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Is the '04 QB draft class the best of all time?


notthatbluestuff

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28 minutes ago, notthatbluestuff said:

Now that Big Ben has joined Eli and Rivers in the annals of "former NFL QBs" it seems an apt time to ask this timeless question.

Is it '83? (Marino, Elway, Kelly)

Or '00? (draft class that includes Brady > draft classes that don't include Brady)

I mean Marino/Elway/Kelly is objectively better. Marino and Elway are clearly higher on all time lists than everyone in the other section and Kelly is ballpark at worst with the 04 class. In fact he has an All Pro which nobody in the 04 class has and he is 3rd all time in SB appearances. 

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83 is, without a doubt. Elway, Kelly, and Marino are HOF. Ken O'Brien had a decent career. Also, I think that Todd Blackledge, while not great, didn't really get a chance in KC.

In addition, you had other QB's like Reggie Collier (Joel Buchsbaum had him rated in his top-3 QB's that year, but he was black, and the stigma was still there. That's what may have hurt him) and Bobby Hebert who went to the USFL, and you had Gary Kubiak, who was a fine backup (and future HC).

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I was going to throw out 2017 but after Mahomes and Watson there’s nothing. 04 had those 3 plus another good QB in Schaub.

If Mike White and/or Baker Mayfield do something on top of having Lamar Jackson and Josh Allen, 2018 might have a say in this down the road.

But I’m not going to be contrarian. It’s 83.

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56 minutes ago, MagicMT said:

Your standards are way too high if you think Rivers "kinda sucked". 
He's fringe HOF lol

Rivers is one of those guys who people think is elite because of fantasy football. When you actually watch him play he wasn't anything special.

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1 hour ago, biggie. said:

Rivers is one of those guys who people think is elite because of fantasy football. When you actually watch him play he wasn't anything special.

He was a Franchise guy, but he's clearly not Hall of Fame IMO. Hall of Very Good and consistent. But all timer? Not by any chance. 

It's also disingenuous to say "he kinda sucked". 

Baker Mayfield, kinda sucks.

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1 hour ago, fluhartz said:

83 easily, but damn that 71 class was great too

Marino, Elway and Kelly are all three better than anyone in the 04 class 

Kelly is INSANELY OVERRATED

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/K/KellJi00.htm

He was elite in 1990 and 1991, the rest? Not so much.

He has a 1960's level 20 TDs and 28 picks in the playoffs. No one else who is considered great is even close to that bad. How do you even do that on a team full of HoF players at skill positions? Some of the greatest moments of his team happened with the backup playing.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/K/KellJi00.htm

He had 4 TDs to 8 picks in AFCCGs

He had 2 TDs to 7 picks in Super Bowls.

Does he deserve extra credit for those team wins? (outside of his 2nd AFCCG vs the Raiders)

He made a pro bowl with 15 TDs and 17 interceptions.

His passer rating ranks per year:

  • 8th
  • 10th
  • 13th
  • 6th
  • 1st
  • 3rd
  • 10th
  • 13th
  • 7th
  • 18th
  • 21st

The list of QBs that were better than Kelly is very long.

He's in the Hall mostly because his team went 9-4 in the playoffs in 4 years. He did not play in 2 of those wins, including the most famous one.

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10 hours ago, biggie. said:

Rivers is one of those guys who people think is elite because of fantasy football. When you actually watch him play he wasn't anything special.

LMFAO. Rivers was one of the most accurate passers in the league for a decade and a half. Next to nobody threw intermediate routes better than Rivers. His timing on out routes was ridiculously good. His number 1 options for the latter half of his career were a BEYOND WASHED Robert Meachem, Keenan Allen (literally hurt half the time from 2015-16), and a return specialist (Eddie Royal).

Beyond that, he had Danny Woodhead and old man Gates. Oh, and some of the worst offensive lines in the league with no real running game either. 2018, when he actually had weapons (Allen, Williams, Gates, Henry, Ekeler) he had an amazing season that is MVP caliber in numerous other seasons in the modern day.

Rivers would never wow you with a rifling throw in the ways that a Mahomes, Marino, Herbert, etc could, but he was very accurate and great at throwing his receivers open. He has a skillset more along the lines of a Drew Brees (although Brees is markedly better). Might not have the greatest highlight reel, but he was damn good, and the stats back it up.

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