2022 Offseason and FA Talk

[Bobby816]

2 minutes ago, NewAge said:

I wonder if it is 10 for Deebo, the Jets can get a mid round pick in the deal. The 49ers have two late third rounders that according to the old trade value chart would only devalue the 10th pick down a couple slots. 

KT at 4, 35 and that late third to move back into the first for Linderbaum, Brisker at 38. 

Comes down to if SF wants quality or quantity. We’re one of a few teams that can offer both.

[.Buzz]

26 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I agree. I think it’s DET or HOU that might take him. You guys are pretty good at drafting DEs. And Walker doesn’t fit the profile you’ve previously drafted with success

Don’t think Walker really fits the profile of any of the recently drafted DL/edges tbh. Kind of a rare breed with his athletic profile and length/size. Just all depends what you think he can do with more consistent reps/allow him to pin his ear backs when rushing the passer (which he wasn’t asked to do at Georgia often).

If we’re using Baalke and his draft history of DL, he definitely loves the length. Buckner, Armstead, etc. Think that’s at least noteworthy.

[Bobby816]

1 hour ago, .Buzz said:

Don’t think Walker really fits the profile of any of the recently drafted DL/edges tbh. Kind of a rare breed with his athletic profile and length/size. Just all depends what you think he can do with more consistent reps/allow him to pin his ear backs when rushing the passer (which he wasn’t asked to do at Georgia often).

If we’re using Baalke and his draft history of DL, he definitely loves the length. Buckner, Armstead, etc. Think that’s at least noteworthy.

He’s Solomon Thomas who we signed this off-season 

[.Buzz]

44 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

He’s Solomon Thomas who we signed this off-season 

Don’t find their games/style of play very similar at all. Solomon Thomas didnt move outside at Stanford much and was viewed as a tweener as well. 

Walker being versatile doesn’t make him one in the same imo.

Edit: Solomon Thomas also wasn’t a Baalke pick fwiw.

[Bobby816]

40 minutes ago, .Buzz said:

Don’t find their games/style of play very similar at all. Solomon Thomas didnt move outside at Stanford much and was viewed as a tweener as well. 

Walker being versatile doesn’t make him one in the same imo.

Edit: Solomon Thomas also wasn’t a Baalke pick fwiw.

I was meaning their playing styles and hype being the same. And I can see Walker’s  career going like Thomas’ has… a disappointment. 

[.Buzz]

7 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I was meaning their playing styles and hype being the same. And I can see Walker’s  career going like Thomas’ has… a disappointment. 

Mind going into more detail on their play style being similar? Can’t say I see that whatsoever. 

Travon Walker was top 10 on Bruglers board and top 15 on Daniel Jeremiah’s board coming in prior to the combine/off-season shoot up as well. When you put up unseen type of athletic scores at 6’5, 275 with a 35 inch+ wing span it’s obviously going to shoot you up boards, and even more so in a draft where the top has zero consensus and widely viewed as the top 10-15 being similarly graded.

[Bobby816]

9 minutes ago, .Buzz said:

Mind going into more detail on their play style being similar? Can’t say I see that whatsoever. 

Travon Walker was top 10 on Bruglers board and top 15 on Daniel Jeremiah’s board coming in prior to the combine/off-season shoot up as well. When you put up unseen type of athletic scores at 6’5, 275 with a 35 inch+ wing span it’s obviously going to shoot you up boards, and even more so in a draft where the top has zero consensus and widely viewed as the top 10-15 being similarly graded.

They're similar in their playing style. In between DE/DT type players. Both rated high. But really don’t have a spot. Walker from what I can remember was not rated nearly as high as he is now pre combine. Yes there might have been a few mocks that liked him. But generally he was no where near a top 10 guy. Never mind top 5.

 

Whats the excuse for him not producing when he had stars all around him? He’s a workout warrior that has no business being a top 20 pick. I’d rather 10 DEs than him.

[.Buzz]

28 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

They're similar in their playing style. In between DE/DT type players. Both rated high. But really don’t have a spot. Walker from what I can remember was not rated nearly as high as he is now pre combine. Yes there might have been a few mocks that liked him. But generally he was no where near a top 10 guy. Never mind top 5.

 

Whats the excuse for him not producing when he had stars all around him? He’s a workout warrior that has no business being a top 20 pick. I’d rather 10 DEs than him.

I mean I don’t disagree that they both moved inside and outside at times and both were terrific athletically, but their actual play styles/strengths and weaknesses coming out don’t really coincide to me?

As far as production, that’s what he was asked to do. They didn’t have him pin his ears back like the other top edges. He was tied for the team lead in sacks and that whole Georgia defense is loaded (Carter likely is a top 3 pick when he comes out and he finished with 3).
 

Just would prefer this organization in particular to go the more safe route.

[KingOfNewYork]

1 hour ago, .Buzz said:

I mean I don’t disagree that they both moved inside and outside at times and both were terrific athletically, but their actual play styles/strengths and weaknesses coming out don’t really coincide to me?

As far as production, that’s what he was asked to do. They didn’t have him pin his ears back like the other top edges. He was tied for the team lead in sacks and that whole Georgia defense is loaded (Carter likely is a top 3 pick when he comes out and he finished with 3).
 

Just would prefer this organization in particular to go the more safe route.

I don’t wanna speak for Bobby but I think it’s more that Walker doesn’t have a defined strength that you can count on to an extent. Like Hutch and Thibs we know if you allow them to pin their ears back and attack they are going to produce. That’s even the case for guys like Johnson, Karlaftis, Sanders, etc…

With Walker it’s so much of a projection is he a true edge? Can he make plays consistently off the edge? Is he a guy that will have to shift inside to really dominate using his athletic advantages? So many questions and almost no answers. And then looking at his profile it screams question mark at this level. Now a 6’5 275 guy who can set the edge, get a sack on 3rd down and move around the DL is intriguing but that’s all it is so I agree with your premise that going with the safe pick makes more sense for both you guys and us.

[rickyt31]

Yeah, lock me in for Thibo & Jamo for 4/10. If Jamo is gone, trade for Deebo. Trade back #10 and then grab Stingley, Hamilton, Lloyd, or Linderbaum. I'm good after that. 

[KingOfNewYork]

For our defense we need our Bosa, our Avril, etc…Walker isn’t that. Can he be a Michael Bennett or an Armstead? Maybe but we have that in JFM. Easy pass for me. 

[.Buzz]

41 minutes ago, KingOfNewYork said:

I don’t wanna speak for Bobby but I think it’s more that Walker doesn’t have a defined strength that you can count on to an extent. Like Hutch and Thibs we know if you allow them to pin their ears back and attack they are going to produce. That’s even the case for guys like Johnson, Karlaftis, Sanders, etc…

With Walker it’s so much of a projection is he a true edge? Can he make plays consistently off the edge? Is he a guy that will have to shift inside to really dominate using his athletic advantages? So many questions and almost no answers. And then looking at his profile it screams question mark at this level. Now a 6’5 275 guy who can set the edge, get a sack on 3rd down and move around the DL is intriguing but that’s all it is so I agree with your premise that going with the safe pick makes more sense for both you guys and us.

I mean he does, he likely ends up being an impact run defender pretty much right out of the gate. I realize that’s not something you draft with a top 5 pick but if you believe as an organization if you let him loose and allow him to get after the passer on a consistent basis and unlock that part of his game as well he has the highest ceiling in the draft imo.

But yes, there’s higher risk banking on him at edge/as a pass rusher than either of those two you mentioned, and I also love Jermaine Johnson from a pass rush perspective. But as I said, JJ was stuck behind Walker and co. at Georgia and decided to transfer out to get more PT/showcase his ability when he’s allowed to “pin his ears back”. Think that’s interesting as well.

[KingOfNewYork]

4 hours ago, .Buzz said:

I mean he does, he likely ends up being an impact run defender pretty much right out of the gate. I realize that’s not something you draft with a top 5 pick but if you believe as an organization if you let him loose and allow him to get after the passer on a consistent basis and unlock that part of his game as well he has the highest ceiling in the draft imo.

But yes, there’s higher risk banking on him at edge/as a pass rusher than either of those two you mentioned, and I also love Jermaine Johnson from a pass rush perspective. But as I said, JJ was stuck behind Walker and co. at Georgia and decided to transfer out to get more PT/showcase his ability when he’s allowed to “pin his ears back”. Think that’s interesting as well.

The thing with his strength being an impact run defender is how much he benefited from Davis and Wyatt on the interior. Essentially you’re drafting a guy but not doing anything with him that made him great, they’re projecting what he can be with NFL coaching and I get that’s 90% of the draft but at the top there’s gotta be some sense of certainty. Luckily for the Jags they do need run defense since the two best teams in your division are led by Henry and Taylor.

[.Buzz]

8 hours ago, KingOfNewYork said:

The thing with his strength being an impact run defender is how much he benefited from Davis and Wyatt on the interior. Essentially you’re drafting a guy but not doing anything with him that made him great, they’re projecting what he can be with NFL coaching and I get that’s 90% of the draft but at the top there’s gotta be some sense of certainty. Luckily for the Jags they do need run defense since the two best teams in your division are led by Henry and Taylor.

I mean we can pretty much chalk up all those guys on Georgia being dinged for having crazy freaks all around them in that case.

Not really trying to get you off your view, I get what you mean and especially for what the Jets have lacked/need (a consistent pass rush presence) for a long time now I think I’d prefer the more advanced pass rusher in Thibs, all I’m saying is there’s good reason why he’s in the conversation (and imo the pick at 1, even though again I prefer Hutch) in my opinion. If we pass I’d imagine he still gets locked in the top 5 somewhere, potentially #2 if we went Hutch. From a pure pass rush perspective there’s a good bit of projection, just think he also isn’t as risky as some think. That clip from the co-DC peels back the curtains a bit.

[JetsandI]

8 hours ago, KingOfNewYork said:

The thing with his strength being an impact run defender is how much he benefited from Davis and Wyatt on the interior. Essentially you’re drafting a guy but not doing anything with him that made him great, they’re projecting what he can be with NFL coaching and I get that’s 90% of the draft but at the top there’s gotta be some sense of certainty. Luckily for the Jags they do need run defense since the two best teams in your division are led by Henry and Taylor.

 

I am pretty sure that Walker played larger of game snaps than Davis and Wyatt so I don't think Walker got major benefit from those DT.  Still, UGA had a full package of defense where Walker didn't need to unleash all of his hidden skill sets.  Alabama has been there and enough of their DL and LB have NFL success.

Still, having him in top 10 is a little rich for me.

Edited April 25, 2022 by JetsandI