problem.

Now this could be an issue. If they’re beating the **** out of women. Stealing. Selling drugs. Committing sex crimes. Nope. Gotta stay away from that. Some fights. An unregistered glock. Running from the cops. I could get past that. But then you said consistently. So that would be tough. If he’s a good teammate with good work ethic I’d probably take him. It’s hard to find talent.

If he's slacking off in class, then why should NFL teams trust him to study film?

I agree with social media, but teams hate answering to the media over stupid stuff.

[Jakuvious]

Depends a bit on the position they play and where in the draft we're talking. I'm more inclined to go high ceiling low floor players the further in the draft you get. Some of the best Chiefs draft picks have been guys in that bucket for one reason or another. Trey Smith's health, Justin Houston's failed drug test, Tyreek Hill's arrest, etc. But that's way harder to justify when you're investing heavy capital in that player. First round pick I'd rather take the more sure thing, even if the ceiling isn't as high.

But I think position matters, as well. Edge rusher, WR, RB, and some spots and schemes for DB, your impact is so limited when you have an athletically lacking player. While some LB spots, some DT spots, OL, maybe even QB, I could settle with a less athletic player in exchange for a guy who understands his role and the scheme perfectly.

[DutchFalcon]

 

10 hours ago, DontTazeMeBro said:

Don’t care at all. Theres no legitimate alternative to college football. And college in general is a scam.

Don’t care that much about this either. People are too sensitive and that’s their problem.

Now this could be an issue. If they’re beating the **** out of women. Stealing. Selling drugs. Committing sex crimes. Nope. Gotta stay away from that. Some fights. An unregistered glock. Running from the cops. I could get past that. But then you said consistently. So that would be tough. If he’s a good teammate with good work ethic I’d probably take him. It’s hard to find talent.

That is a nice and draftable combination of extra curriculair activities. I really wonder in what world you live in that would deem this "things I can get past" as a GM. Someone who gets into fights a lot is clearly someone with some anger management problems. I'd reckon the odds of someone like that escalating into domestic abuse isn't that much of a stretch. Also nice to see that getting into fights is a-okay but hitting women is clearly over the line. How you'd want someone to respect the authority within a team and act accountable for their actions when they run from authority and aren't even accountable enough to register their firearm is a bit of a mistery to me. No amount of talent can fix stupid and someone with a rap sheet like that is undraftable imo.

That said I do think teams could do a lot more to support their more troubled players. How many times do you hear about players getting into trouble cause they went back to their old stomping grounds? Cowboys and Drez Bryant was a good example of how it is done imo.

With regards to OP. It depends on the lockerroom culture. I mean you can even get best of both worlds (Vic Beasley) and they could still bust because they lack love for the game itself.

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by DutchFalcon

[kramxel]

If A guy consistently gets into off the field trouble, he won't be playing much, and probably be out of the league in no time....

After that it really depends on your confidence in reigning that in: team culture, leadership, etc...

B guy really depends on how little upside does he really have, if we're talking draftable guys, he's not that "physically limited". Also, team captains tend to be high quality players, so maybe it's not that realistic of a scenario.

 

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by kramxel

[kramxel]

double post.

Edited November 9, 2021 by kramxel

[Hunter2_1]

B. How often do we see player A coming into the NFL and it not working? I'd draft player B and just get him doing what he's good at. Plug and play, a cog in the piece type. Surely he's worth somewhat of a damn.

[vikingsrule]

I’d lean towards adding player A if I had a strong locker room on a veteran team. Think Randy Moss joining that 1998 Vikes team. 
 

I’d avoid a player with a violent history but I feel like most everything else can be addressed with a strong locker room and support system if that player responds well in interviews. 
 

But a lot depends on draft position and current roster. I’m not interested in drafting players early who don’t have great physical talent but dominated in college and are good people. I get too many Laquon Treadwell vibes there. 

Edited November 9, 2021 by vikingsrule

[DontTazeMeBro]

7 hours ago, DutchFalcon said:

Someone who gets into fights a lot is clearly someone with some anger management problems.

You’re playing a game where people run into each other at 20 mph. Some of these people are going to be a little off.

 

7 hours ago, DutchFalcon said:

Also nice to see that getting into fights is a-okay but hitting women is clearly over the line.

A fight implies it’s mutual. So it wouldn’t be as bad as hitting a woman who didn’t hit you first. There’s actually some states with mutual combat laws. Recently in Chicago charges were dropped in a deadly gangland shootout because of those laws. 

7 hours ago, DutchFalcon said:

How you'd want someone to respect the authority within a team and act accountable for their actions when they run from authority and aren't even accountable enough to register their firearm is a bit of a mistery to me.

Well the team signs their paychecks. I feel like it might be easier for some people to respect the authority of the person putting food on their table. And the firearm thing I’ll get yelled at if I talk about it, even though I don’t consider the 2nd amendment a political issue. Although in several states you don’t have to register it. If you’re from Florida you might not know you need to do that in California.

Edited November 9, 2021 by DontTazeMeBro

[DontTazeMeBro]

15 hours ago, biggie. said:

If he's slacking off in class, then why should NFL teams trust him to study film?

Because they want to play in the NFL. If not because they love to play because they want to be rich. School is something they have to do so they can get to play in the NFL.