J.C. Jackson (CB) is a MUST (JET) once he hits the open FA market.

[NJC33]

6 hours ago, DefenseWinsChampionships said:

So 4 teams will get blessed with NFL STARS in Amari Cooper and J.C. Jackson and Marcus Williams and Terron Armstesd @ 4 positions of need @ WR/CB/S/OT before heading into their draft...

When was the last time the top "NFL STARS" entering free agency lived up to those contracts? Jury is still out on last off-season..

Here's a recap of the last few years:

2020:

• Tom Brady, QB (TB, 2/$50)
• Jadeveon Clowney, DE (TEN, 1/$13)
• Byron Jones, CB (MIA, 5/$82.5)
• Philip Rivers, QB (IND, 1/$25)
• Kyle Van Noy, OLB (MIA, 4/$51)
• Austin Hooper, TE (CLE, 4/$42)
• D.J. Reader, DT (CIN, 4/$53)
• Chris Harris, CB (LAC, 2/$20)
• Dante Fowler, OLB (ATL, 3/$48)
• Robert Quinn, CHI, 5/$70

2019:

• Le’Veon Bell, RB (NYJ, 4/$52.5)
• Earl Thomas, S (BAL, 4/$55)
• Trey Flowers, DE (DET, 5/$90)
• Nick Foles, QB (JAX, 4/$88)
• Landon Collins, SS (WAS, 6/$84)
• Anthony Barr, OLB (MIN, 5/$67.5)
• C.J. Mosley, LB (NYJ, 5/$85)
• Justin Houston, OLB (IND, 2/$24)
• S Tyrann Mathieu, KC, 3/$42
• Trent Brown, OAK, 4/$66
• Lamarcus Joyner, OAK, 4/$42
• Tyrell Williams, OAK, 4/$44
• ZaDarius Smith, GB, 4/$66
• Rodger Saffold, TEN, 4/$44

2018:

• Andrew Norwell, G (JAX, 5/$66.5)
• Kirk Cousins, QB (MIN, 3/$84)
• Malcolm Butler, TEN, 5/$61
• Jimmy Graham, TE (GB, 3/$30)
• Star Lotulelei, DT (BUF, 5/$50)
• Nate Solder, OT (NYG, 4/$62)
• Trumaine Johnson, CB (NYJ, 5/$72.5)
• Sammy Watkins, KC, 3/$48
• Allen Robinson, CHI, 3/$48

You're playing Madden. "Stars" rarely hit free agency and even more seldomly remain stars afterwards. What's the success rate there, sub ~20%? You're a stats guy? Unless this class proves to be the greatest statistical anomaly in history, your approach would bring crippling returns. Context, my friend.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Why would he choose NYJ when the Chargers and Bengals are in the mix? You know, teams with actual young stud quarterbacks who are not major question marks heading into 2022.

[DefenseWinsChampionships]

2 hours ago, xrade said:

For proof of this, look at all the really good teams, how often do they spend big in FA?  They don't except for a guy to fill a hole like KC did last year with Thuney.

 

Let's not forget two key big name FAs for KC like Sammy Watkins WR (2018) and Tyrann Mathieu Safety (2019). It's been more than just Joe Thuney as far as FAs go in KC. 

KC even traded for two big name stars in Orlando Brown Jr (OT) who made the Pro Bowl for them last year and DE Frank Clark who's made 3 consecutive Pro Bowls for KC since trading for him .

And heck even the Rams don't make the SB without signing Odell Beckham Jr. 

You can never build a SB winning team throughout just the draft without also either trading for or signing big name star FAs. 

You always build your core throughout the draft but unfortunately in order to win a SB? That'll never be enough fire power to get it done. 

[DefenseWinsChampionships]

1 hour ago, Jag68Sid87 said:

Why would he choose NYJ when the Chargers and Bengals are in the mix? You know, teams with actual young stud quarterbacks who are not major question marks heading into 2022.

Because Zach Wilson is also going to develop and become a young stud Quarterback. 

And he'll quickly realize how awesome coach Robert Saleh truly is and would probably fall in love with coach Saleh's character + leadership + energy + 🔥. 

The Jets aren't going to stink for long and J.C. Jackson would become apart of something special moving forward (while being able to stick it to N.E. 2x per season).

If the ultimate goal is to win a Championship? Someone please remind J.C. Jackson how the Cincinnati Bengals have never won a SB (0) and the Chargers not since 1963 which was even before the AFL/NFL merger (worse than the Jets).

And you never know J.C. Jackson might just love how Joe Douglas has 4 picks within the 1st 2 rounds @ 4/10/36/38 and could love the thoughts of building a Defense around him (with some pass rushers to boot). 

Edited March 9, 2022 by DefenseWinsChampionships

[jetfuel34]

LOL!!!! Teams at the top don't need to sign big FA because they don't have the holes or the need for big FA. You need good football players to win period. It does not matter how you get them from the draft, trade or FA you need as many good football players as possible. I hate that saying no good team goes after big FA. That is the biggest line of BS in the NFL. 

Edited March 9, 2022 by jetfuel34

[DefenseWinsChampionships]

2 minutes ago, jetfuel34 said:

LOL!!!! Teams at the top don't need to sign big FA because they don't have the holes or the need for big FA. You need good football players to win period. It does not matter how you get them from the draft, trade or FA you need as many good football players as possible. I hate that saying no good team goes after big FA. That is the biggest line of BS in the NFL. 

Thank you. 

It's a fake myth. 

Tom freaking Brady went to Tampa Bay. A franchise that hadn't even been to the playoffs throughout 12 consecutive years (before the arrival of Tom Brady himself).

[xrade]

51 minutes ago, DefenseWinsChampionships said:

Let's not forget two key big name FAs for KC like Sammy Watkins WR (2018) and Tyrann Mathieu Safety (2019). It's been more than just Joe Thuney as far as FAs go in KC. 

KC even traded for two big name stars in Orlando Brown Jr (OT) who made the Pro Bowl for them last year and DE Frank Clark who's made 3 consecutive Pro Bowls for KC since trading for him .

And heck even the Rams don't make the SB without signing Odell Beckham Jr. 

You can never build a SB winning team throughout just the draft without also either trading for or signing big name star FAs. 

You always build your core throughout the draft but unfortunately in order to win a SB? That'll never be enough fire power to get it done. 

Watkins was hardly a big time FA.  In fact, your arguing against yourself using him.  KC signed him $17M and got <600yds and 3 TD in 2018.  He was not much better in 2019 and worse in 2020.  Regardless, they did what you said over a period of a couple of years.  Much like I stated, get the core established then fill the few holes with FA.  KC traded for Brown and got Thuney because the OL got mauled in the SB.  They filled holes because they were a contending SB team.  We are praying to sniff 500.

And of course you cant just build a SB contender without dipping into FA, but to do so before having an established core and coaching / FO stability never works.  Ever.

[Big T]

4 hours ago, DefenseWinsChampionships said:

Thank you. 

It's a fake myth. 

Tom freaking Brady went to Tampa Bay. A franchise that hadn't even been to the playoffs throughout 12 consecutive years (before the arrival of Tom Brady himself).

What you say about TB and TB is true, but Tampa Bay had some core players, enough that they won a S.B. with.

[DefenseWinsChampionships]

3 hours ago, xrade said:

Watkins was hardly a big time FA.  In fact, your arguing against yourself using him.  KC signed him $17M and got <600yds and 3 TD in 2018.  

Sammy Watkins as a #2 WR alongside of Tyreek Hill and Travis Kelce was a big reason why KC won the Super Bowl. 

He was an excellent #2 WR. 

In 2018 he missed 6 games but yet still recorded 40/55 catches for 519 Receiving Yards and provided Mahomes with a #2 WR security blanket. 

During their 2018 postseason SB run he combined for throughout 3 games 18 Targets, 14 Receptions, 288 Receiving Yards and 1 TD and KC never beats Tennessee during AFCCG without his 7 catches for 114 receiving yards and 1 TD. 

But nonetheless Sammy Watkins is a moot point because Amari Cooper is on s completely different level. 

Amari Cooper ranks top 10 All-Time in both Receptions and Receiving Yards before the age of 28 and if you don't believe Zach Wilson doesn't deserve that? Well then I don't believe Josh Allen deserves Stefon Diggs.

[DefenseWinsChampionships]

8 minutes ago, Big T said:

What you say about TB and TB is true, but Tampa Bay had some core players, enough that they won a S.B. with.

Those core players including Mike Evans and so many others couldn't sniff the playoffs before Brady. 12 years in a row. No postseason play.

[Bobby816]

5 minutes ago, DefenseWinsChampionships said:

Those core players including Mike Evans and so many others couldn't sniff the playoffs before Brady. 12 years in a row. No postseason play.

Well that’s an awful debate bc pretty much no team is making the playoffs regularly without good QB play. They didn’t have that. And once they did it worked.

You’re trying to build a team that you think is a good team next year. When the FO is trying to build a team that’s going to compete for along time. FA pickups work when you have a Brady, Brees, Stafford, Rodgers type QB in place where you know you’re getting good QB play. Otherwise just overspending on FAs rarely amounts to long term success.

[DefenseWinsChampionships]

2 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Well that’s an awful debate bc pretty much no team is making the playoffs regularly without good QB play. They didn’t have that. And once they did it worked.

You’re trying to build a team that you think is a good team next year. When the FO is trying to build a team that’s going to compete for along time. FA pickups work when you have a Brady, Brees, Stafford, Rodgers type QB in place where you know you’re getting good QB play. Otherwise just overspending on FAs rarely amounts to long term success.

Well if we didn't have an elite QB last year I highly doubt JD is going to quit trying to land himself the best talent available.

Because if you're telling me Corey Davis and Carl Lawson weren't big name and highly sought after FAs? 

We'll just have to agree to disagree until we see how JD plays his cards.

[xrade]

57 minutes ago, DefenseWinsChampionships said:

Sammy Watkins as a #2 WR alongside of Tyreek Hill and Travis Kelce was a big reason why KC won the Super Bowl. 

He was an excellent #2 WR. 

In 2018 he missed 6 games but yet still recorded 40/55 catches for 519 Receiving Yards and provided Mahomes with a #2 WR security blanket. 

During their 2018 postseason SB run he combined for throughout 3 games 18 Targets, 14 Receptions, 288 Receiving Yards and 1 TD and KC never beats Tennessee during AFCCG without his 7 catches for 114 receiving yards and 1 TD. 

But nonetheless Sammy Watkins is a moot point because Amari Cooper is on s completely different level. 

Amari Cooper ranks top 10 All-Time in both Receptions and Receiving Yards before the age of 28 and if you don't believe Zach Wilson doesn't deserve that? Well then I don't believe Josh Allen deserves Stefon Diggs.

You are completely missing the point. Watkins was paid $17M per season for less than 600 yards and 3 TD’s. Do you honestly think it was worth it? And please don’t say he helped them win a SB because a WR being paid less than half that would have had the same impact.

You seem to always avoid the $ part of all this. Cooper would be a nice WR to have but not at $20M and a draft pick. Schultz would have been a nice TE to have but not at $12M. JC would be a nice CB to have but not for > $20M per year.

[Bobby816]

1 hour ago, DefenseWinsChampionships said:

Well if we didn't have an elite QB last year I highly doubt JD is going to quit trying to land himself the best talent available.

Because if you're telling me Corey Davis and Carl Lawson weren't big name and highly sought after FAs? 

We'll just have to agree to disagree until we see how JD plays his cards.

They were good FAs but weren’t elite. Every guy I see you having/wanting us to go after is a level above that tier. Lawson is the 16th highest paid DE. And Davis the 22nd highest paid WR. That’s not elite cap numbers. Expect signings like that is all I’m saying. Your Schultz, Jackson, Cooper, Armstead, etc dreams just likely aren’t going to come true. Look a tier and 2 tiers below those elite names.

[DefenseWinsChampionships]

3 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

They were good FAs but weren’t elite. Every guy I see you having/wanting us to go after is a level above that tier. Lawson is the 16th highest paid DE. And Davis the 22nd highest paid WR. That’s not elite cap numbers. Expect signings like that is all I’m saying. Your Schultz, Jackson, Cooper, Armstead, etc dreams just likely aren’t going to come true. Look a tier and 2 tiers below those elite names.

Sorry but it's been 11 years of no playoffs. 

And how many elite Superstar players have we had since dating back to #24 (Draft) and #28 (TRADE)?

Passing up on opportunities to give Zach Wilson an elite Amari Cooper is the opposite of what Buffalo did for Josh Allen by "throwing away" their 1st round pick for Stefon Diggs (+ paying him $$$$).

Do you think the SB winning Ravens were scared to pay Shannon Sharpe? What about the Jets signing Kevin Mawae? Charles Woodson helping GB win their SB? Cowboys getting #21 Deion Sanders after San Francisco? Denver winning a SB with Peyton Manning? What about Reggie White, did GB fans regret throwing the FA $$$ bag at Reggie White after Minnesota Vikings?

Etc. 

Etc. 

We haven't sniffed the playoffs in 11 years (2010) and how many elite Superstar FAs have we signed? 

Sorry but enough is enough. We're ranked top 3 in available Salary Cap Space. If Joe Douglas can't give us one elite Star FA? There's a problem. 

If we have another mediocre 2-14, 4-13 or even 6-11 nightmare after signing a bunch of FA Scrubs? That'll become a big problem. 

Edited March 10, 2022 by DefenseWinsChampionships