K-Ro 25 Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Why isn't he getting more publicity? Can someone please explain to me? His improvements as a passer in just one year has been a surprise. It's to the point where I expect him to go in the top 20 in the draft. He's the second best playmaker in the draft and has shown clear advancements in his passing skills. Ball placement isn't great and there will be arm questions like there was with Watson, but the skills are apparent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elusive_Tiger Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 People sleeping on him just like Watson last year. Gonna prove all the detractors wrong. I think he has the highest ceiling in the class. He's cemented himself as QB2 right now for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokeybandit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 He puts up stats but doesn't lead his team to wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyler735 Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 29 minutes ago, smokeybandit said: He puts up stats but doesn't lead his team to wins. Agreed, I remember Dan Marino always had those pretty stats, but just couldn't lead his team to the Super Bowl. He definitely wasn't anywhere near the true greats like Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elusive_Tiger Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 54 minutes ago, smokeybandit said: He puts up stats but doesn't lead his team to wins. Oh you must have forgotten how little talent he has around him. Lamar is like the whole team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-Ro 25 Posted November 3, 2017 Author Share Posted November 3, 2017 33 minutes ago, tyler735 said: Agreed, I remember Dan Marino always had those pretty stats, but just couldn't lead his team to the Super Bowl. He definitely wasn't anywhere near the true greats like Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson, etc. Lamar Jackson's recieiers lead CFB in dropped ball %... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyler735 Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 1 minute ago, K-Ro 25 said: Lamar Jackson's recieiers lead CFB in dropped ball %... I'm aware. I'm one of the biggest Lamar Jackson advocates on this forum. My response was complete sarcasm in reference to how absurd it is to place team accomplishments solely on the QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncosFan2010 Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 I am not even a Lamar fanboy and think he has legit issues, mostly stemming from his proclivity to running, but when all is said and done, he should be a top 5 pick. I expect Darnold, Rosen and Lamar to all go within the first five picks. The idea that Josh Allen is still spoken about in that same second tier with Lamar is pure nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalhounLambeau Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 I think it depends on what kind of attention you're talking about. Among draft people he's always discussed constantly. If you're talking about just the general bubble of society there are many factors. This is the third year of him destroying CFB individually and his team not really going anywhere. On top of that he won the Heisman and got a years worth of attention in one month last year. There may be some general fatigue of discussing the same thing for a third year in a row. Not to mention he's a quiet guy who doesn't go out of his way to be social. Couple that with Josh Rosen, Baker Mayfield, and Sam Darnold who all play at more high-profile programs who demand a lot of QB attention. Not to mention Josh Allen who is another constantly discussed "non-traditional" QB prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedTheClock Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 2 hours ago, smokeybandit said: He puts up stats but doesn't lead his team to wins. This is the worst argument ever and I see it all the time. Lamar Jackson isn't able to play defense. Or block. That's his fault? I don't disagree that he may not be worthy of a top 5 pick, but the "he doesn't lead his team to wins" argument needs to die. Lamar Jackson is an all-or-nothing prospect that I guess I'd take a flier on in the early 1st round if you need to dream big at the QB position. I'd probably draft him in the top 5 based on my teams circumstances, but I'd be willing to accept the fact that this could turn out poorly. It's more the system that he plays in that makes me question his transition. I want to see him work the intermediate game against man coverage, which is not a part of that offense. They pick apart underneath zones, run the football, and take deep shots. Nothing against the offense because it does work in college, but NFL teams are going to play press man and use the rest of the defense to contain Jackson. I don't know if he's capable of picking apart a secondary with accuracy and anticipation simply because we haven't seen him do this yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 Like many running QBs who are competent passers, Jackson is pretty safe in terms of making an instant impact in the NFL. I think there are legitimate concerns about his long term success and viability and whether or not a team should spend a top 10 pick on him. Still, I'm coming around to evaluating running QBs differently than pocket passers. I think it's okay if he can't make all the throws or has spotty accuracy. What he does to the defensive psyche with his athleticism makes up for his deficiencies as a passer. I actually think he's a better prospect than Watson, too. I'm inclined to think he's worth a top 10 pick for certain teams (Ravens, Jaguars), who have an already sound roster but need someone to elevate the offense form day one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownLeader Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 3 hours ago, BleedTheClock said: This is the worst argument ever and I see it all the time. Lamar Jackson isn't able to play defense. Or block. That's his fault? I don't disagree that he may not be worthy of a top 5 pick, but the "he doesn't lead his team to wins" argument needs to die. It's always a valid argument. Because it's not just about W - L on paper. It's whether this guy is doing the things that affect the outcome of the game when it counts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iamcanadian Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 If you liked Michael Vick, then you will love the potential of Lamar, except Jackson is a far more accurate passer with the same kind of arm Vick possessed and we all know how good a runner he is. He is very likely to go top 10 and could possibly go top 5 if Darnold does not declare. Right now Darnold and Rosen are above him on most boards, but he is close. One thing Vick brought to the table was his escape ability and it allowed the teams he QB'd to not worry about drafting OLmen too high, he could avoid the pass rush with his unique quickness and Lamar will likely be able to survive without much of an OL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tugboat Posted November 4, 2017 Share Posted November 4, 2017 7 hours ago, Rich7sena said: Like many running QBs who are competent passers, Jackson is pretty safe in terms of making an instant impact in the NFL. I think there are legitimate concerns about his long term success and viability and whether or not a team should spend a top 10 pick on him. Still, I'm coming around to evaluating running QBs differently than pocket passers. I think it's okay if he can't make all the throws or has spotty accuracy. What he does to the defensive psyche with his athleticism makes up for his deficiencies as a passer. I actually think he's a better prospect than Watson, too. I'm inclined to think he's worth a top 10 pick for certain teams (Ravens, Jaguars), who have an already sound roster but need someone to elevate the offense form day one. Interesting thoughts. Kinda mirror my own in some respects. I do think Jackson is the sort of QB who could come in and have that instant impact. He'll run around, draw attention with that and alongside a stout running game, that's probably enough to open up the sort of windows he can fairly reliably hit. As long as the coach is willing to work with that. It's the sustainability and long-term "upside" i'm not so sold on. He's not a naturally big, heavy, solidly built guy. And the proclivity for taking off and running with the football is extremely obvious, and i think hard to coach out of a guy. He's going to take hard shots, and that just invites all that much more injury risk. Picking a guy like that to "build around" is basically intentionally eschewing the protections pocket QBs are afforded today. If you have the rest of the pieces and invest a top pick in the guy and the immediate dividends bring you that Super Bowl...it's worth it i guess. It's just that perennial contender programs are built around a QB. And with a guy like Jackson, i'm not sure that's going to be a sustainable year after year after year thing that you can truly build around. For me, it still ultimately comes down to..."what can a guy do from the pocket"? That includes functional mobility within the pocket and ability to escape and evade pressure. There's a distinct difference between a "scrambler" like Rodgers/Wilson, and a "runner"...which is what Jackson looks like to me. And that sort of thing usually shows up in the numbers in college. If a guy can win big from the pocket like a bigtime NFL quarterback prospect, even in college it's typically just so much more efficient to do it that way. You're not going to outrun a pinpoint laser throw from a great pocket QB. The ability to win from the pocket is just so much more reliable to "build around" in my estimation. What's a guy going to be if you take away his running ability via age/injury/gameplan in a stakes are high playoff game? That's what you can always count on most. And that's where i'm least sold on Lamar Jackson. I really like the angle that it really depends on the team taking a guy, and where they're at, etc. It's a pertinent consideration. But i'm not totally sure it completely supersedes conventional QB evaluation. I think you almost have to start looking at "Running QBs" through a bit of the same lens as has been traditionally applied to RBs? Instant impact - check. Durability and longevity - X. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfalcone Posted December 6, 2017 Share Posted December 6, 2017 Listened to the First Draft Podcast today, and Mel and Todd seem to think he's not an NFL QB. Personally I think we've found the low hanging fruit for ESPN's next round of layoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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