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Never early for mock offseason šŸ˜‚


LoganF89

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1 hour ago, Skinsin2013 said:

Our QB next year will be Deshaun Watson.

You heard it here first.Ā 

I hope youā€™re right, Iā€™ve wanted us to trade for him for months. Really, Iā€™ve wanted us to trade for him for even longer. The issue we run into is that DeShaun has a no trade clause and he hasnā€™t said that he wants to be traded to Washington.

Heā€™s said he would want to be traded to Carolina or Miami. I think those are the front runners for him. Heā€™s a guy who grew up in South Carolina, went to Clemson & has played & lived in Houston since he was drafted. Personally, I donā€™t think heā€™s interested in living in the north and living in & playing most of his games in cold weather.

Thatā€™s just my hunch by what heā€™s said about where heā€™s willing to be traded toĀ so far. He said he wouldnā€™t wave his no trade clause to go to Phila, Iā€™m not sure why he would do it to comeĀ to DC.

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On 1/10/2022 at 1:51 PM, Ghostnote said:

If Scherff is going to look for 13-14M a year, I would have no qualms of letting him walk. That is outrageous for a RG. This draft class is not loaded with interior offensive lineman, but could find a 2nd or 3rd round guy.Ā 

The current roster of free agent G's is a bit thin, but it's not terrible in terms of quality.Ā 

If all he gets is $13-14M, I would have him back in a heartbeat. Most observers seem to be putting his market in the $16-18M range, and I think it was Keim this morning who said he could command $20M/year. That is an outrageous price.Ā 

I think I have a different understanding or a differentĀ takeaway from a team like the Steelers (or the Ravens, who for my money are the better-run organization). I donā€™t see those teams letting their stars walk. I think theyā€™re perfectly willing to pay their elite players ā€œeliteā€Ā money. I think what they arenā€™t willing to do is pay solid starters ā€œvery goodā€ money. They know you can replace a solid starter if you have good depth, good coaching, and a good eye for talent. But you canā€™t easily replace stars and superstars. Putting aside QBs, star players are the currency of the league and the tentpoles you build everything else around.Ā 

To me, the question is whether Scherff is a star/elite player. And that question gets really tricky when you have to diminish his potential/projectedĀ impact based on the likelihood that he missesĀ games each year.Ā 

I think when heā€™s on the field, heā€™s at that level. Along with Trent Williams, heā€™s easily the most decorated Washington player in two decades. He is consistently well-regarded by the advanced metrics. And the teamā€™s W/L record disparity with and without him is truly staggering at this point. But he hasnā€™t played a full season since 2016, and heā€™s averaging just a hair over 11 games per season over that span. Thatā€™s enough of a consistent injury history to make meĀ too squeamish to pay him that $16-18M that I think heā€™s probably looking at from some team.Ā 

OnĀ some level, I think thereā€™s a chance he may be overestimating his market. Joe Thuney was a really good player with NE, he was a couple years younger than Scherff is now, and he had never missed a game (barely even a snap). And he got $16M exactly, on a contract that really breaks down more to a 3/$42M ballpark before they go back and re-work it. Scherff is the better player, Iā€™d say, and he plays the more valuable RG position ā€” but damn, thereā€™s value in being able to writeĀ that dudeā€™s nameĀ in pen at LG every Sunday.Ā 

The kicker here is the re-expansionĀ of the salary cap, which means there will be tons of availableĀ money chasing basically the usual number of FAs. So Scherff probably will get paid paid. Not that we need to spend any time worrying about it, because that Martin Mayhew comment at that presser means that Scherff is gone gone, as theyā€™ve already started the time-honored tradition of dumping on folks as they leave.Ā 

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On 1/11/2022 at 7:18 PM, turtle28 said:

I hope youā€™re right, Iā€™ve wanted us to trade for him for months. Really, Iā€™ve wanted us to trade for him for even longer. The issue we run into is that DeShaun has a no trade clause and he hasnā€™t said that he wants to be traded to Washington.

Heā€™s said he would want to be traded to Carolina or Miami. I think those are the front runners for him. Heā€™s a guy who grew up in South Carolina, went to Clemson & has played & lived in Houston since he was drafted. Personally, I donā€™t think heā€™s interested in living in the north and living in & playing most of his games in cold weather.

Thatā€™s just my hunch by what heā€™s said about where heā€™s willing to be traded toĀ so far. He said he wouldnā€™t wave his no trade clause to go to Phila, Iā€™m not sure why he would do it to comeĀ to DC.

The Texans have clearly stated that they want 3 first round picks. We cannot go downĀ that road again with sacrificing the future for a QB. Watson has issues and legal implications that could seriously blow up in our face. If he was clear of those issues, fine.Ā 

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On 1/13/2022 at 11:51 PM, Thaiphoon said:

I thought it was just me who detected that. Good to know others are having the same thoughts.

I don't have a problem with them being honest after the season about it. You have to let your fanbase knowĀ that you did everything in your power to retain the player.

The difference w/ the Cousins press conference was timing. Bruce did that press conference before training camp even started when Kirk was still on the team and he had to go out &Ā still play for the team that season knowing the team didn't want him andĀ wasn't going to offer him one of the best contracts in the NFL for QB when he felt he had earned it.

If Bruce had had that press conference in January/Feb of 2018 it would be been different IMO, but Bruce said what he said about Kirk & the contract situation in June/July of 2017 when Kirk turned down their best offer which wasn't even close to being one of the best offers for a QB in the NFL at the time.

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On 1/13/2022 at 11:52 AM, Slappy Mc said:

Pretty sure @aceinthehouse beat you by a couple months.

There were several QB's that came to mine before last yr draft. Watson and Rogers. Would love to have Watson but I was worried about his legal issues. However if I remember correctly back in June or July there was several potential trade deals one was two #1's and two # 2's and there was another two # 1's and a number 2 plus Sweat. I would definitely explore the possibilities. Would even kick the tires on R Wilson.

Ā 

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1 minute ago, 4209 said:

There were several QB's that came to mine before last yr draft. Watson and Rogers. Would love to have Watson but I was worried about his legal issues. However if I remember correctly back in June or July there was several potential trade deals one was two #1's and two # 2's and there was another two # 1's and a number 2 plus Sweat. I would definitely explore the possibilities. Would even kick the tires on R Wilson.

Ā 

They pretty much have set the bar at 3 firsts. Been reported that they were offered that too, anything less probably wont get it done. Also, he would have to waive his no-trade clause to come here. That would be a big sell IMO with everything that has gone on here.

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On 1/13/2022 at 12:51 PM, Ghostnote said:

The Texans have clearly stated that they want 3 first round picks. We cannot go downĀ that road again with sacrificing the future for a QB. Watson has issues and legal implications that could seriously blow up in our face. If he was clear of those issues, fine.Ā 

If it is trading up in the draft, absolutely not. Ā But if those three picks are for Deshaun Watson, in the prime of his career? Ā Absolutely. Ā I make that trade 11 times out of 10, especially with the roster we have. Ā 

Look, I get that it's not perfect. Ā But a great QB, and Watson is that, elevates you. Ā Re-sign McKissic, and RB is good for another season. Ā Obviously, we all want a #2 receiver, but a healthy Samuels, an extended McLauren with a legit QB throwing the ball to him looks mighty good to me, especially with the resources we've invested in the draft there. Ā TE looks solid for next season with Thomas and Bates. Ā Our OL finished the year ranked pretty high via PFF and ESPN both in terms of pass protection, despite being down to a fourth string C, third strong guards and fourth string tackles at times. Ā A unit of Leno/Flowers/Roullier/Schweitzer/Cosmi, coached by one of the best in the game, will do fine for Watson. Ā 

On defense, you have to hope 2021 was an aberration because the talent is there.Ā  You can use DaRon Payne to hopefully knock one of those first rounders off the trade, or use him to trade for a 2nd rounder or another player at WR, LB or OL. Ā Allen, Young and Sweat are just fine at DL, and hopefully Settle is brought back if Payne is used as trade bait. Ā Linebacker needs work. Ā In the secondary, I wish we would go to man coverage, but I think the team is happy with Jackson, St Juste and Fuller for another season. Ā I imagine Collins is gone, Curl starts at SS and we need a center fielder through free agency, as well as a MLB. Ā 

With those guys, Watson probably makes this a 10-11 win team instantly, with the ceiling to be much better. Ā Factor in at least one of those first rounders, probably this year, is spent on a QB, one who probably will not be as good as Watson, and I think it's the best investment we could possibly make. Ā 

You bring in Watson, Marcus Williams at FS, and DeVondre Campbell at MLB, and that would be a damn successful off-season and fix the top three positions that need it, at least in my opinion. Ā 

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On 1/10/2022 at 8:20 AM, MikeT14 said:

A lot of us seem to have us spending a crap ton of money on WR again. So we're going to spend all that money on Samuel and JuJu? We gonna pay Terry too? If so are we really going to have $40+ million (who knows, maybe more) tied up per season in WRs?

Agreed, we have McLauren who has to get paid, and the hope has to be Samuel is healthy, plus the investment into Dyami Brown, who also suffered through injury. Ā 

If they got someone on a 1 year prove it deal, I could see it happening, but I can't see a big contract handed out at WR. Ā More than likely, another Humphries deal to bring in a veteran. Ā 

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On 1/12/2022 at 11:32 AM, e16bball said:

If all he gets is $13-14M, I would have him back in a heartbeat. Most observers seem to be putting his market in the $16-18M range, and I think it was Keim this morning who said he could command $20M/year. That is an outrageous price.Ā 

I think I have a different understanding or a differentĀ takeaway from a team like the Steelers (or the Ravens, who for my money are the better-run organization). I donā€™t see those teams letting their stars walk. I think theyā€™re perfectly willing to pay their elite players ā€œeliteā€Ā money. I think what they arenā€™t willing to do is pay solid starters ā€œvery goodā€ money. They know you can replace a solid starter if you have good depth, good coaching, and a good eye for talent. But you canā€™t easily replace stars and superstars. Putting aside QBs, star players are the currency of the league and the tentpoles you build everything else around.Ā 

To me, the question is whether Scherff is a star/elite player. And that question gets really tricky when you have to diminish his potential/projectedĀ impact based on the likelihood that he missesĀ games each year.Ā 

I think when heā€™s on the field, heā€™s at that level. Along with Trent Williams, heā€™s easily the most decorated Washington player in two decades. He is consistently well-regarded by the advanced metrics. And the teamā€™s W/L record disparity with and without him is truly staggering at this point. But he hasnā€™t played a full season since 2016, and heā€™s averaging just a hair over 11 games per season over that span. Thatā€™s enough of a consistent injury history to make meĀ too squeamish to pay him that $16-18M that I think heā€™s probably looking at from some team.Ā 

OnĀ some level, I think thereā€™s a chance he may be overestimating his market. Joe Thuney was a really good player with NE, he was a couple years younger than Scherff is now, and he had never missed a game (barely even a snap). And he got $16M exactly, on a contract that really breaks down more to a 3/$42M ballpark before they go back and re-work it. Scherff is the better player, Iā€™d say, and he plays the more valuable RG position ā€” but damn, thereā€™s value in being able to writeĀ that dudeā€™s nameĀ in pen at LG every Sunday.Ā 

The kicker here is the re-expansionĀ of the salary cap, which means there will be tons of availableĀ money chasing basically the usual number of FAs. So Scherff probably will get paid paid. Not that we need to spend any time worrying about it, because that Martin Mayhew comment at that presser means that Scherff is gone gone, as theyā€™ve already started the time-honored tradition of dumping on folks as they leave.Ā 

Great point on the Ravens. Ā You see them extend a player like Ronnie Stanley, an elite OT, but let Orlando Brown, their RT, walk because they have his replacement drafted. Ā Same at OG, and same along the interior of the DL and LB. Ā They almost always take an OL with a Day 1 or 2 pick, and have the next player ready to go. Ā 

Problem with Scherff, and it's the same problem we had with Trent Williams as well, is that you need to rely on the player for 16 games, and you just can't rely on him to be there. Ā And with that, I let him walk. Ā Some team will pay him, but it shouldn't be us. Ā 

Oh, and when I first heard about that press conference, I thought the same thing. Ā It is par for the course with this team. Ā It is a directive from Danny at this point, and it doesn't matter if you are Bruce Allen or a paragon of virtue like Rivera, the stink will change you. Ā 

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On 1/10/2022 at 10:15 AM, RSkinGM said:

I assume bye bye Scherff ! too costly. Who will pay him what he wanst - going to be very intersting !

Scherff is a joke. He doesn't want to be here - just like K Cousins. INCREDIBLY overrated .... wish him a long career, just not on this team.

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On 1/10/2022 at 3:31 PM, turtle28 said:

I have no problem with going into the season w/ Flowers & Schweitzer as the startersĀ with Charles as their main backup plus a mid to late round guy weā€™d draft to develop behind those 3. I think we have 2 guys who are good starters, a young guy developing as depth & we could add another young guy to develop as depth in the mid to late rounds as well.

We should continue the trend of signing Bears O-Lineman... and grab James Daniels. He is a stud; and clearly, Nagy's cru didn't have great O-Line coaches. Leno and Lucas have been legit studs in DC.Ā 

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On 1/16/2022 at 6:54 PM, naptownskinsfan said:

Great point on the Ravens. Ā You see them extend a player like Ronnie Stanley, an elite OT, but let Orlando Brown, their RT, walk because they have his replacement drafted. Ā Same at OG, and same along the interior of the DL and LB. Ā They almost always take an OL with a Day 1 or 2 pick, and have the next player ready to go. Ā 

Problem with Scherff, and it's the same problem we had with Trent Williams as well, is that you need to rely on the player for 16 games, and you just can't rely on him to be there. Ā And with that, I let him walk. Ā Some team will pay him, but it shouldn't be us. Ā 

Oh, and when I first heard about that press conference, I thought the same thing. Ā It is par for the course with this team. Ā It is a directive from Danny at this point, and it doesn't matter if you are Bruce Allen or a paragon of virtue like Rivera, the stink will change you. Ā 

The Ravens didnā€™t just let Orlando Brown, Jr. walk, they traded him for a 1st round pick to the Chiefs. This is where the WFT franchise screws up so much!

There have been 3 players over the last 5 years that wouldnā€™t re-sign here/wanted out Ā and the 3 of them shouldā€™ve been seen as assets that we could trade to get back high picks to helpĀ us rebuild this team through the draft.

1. Kirk Cousins, he shouldā€™ve been traded before the 2017 season to the highest bidder. Maybe we donā€™t get back a first but I think we wouldā€™ve and we definitely wouldā€™ve gotten back multiple picks.

2. Bruce shouldā€™ve trade Trent when he refused to play in 2019. He couldā€™veĀ been traded for at worst a 2nd round pick and a mid-round pick and Bruce wouldnā€™t do it.

3. Same thing with Scherff, he shouldā€™ve been traded by Rivera in the 2020 offseason after franchised him for at worst a 3rd round pick - probably a 2nd - and other picks.

We couldā€™ve traded these 3 players for 3 good/greatĀ picks and 3 mid round picks over the last 5 seasons. Instead weā€™re going to end up with just a 3rd round comp for Cousins, only a 3rd & 5th for our perennial and now 49er All-Pro LT Trent and probably only a comp pick for Scherff too.
Ā 

Thatā€™s a franchise which has zero forward vision. Itā€™s a franchise who really really failed to seize the opportunity they had to acquire more good picks and other picks to rebuildĀ this team for the future over the last 5 years.

Itā€™s just a damn shame.

I will say that Washington has done lately what Baltimore & other good teamsĀ haveĀ done historically in drafting OL, DL & LBs with day 1 or 2 picks.

I mean you can just go back through the last 5 or 6 drafts and you see it. So weā€™re doing that.

2014: Murphy, Moses, Long

2015: Scherff, P. Smith, Kouandjio, Spaight, ReitlerĀ 

2016: Ioannidis, Steven DanielsĀ 

2017: J. Allen, R. Anderson, Roullier, Harvey-Clemons

2018: Payne, Christian, Settle, Dion-Hamilton

2019: Sweat, W. Martin, Ross P, Holcomb, Brailford

2020: Young, Charles, Ismael, Hudson, Smith-Williams

2021: Davis, Cosmi, Bradley-King, ToneyĀ 

So, I see a franchise whoā€™s trying to invest in the OL, DL & at LB. Now, they need to do more of that for sure - especially at LB - but, we canā€™t say they havenā€™t tried.

Edited by turtle28
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