Jump to content

Wide Receivers or lack there of


Mastercheddaar

Anyone Surprised By This?   

7 members have voted

  1. 1. Anyone Surprised By This?

    • Yes! I'm shocked!
      1
    • Not really.
      5
    • Insert Meme of Superman drinking at a bar here.
      1


Recommended Posts

11 hours ago, DizzyDean said:

Pretty obvious here who actually understands the game, and who does not.  We do not need a complete overhaul of our WR group.  If Coleman can stay healthy, we need a do it all type of #1 and that is it.  If Gordon can come close to 2013 form and stays with us along with Coleman being back, we have one of the better WR units in the league.  The key is the QB.  I am sorry, but Kizer sucks, he should have never seen the field at all this year as a project.  He has, and he is pretty much ruined now.  I don't think he can be fixed, and then developed.  Had we not played him, he would have only needed development.

About our WRs:

I feel we do not have a #1 or a #2 on this team. Coleman is a #3, Gordon a #4 (until he shows me something) Higgins and Louis battle for #5/#6 or someone else shows up and dethrones them. We really need to address the WR spot with a FA signing and a high draft pick. Sutton would be a huge pick up and signing Pryor back would fit in nicely. Pryor plays well with Hue and shouldn't cost us over 10 million a year. 

As for Kizer: I was really upset when we drafted him. (Not using it as a "I told you so" I actually tried and succeeded on homering for the kid.) But yeah I agree with you. He was a project that we might have ruined. We really needed to keep McCown on this team if developing Kizer was the plan. More than likely I think Sashi was pressured into picking a QB. Now the only fix I see to this is signing a quality Vet QB and drafting the best one. Have the Vet start, backup is Kizer and the rookie unless he shows superman like skill from day one is the 3rd option. Let's actually allow a rookie QB to sit on the bench and get at least get 6-7 games worth of film/practices/whatnot to acclimate him to the pro speed of the game.  Face it this season is a lucky to win a game season and next year will be a 6-10 to 8-8 at best season. <=== realistic goals lol. 

That is all

Mastercheddaar

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I feel we could use a lot more talent in the WR group, but I also feel it doesn't help when the QB is waiting for them to get open and stay open instead of throwing to them out of their breaks.

When they are open down the field, the QB is either missing them, or not seeing them completely.

All that being said I would like to sign a big name WR, Like Allen Robinson (hopefully the injury makes him less expensive), Jarvis Laundry, or Alshon Jefferies.

Then I would still want to draft the best WR available in the top of the second round (I really like Calvin Ridley or Cameron Sutton).

Then if Coleman can stay healthy, you would have him as the #2 or #3 depending on how quickly the rookie comes along.

Or the #4 if Gordon can stay on the field (but that isn't in my plans and shouldn't be in the FO either).

All this being said, I would also Draft a QB 1 or sign Cousins.  The difference in offense will be ridiculous...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If Gordon was off weed and Coleman was consistently healthy, our WR group would have a legitimate #1 and #3 target at the position. However, the “if” is impossible to ignore. Gordon has spent 90% of his NFL days suspended, so his spot in the position room is a ghost spot that you essentially pretend isn’t even there when evaluating the position. That should be the case for a minimum of 2 years of no suspensions. 

Coleman could potentially be a good 2/3 receiver if ever healthy. Again, big “if.” He’s not a guy who will probably beat a defense that gameplans for him as a primary receiver. He’s also not really a slot guy. 

Beyond these two, we have a position room of guys that should be on a practice squad. They’ve shown this in that they’ve been on other teams practice squads and can’t get open here. Higgins was released once here and claimed by no one. His value around the NFL is obvious. 

The long and short of it is that we could use a minimum of two guys get brought in with the intention of being able to start at the position. Must get one guy that can make plays and has the potential to be a #1. If you get half of our question mark guys to actually be on the field between Coleman/Gordon and two new legitimate WRs, you may at least be 3-strong. Williams may end up being a decent #4 deep threat if we had 2-3 guys out there actually attracting attention. There isn’t a guy out there right now that can beat a man-to-man coverage if a defense is actually paying attention to him. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To me, it's simple: 

You go into next season assuming you will never have Josh Gordon again (in terms of the draft/free agency). You look at our WR situation, and it's a dumpster fire, and quite frankly as a unit, has been since 2007. Coleman has been hurt more than healthy, so he's a genuine unknown as well.

You MUST address the WR position and find a legitimate, game changing, true #1 outside target like Green, Jones, fill in the blank here. Assuming Njoku makes the next step as he's shown promise in doing, and that's not a bad starting point.

Then, if Gordon and Coleman bust hard, you have that baseline starting point, but if they come out of nowhere/stay clean, then WOW, you have a very special and dynamic group almost overnight.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, MSURacerDT55 said:

Could one of these guys step their game up knowing this may be their last chance in the NFL over the next few weeks? 

Josh Gordon is about the only one I have hope for.

Hollywood isn't magically going to learn how to separate.

Louis isn't magically going to learn how to run routes and catch the ball.

Leslie is laughably bad.

Sammy Coates is really fast...and really not good.

I don't know why Telfer is still on the roster...he's a blocking tight end that is mediocre at that.

Kasen Williams actually shows a little promise as a #2/possession WR...and I'm not sure why I like him a little bit because he's not super impressive.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, MWil23 said:

Josh Gordon is about the only one I have hope for.

Hollywood isn't magically going to learn how to separate.

Louis isn't magically going to learn how to run routes and catch the ball.

Leslie is laughably bad.

Sammy Coates is really fast...and really not good.

I don't know why Telfer is still on the roster...he's a blocking tight end that is mediocre at that.

Kasen Williams actually shows a little promise as a #2/possession WR...and I'm not sure why I like him a little bit because he's not super impressive.

We would be better off bringing in an extra tackle in the run game over what Telfer has been, he was pretty decent last year but now he has been garbage, hell, bring Zach Banner in to get some push.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, NateDawg said:

If Gordon was off weed and Coleman was consistently healthy, our WR group would have a legitimate #1 and #3 target at the position. However, the “if” is impossible to ignore. Gordon has spent 90% of his NFL days suspended, so his spot in the position room is a ghost spot that you essentially pretend isn’t even there when evaluating the position. That should be the case for a minimum of 2 years of no suspensions. 

Coleman could potentially be a good 2/3 receiver if ever healthy. Again, big “if.” He’s not a guy who will probably beat a defense that gameplans for him as a primary receiver. He’s also not really a slot guy. 

Beyond these two, we have a position room of guys that should be on a practice squad. They’ve shown this in that they’ve been on other teams practice squads and can’t get open here. Higgins was released once here and claimed by no one. His value around the NFL is obvious. 

The long and short of it is that we could use a minimum of two guys get brought in with the intention of being able to start at the position. Must get one guy that can make plays and has the potential to be a #1. If you get half of our question mark guys to actually be on the field between Coleman/Gordon and two new legitimate WRs, you may at least be 3-strong. Williams may end up being a decent #4 deep threat if we had 2-3 guys out there actually attracting attention. There isn’t a guy out there right now that can beat a man-to-man coverage if a defense is actually paying attention to him. 

Being on other teams practice squads does not mean that they are not roster worthy.  Willie Snead was not even good enough for our practice squad.  The saints however evaluated him differently.  Also they were on other teams practice squads because of the guys ahead of them.  Crazy tinting that a given team has more roster worthy WRs than they have spots for on the active roster.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, MWil23 said:

To me, it's simple: 

You go into next season assuming you will never have Josh Gordon again (in terms of the draft/free agency). You look at our WR situation, and it's a dumpster fire, and quite frankly as a unit, has been since 2007. Coleman has been hurt more than healthy, so he's a genuine unknown as well.

You MUST address the WR position and find a legitimate, game changing, true #1 outside target like Green, Jones, fill in the blank here. Assuming Njoku makes the next step as he's shown promise in doing, and that's not a bad starting point.

Then, if Gordon and Coleman bust hard, you have that baseline starting point, but if they come out of nowhere/stay clean, then WOW, you have a very special and dynamic group almost overnight.

I think it depends on what we see from Gordon in the last few games this year.  He is auditioning for 2018.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, DizzyDean said:

Being on other teams practice squads does not mean that they are not roster worthy.  Willie Snead was not even good enough for our practice squad.  The saints however evaluated him differently.  Also they were on other teams practice squads because of the guys ahead of them.  Crazy tinting that a given team has more roster worthy WRs than they have spots for on the active roster.

OK. So, there are obvious exceptions, which I didn’t dispute. The point is that players that weren’t evaluated highly enough for their respective teams to keep are getting lots of PT in Cleveland. Not just #5 type guys. That’s the point. On teams with a legitimate WR group, they are outside the circle. Not sure what your point is on this one. That guys like Coates, Treggs, Louis, and Higgins are guys we can build around, because of the low percentage exceptions out there? I’d venture to say that if we cut any one of these guys today, not one of them gets claimed to be on another team’s active roster. Kasen Williams could maybe be a 4/5 somewhere. Please enlighten me about this group.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, NateDawg said:

OK. So, there are obvious exceptions, which I didn’t dispute. The point is that players that weren’t evaluated highly enough for their respective teams to keep are getting lots of PT in Cleveland. Not just #5 type guys. That’s the point. On teams with a legitimate WR group, they are outside the circle. Not sure what your point is on this one. That guys like Coates, Treggs, Louis, and Higgins are guys we can build around, because of the low percentage exceptions out there? I’d venture to say that if we cut any one of these guys today, not one of them gets claimed to be on another team’s active roster. Kasen Williams could maybe be a 4/5 somewhere. Please enlighten me about this group.

The point is with the exception of Coates all of the guys you mentioned here should have a solid spot on our roster.  Not as a one or a 2, but definitely valuable in roles.  Atrocious QB play has done them no favors.  We need a one and a two, the rest are fine.  Coleman can be a fine 2 if he can ever stay healthy.  If Gordon can’t be our one, then we need to find that player.  People speak like we have no roster worthy guys.  That simply is not true.  Also I expect Pryor back in 2018 on a very cheap contract to try and save his career.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know who's side of the argument I am on here. I believe we need significant help at WR but I don't know about a complete overhaul either. At least when I hear overhaul I am thinking 5 or 6 new WRs which is simply not going to happen and simply not the case. If by overhaul were are talking about signing a Veteran(1), Drafting a WR in The Top 40(2) and Drafting a middle round WR(3) then yes I am 100% behind that idea.


I also find it ludicrous that so many people are writing off Corey Coleman and calling him a #3. The kid has had 2 freak hand injuries which are really 1 injury that was not taken care of right the first time around. I am not in the slightest bit worried about the Hamstring deal from training camp. Odell does it every year and I remember many WRs throughout the years having hamstring injuries in training camp. I honestly don't even believe they have hamstring issues I think its just a way out of practice.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Dogbite said:

I don't know who's side of the argument I am on here. I believe we need significant help at WR but I don't know about a complete overhaul either. At least when I hear overhaul I am thinking 5 or 6 new WRs which is simply not going to happen and simply not the case. If by overhaul were are talking about signing a Veteran(1), Drafting a WR in The Top 40(2) and Drafting a middle round WR(3) then yes I am 100% behind that idea.


I also find it ludicrous that so many people are writing off Corey Coleman and calling him a #3. The kid has had 2 freak hand injuries which are really 1 injury that was not taken care of right the first time around. I am not in the slightest bit worried about the Hamstring deal from training camp. Odell does it every year and I remember many WRs throughout the years having hamstring injuries in training camp. I honestly don't even believe they have hamstring issues I think its just a way out of practice.

A complete over haul is 2-3 WR IMO, especially if hey are guys you bring in with the intention of starting.

I think a starting caliber free agent and a top 64 pick is the minimum.

Id personally add another late rounder to try to win a 5-6 spot.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

QB or not you can still see if a guy is beating his man. You can still see what he can do with the ball in his hands or if he can catch in traffic. Everyone of these guys has gotten more opportunity here then they would on almost any other team...and none of them has shown any reason to stay next season. The fastest guy is Treggs and I could see him secure a spot just based on that...but not on his ability to get open or catch. Louis is their guy and they've been trying to develop him but it's not taken...he offers very little playmaking and shaky hands.

The reality on Corey Coleman is that he hasn't shown a lot even when completely healthy. He's a jag level pro player and hasn't given any indication he'll ever break out. Next season he's ideally my #4 until he's shows something more.

If Josh Gordon is committed to the game instead of nonsense, he'll be a valuable piece. This is a guy that had Calvin Johnson level ability. If..he's really back...he's still a #1 WR. But he won't be physically and mentally ready until next season. And the possibility of a relapse will always be over his head.

If Njoku continues to improve and Gordon truly has his head on straight...those two alone are good 1 and 2 options. But because of the uncertainty on Gordon, you'll need two more options almost as good in order to field a playoff level passing offense. (assuming you've found the QB, of course...)

So imo the team needs a potential #1, and definitely a #2, and #3. To get that they'll need to spend excessively in FA and bring in 1 or 2 good veteran WRs. Then actually hit on at least 1 prospect in the 18' draft.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Evoking my inner brownie man here: Y'ALL ARE DEAD WRONG ON COREY COLEMAN.  He's not just a jag--no way.  He's going to be good and will be a starter here for at least his entire rookie contract and will start either here or somewhere else on his next contract.  CoCo is not the problem.  We need one FA & one draft pick at WR, keep Kasen and we're good.

Gordon / Coleman / draft pick / FA / Kasen / late rounder or PS.  Carry six and let the cream rise to the top.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...