2022 Free agency thread

[WindyCity]

7 minutes ago, soulman said:

Yes, I know how the cap works Windy but 2022 is when we may need more cap space to add those vets so many of you are disappointed we haven't signed yet.

We should already have stored a bundle of cap space for 2023 and a major increase in the cap will add more.  We need more players now not in 2023.

Are we sure we are going to spend the money?

Outside of Danny T and Tarik, which they had to do, they really haven’t done anything to protect 2022 cap space. They seem more focused on the 2023 war chest.

What year the money is in really doesn’t matter now that teams use void years to essentially make the cap one big rolling number.

Edited April 14, 2022 by WindyCity

[soulman]

4 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

Are we sure we are going to spend the money?

What year the money is in really doesn’t matter now that teams use void years to essentially make the cap one big rolling number.

Oh man.....ok let's do it this way then.

Poles has only been offering shorter term deals.  Mostly one year prove it types or two at most for a couple guys.  Some are vet minimum deals with very limited amounts of bonus money.  So in nearly all instances we're paying 2022 cash for these guys and all or nearly all of their money will hit the 2022 cap.

If we have $10 mil in cap and sign a guy for a $2 mil 2022 salary then that $2 mil comes right off the top and we're down to $8 mil after the signing.  So we're no longer offering funny money deals now with void years to get around that.  Right now we have roughly $12 mil (Top 51) of cap after allowing for rookie draftees.

Unless we start handing out multi-year deals with bigger signing bonuses we can amortize over 3-4 years $12 mil isn't a ton of cap space when you only have 60 players under contract and are looking to go to camp with 90.  The draft and UDFA will probably add 12-15 or maybe a few more but the rest will be vet FA.

We do pick up another $7.5 mil or so after June 1st so that will provide Poles with more ammunition then but in the end all of the deals will count and we'll need to be under the cap come September.  So will he spend the money.  He doesn't have a choice if he wants 90 players in camp come July.  He has to spend some.

[AZBearsFan]

1 hour ago, soulman said:

Unless we start handing out multi-year deals with bigger signing bonuses we can amortize over 3-4 years $12 mil isn't a ton of cap space when you only have 60 players under contract and are looking to go to camp with 90.  The draft and UDFA will probably add 12-15 or maybe a few more but the rest will be vet FA.

For what it’s worth only the top 51 salaries count against the cap. 

[JAF-N72EX]

A few points here:

1) Before free agency we had 10th most effective cap space in the league for 2022 and even more in 2023. So it's not as if we were tight on cap space to begin with. So I don't buy the whole idea that this was all about saving and creating space in the future since we already had it.

2) Cap space means nothing if you don't use it. They sat on their hands and did nothing with it, except for spending 24M on one of the best pass rushers in the league to play on another team. So where was the savings at again? And what was even the point in saving?

3) This team is looking less and less attractive to players in free agency next year, making all of that cap space you were creating mean even less. Nobody is gonna wanna come here unless you overpay them..... which is counterintuitive to the whole idea of saving in the first place.

 

[JAF-N72EX]

12 hours ago, WindyCity said:

I think it is far less big and epic than that.

I think a rookie GM struggled to execute his plan in his first free agency and didn’t do as much as he had hoped. Factor in the Pace mess he was working around, and I think it was more struggle than decision.

Alot of teams don't get the players they want and they still operate just fine. If not signing Larry was all it took to throw off his plans then he didn't have a good plan to begin with.

 

[WindyCity]

8 hours ago, soulman said:

Oh man.....ok let's do it this way then.

Poles has only been offering shorter term deals.  Mostly one year prove it types or two at most for a couple guys.  Some are vet minimum deals with very limited amounts of bonus money.  So in nearly all instances we're paying 2022 cash for these guys and all or nearly all of their money will hit the 2022 cap.

If we have $10 mil in cap and sign a guy for a $2 mil 2022 salary then that $2 mil comes right off the top and we're down to $8 mil after the signing.  So we're no longer offering funny money deals now with void years to get around that.  Right now we have roughly $12 mil (Top 51) of cap after allowing for rookie draftees.

Unless we start handing out multi-year deals with bigger signing bonuses we can amortize over 3-4 years $12 mil isn't a ton of cap space when you only have 60 players under contract and are looking to go to camp with 90.  The draft and UDFA will probably add 12-15 or maybe a few more but the rest will be vet FA.

We do pick up another $7.5 mil or so after June 1st so that will provide Poles with more ammunition then but in the end all of the deals will count and we'll need to be under the cap come September.  So will he spend the money.  He doesn't have a choice if he wants 90 players in camp come July.  He has to spend some.

Have we shown any indication that we are going to sign enough guys to top 51 deals to account for the fact that we have more than 20 million in effective cap space?

I don’t think 2022 cap space is going to have them holding off on a trade that could add valuable picks in this years draft. Otherwise they have to wait till next years draft.

Not having Quinn and not having the picks till 2023 would be a tough pill to swallow for this roster.

[WindyCity]

4 hours ago, JAF-N72EX said:

Alot of teams don't get the players they want and they still operate just fine. If not signing Larry was all it took to throw off his plans then he didn't have a good plan to begin with.

 

That is probably a very fair criticism.

1st time GM, walking into a messy cap situation, I think he probably had a lot of learning moments in this free agency.

[WindyCity]

4 hours ago, JAF-N72EX said:

A few points here:

1) Before free agency we had 10th most effective cap space in the league for 2022 and even more in 2023. So it's not as if we were tight on cap space to begin with. So I don't buy the whole idea that this was all about saving and creating space in the future since we already had it.

2) Cap space means nothing if you don't use it. They sat on their hands and did nothing with it, except for spending 24M on one of the best pass rushers in the league to play on another team. So where was the savings at again? And what was even the point in saving?

3) This team is looking less and less attractive to players in free agency next year, making all of that cap space you were creating mean even less. Nobody is gonna wanna come here unless you overpay them..... which is counterintuitive to the whole idea of saving in the first place.

 

1. Agreed, I think they wanted to spend money, it flopped, then they went to plan B which was to spend conservatively and not extend themselves.

2. I think they legit struggled to Land their top guys. I don’t think it was inaction, I think they took some Ls. Now we need to see them stabilize the roster with what is left. Maybe that happens after the draft. But they have gaping holes to fill.

3. If Fields looks legit even with less than stellar supporting cast, that would help.

But, you are correct, they will likely have to over pay for guys next year. They have the space to do it without hurting themselves long term. Far from ideal way to operate, but better than the Pace buying on credit plan.

[WindyCity]

To better summarize my point. Based on how Poles has operated 

2022 Draft Picks > 2022 Cap Space

[dll2000]

18 hours ago, AZBearsFan said:

He did, but FWIW Florio is also a click-baiting moron. 

I didn’t know who he was until I saw photo.   He would always pop up on my youtube feed in years past and I found I really didn’t like him. 

  One of few I took time to click and set to not interested.  

[dll2000]

33 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

To better summarize my point. Based on how Poles has operated 

2022 Draft Picks > 2022 Cap Space

Yes, but he could have added some nice young building blocks going forward in FA that weren’t too expensive.  

All the 1 year deals are going to leave a lot of work for next year and you aren’t spacing out contract expirations if you do heavy dose of FA in same year.  

Edited April 14, 2022 by dll2000

[WindyCity]

48 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

Yes, but he could have added some nice young building blocks going forward in FA that weren’t too expensive.  

All the 1 year deals are going to leave a lot of work for next year and you aren’t spacing out contract expirations if you do heavy dose of FA in same year.  

I was talking about waiting on trading Quinn for cap purposes.

I think they should have done more in free agency, they have left themselves drafting desperate.

Edited April 14, 2022 by WindyCity

[AZBearsFan]

21 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

they have left themselves drafting desperate.

It’s only desperate on the front office side if they see what’s available to them in the draft that they like more than FA (those already signed that they didn’t go for or one and those still out there) as being in limited supply. Their approach certainly suggests that they don’t see it that way.

If they thought Trai Turner or Ereck Flowers or whoever was a significantly better 2022 guard option than what they like in the draft do you really think they wouldn’t just sign them now? C’mon.

Could not most of these still available guys come in and immediately fill a top 3 WR role for us in 2022, at minimum as a bridge if they don’t land what they want in the draft or if the rookie wasn’t ready to start and be effective week 1?

Could not most of these still available guys come in and immediately fill a CB2 role for us in 2022, at minimum as a bridge if they don’t land what they want in the draft or if the rookie wasn’t ready to start and be effective week 1?

The desperation is yours, not theirs. 

[WindyCity]

48 minutes ago, AZBearsFan said:

It’s only desperate on the front office side if they see what’s available to them in the draft that they like more than FA (those already signed that they didn’t go for or one and those still out there) as being in limited supply. Their approach certainly suggests that they don’t see it that way.

If they thought Trai Turner or Ereck Flowers or whoever was a significantly better 2022 guard option than what they like in the draft do you really think they wouldn’t just sign them now? C’mon.

Could not most of these still available guys come in and immediately fill a top 3 WR role for us in 2022, at minimum as a bridge if they don’t land what they want in the draft or if the rookie wasn’t ready to start and be effective week 1?

Could not most of these still available guys come in and immediately fill a CB2 role for us in 2022, at minimum as a bridge if they don’t land what they want in the draft or if the rookie wasn’t ready to start and be effective week 1?

The desperation is yours, not theirs. 

The only guarantee is the draft. Those players don’t have options.

You can say that your just going to sign position X after the draft, but you still have to land those guys… which as we have seen isn’t guaranteed.

I think it is likely they can sign some veterans after the draft to fill some holes they miss in the draft. But post draft starter Shopping is a risky thing. If you miss, there is little you can do at that point to fill the hole.

Going into the draft with gaping holes is the definition of drafting desperate. 

Edited April 14, 2022 by WindyCity

[HuskieBear]

43 minutes ago, AZBearsFan said:

It’s only desperate on the front office side if they see what’s available to them in the draft that they like more than FA (those already signed that they didn’t go for or one and those still out there) as being in limited supply. Their approach certainly suggests that they don’t see it that way.

If they thought Trai Turner or Ereck Flowers or whoever was a significantly better 2022 guard option than what they like in the draft do you really think they wouldn’t just sign them now? C’mon.

Could not most of these still available guys come in and immediately fill a top 3 WR role for us in 2022, at minimum as a bridge if they don’t land what they want in the draft or if the rookie wasn’t ready to start and be effective week 1?

Could not most of these still available guys come in and immediately fill a CB2 role for us in 2022, at minimum as a bridge if they don’t land what they want in the draft or if the rookie wasn’t ready to start and be effective week 1?

The desperation is yours, not theirs. 

I think bringing Fuller back to be SS would work well