The factory of sadness is on the road @ Baltimore GDT Week 12.

[mrpazzo]

29 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

Yep, time to start trimming the fat.

Njoku, Hooper, OBJ, Landry and Higgins have accounted for like 50-52 ish million against the cap and we’re getting minimal production from these guys.

Not sure why you want to throw Njoku on the heap.  As inconsistent as he can be, he is one of the few guys on offense who is a physical beast on the team. (He is the guy who made a TD on 20yrd reception.)  A huge problem is that we don't have any receivers who scare people.   What are we going to do, sign an all new receiving corp in the off season and 2 new tight ends too on a team that prefers to run 3 tight end sets?  As a group we can live with our tight ends, they aren't great but they are functional in our scheme. We need to find a receiver that scares defenses and can make them pay when they stack the box all day long.  Obj did not work out, but he still stressed defenses and they had to account for him.  With the guys left, we don't have anyone that can get open, and more importantly, get open deep.  If the Browns had that kind of guy we could live with some sort of combination of the guys like Landry, DPJ Higgins etc.  It is hard to find quality receivers that are true number ones.  The Bengals got one this year.  Baltimore doesn't have one. Pittsburgh does with Chase Claypool.  The Browns haven't had one of those guys since Paul Warfield.  I know that history is not on Andrew Berry, I'm just saying it ain't easy to get one of those guys just cause the team spends a high draft pick.  

[buno67]

35 minutes ago, candyman93 said:

Austin Hooper needs cut after June. I’d get rid of Jarvis Landry because he can only get open if you scheme him open. I like Njoku, but he’s inconsistent.

 

Clean house with the skill position guys.

You tell Jarvis, we restructure to a more team friendly deal or your signing a cheaper deal with a new team...

ive been the biggest hooper apologists but I’m officially done with him. Only way I’m keeping him is if they swing a deal for Matt Ryan and that would Be a bad move iMo. 
 

only 3 skill players im Bring back besides Chubb and Hunt is DPJ and Schwartz. Felton is a RB for 

[MWil23]

I'd personally try to re-sign Njoku, I'd cut post June 1 or restructure Hooper, I'd try to restructure Jarvis and offer him more years with slightly more money spread out over time, while also having the flexibility to let him walk at some point, and I'd let Higgins walk because he's worthless and probably has an awful attitude.

Give me Njoku as our starting TE to go with Harrison Bryant and a draft pick (mid round guy), Landry as a pure slot, DPJ as an outside guy, a high draft pick or high valued free agent as our other WR/outside guy, and Schwartz can try to be a burner of sorts that I have zero expectations of in any capacity. 

[DawgX]

4 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

I'd personally try to re-sign Njoku, I'd cut post June 1 or restructure Hooper, I'd try to restructure Jarvis and offer him more years with slightly more money spread out over time, while also having the flexibility to let him walk at some point, and I'd let Higgins walk because he's worthless and probably has an awful attitude.

Give me Njoku as our starting TE to go with Harrison Bryant and a draft pick (mid round guy), Landry as a pure slot, DPJ as an outside guy, a high draft pick or high valued free agent as our other WR/outside guy, and Schwartz can try to be a burner of sorts that I have zero expectations of in any capacity. 

scrabble after reading that:

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

12 minutes ago, mrpazzo said:

Not sure why you want to throw Njoku on the heap.  As inconsistent as he can be, he is one of the few guys on offense who is a physical beast on the team. (He is the guy who made a TD on 20yrd reception.) 

Why include Njoku?  You said it yourself, consistency.  Sure he had the touchdown and he also got boxed out by a corner and ran down by a linebacker.

If you can’t win a jump ball against a guy 4 inches shorter or outrun a linebacker, those testing numbers don’t mean a ton.  
 

I’m not saying he sucks, but he’s a FA and I’m not sure he’s the kind of guy you break the bank for.  If they get rid of Hooper?  Ok, sure, can’t fix everything in one year.

12 minutes ago, mrpazzo said:

A huge problem is that we don't have any receivers who scare people.   What are we going to do, sign an all new receiving corp in the off season and 2 new tight ends too on a team that prefers to run 3 tight end sets?  As a group we can live with our tight ends, they aren't great but they are functional in our scheme. We need to find a receiver that scares defenses and can make them pay when they stack the box all day long.  Obj did not work out, but he still stressed defenses and they had to account for him.  With the guys left, we don't have anyone that can get open, and more importantly, get open deep.  If the Browns had that kind of guy we could live with some sort of combination of the guys like Landry, DPJ Higgins etc.  It is hard to find quality receivers that are true number ones.  The Bengals got one this year.  Baltimore doesn't have one. Pittsburgh does with Chase Claypool.  The Browns haven't had one of those guys since Paul Warfield.  I know that history is not on Andrew Berry, I'm just saying it ain't easy to get one of those guys just cause the team spends a high draft pick.  

We don’t need a guy who “scares” anyone per se, but at least a few guys who can beat single coverage/press. DPJ can, but he’s just one dude. Schwartz is fast, but I’ve yet to see a single football play from him all season.  He’s a track guy playing football until proven otherwise imo.

A starting caliber WR and a veteran depth WR in FA paired with a R 1/2 WR and a day 3 blocking TE and we’re in much better shape.

[buno67]

23 minutes ago, mrpazzo said:

ot sure why you want to throw Njoku on the heap

Because he is way too inconsistent as a pass catcher. He will make the tough catch but will drop the easiest passes in the world. His blocking is just as inconsistent as well.

I will say every tough catch he makes, he drops 3-4 balls to make up for it

he is also a one trick pony as a passer catching TE too IMO

Edited November 29, 2021 by buno67

[MWil23]

4 minutes ago, DawgX said:

scrabble after reading that:

Also Scrabble:

Never trust Ohio State in a big game against Michigan...

[DawgX]

Also, I said it yesterday... Wills has been a slight disappointment this season.

He struggled early in the season but we gave him more of a break since we knew he shouldn't be playing and he was still obviously much better than who replaced him while he was injured. But man, he still gets beat far too often for a top 10 pick. Maybe his ankle is still bothering him, but instead of improving from a very solid rookie year, he's regressed a bit.

Not saying he sucks, just that he hasn't been as good as expected. Hopefully it's just that he's not 100% healthy. Still room for growth and even if he doesn't improve you could do a lot worse at LT, but we've seen a lot of pressures come from him and Hance this season.

[MWil23]

3 minutes ago, DawgX said:

Also, I said it yesterday... Wills has been a slight disappointment this season.

He struggled early in the season but we gave him more of a break since we knew he shouldn't be playing and he was still obviously much better than who replaced him while he was injured. But man, he still gets beat far too often for a top 10 pick. Maybe his ankle is still bothering him, but instead of improving from a very solid rookie year, he's regressed a bit.

Not saying he sucks, just that he hasn't been as good as expected. Hopefully it's just that he's not 100% healthy. Still room for growth and even if he doesn't improve you could do a lot worse at LT, but we've seen a lot of pressures come from him and Hance this season.

My biggest issue with him coming out was that I personally thought he physically was maxed out. I think/thought he's an average starting LT in the NFL, and thus far he's shown that. Compared to the dumpster fires we had before him, still fine with the pick, but this is why I preferred Wirfs...but then again, I'm just a nonwordsmithian charlatan who wanted an elite OG when we need a LT, so what do I know?

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

Just now, DawgX said:

Also, I said it yesterday... Wills has been a slight disappointment this season.

He struggled early in the season but we gave him more of a break since we knew he shouldn't be playing and he was still obviously much better than who replaced him while he was injured. But man, he still gets beat far too often for a top 10 pick. Maybe his ankle is still bothering him, but instead of improving from a very solid rookie year, he's regressed a bit.

Not saying he sucks, just that he hasn't been as good as expected. Hopefully it's just that he's not 100% healthy. Still room for growth and even if he doesn't improve you could do a lot worse at LT, but we've seen a lot of pressures come from him and Hance this season.

Yeah, for sure.

I’m still bullish on the kid, and I say kid because he’s still just 22 until May ffs, but he’s been not good.

When you draft a guy in the top 10 they need to be good.  Don’t have to be great, but they need to be an “above average starter” at their position and he’s not that.  In fact, he’s been getting his arse whipped a good bit.  
 

Hance has been straight up bad, but, what does anyone expect?  Between Hance and now Conklin’s injury, I’ll be shocked if we don’t draft a T rounds 1-4.  I know Hudson is supposed to be a tackle, but I’m not seeing it with him.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

3 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

My biggest issue with him coming out was that I personally thought he physically was maxed out. I think/thought he's an average starting LT in the NFL, and thus far he's shown that. Compared to the dumpster fires we had before him, still fine with the pick, but this is why I preferred Wirfs...but then again, I'm just a nonwordsmithian charlatan who wanted an elite OG when we need a LT, so what do I know?

How on earth is a guy physically maxed out at 20 yo?

[DawgX]

2 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

My biggest issue with him coming out was that I personally thought he physically was maxed out. I think/thought he's an average starting LT in the NFL, and thus far he's shown that. Compared to the dumpster fires we had before him, still fine with the pick, but this is why I preferred Wirfs...but then again, I'm just a nonwordsmithian charlatan who wanted an elite OG when we need a LT, so what do I know?

Same here. But I was fine taking the guy who had a higher floor but lower ceiling in Wills instead of gambling on a higher upside/lower floor guy in Becton or Wirfs.

I guess I just thought he would take a bigger step in year two after having a very solid rookie year, where he transitioned to LT in a COVID-shortened offseason yet never really struggled too much.

Still think he'll likely turn out to be a plenty solid LT. I just brought it up because it doesn't seem like he's been talked about much this season despite him giving up pressures pretty consistently.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

The thing I’ve noticed about our OL without Conklin is just how much he means to the run game.

Come April I’d like to see them draft an absolutely people mover at RT and deal with the pass pro issues schematically. 

[DawgX]

4 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

Yeah, for sure.

I’m still bullish on the kid, and I say kid because he’s still just 22 until May ffs, but he’s been not good.

When you draft a guy in the top 10 they need to be good.  Don’t have to be great, but they need to be an “above average starter” at their position and he’s not that.  In fact, he’s been getting his arse whipped a good bit.  
 

Hance has been straight up bad, but, what does anyone expect?  Between Hance and now Conklin’s injury, I’ll be shocked if we don’t draft a T rounds 1-4.  I know Hudson is supposed to be a tackle, but I’m not seeing it with him.

Yeah, especially since Conklin is a free agent after next season anyway. And with all the money invested into our interior OL, we may need to find a cheaper replacement for Conklin. Not saying I don't want us to resign him, but we realistically may not be able to.

Seems like Hudson might be best suited as being the primary backup guard. Best case scenario is he replaces Hubbard as the primary swing tackle, but he sure isn't ready for that as of now. But he was a raw prospect, so I'm willing to give him more time.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

5 minutes ago, DawgX said:

Yeah, especially since Conklin is a free agent after next season anyway. And with all the money invested into our interior OL, we may need to find a cheaper replacement for Conklin. Not saying I don't want us to resign him, but we realistically may not be able to.

Yep, gotta have some affordable guys playing somewhere.

5 minutes ago, DawgX said:

Seems like Hudson might be best suited as being the primary backup guard. Best case scenario is he replaces Hubbard as the primary swing tackle, but he sure isn't ready for that as of now. But he was a raw prospect, so I'm willing to give him more time.

Yeah, which is cool because it’s always nice to potentially have a good backup there and a 4th rounder isn’t some absurd reach, but we need a TACKLE, specifically, and someone who’s ready to step in and play there, not a project.

I also get why with Hubbard for a year you’re comfortable giving the kid a redshirt season, but we won’t have that luxury next year.