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20 minutes ago, stl4life07 said:

I’ll hold Goff accountable as soon as I hear more and more people talk about Goff getting let down when he put his team in position to win in Seattle but his former kicker missed the game-winning kick. How about Goff put his team in position to win in San Fran and his defense couldn’t stop two 3rd and 16 situations on the same possession to lose the game. So yes Goff had a terrible season but twice he put his team in position with a chance to win and his team let him down. Both times he was on the sidelines watching and couldn’t do nothing. That’s the difference from being (9-7) and missing the playoffs and getting criticized from left and right to being (11-5) and making the playoffs and people saying how even though Goff statistically didn’t have a great season he persevered through injuries to the oline and no running game and still was able to lead his team to another double win season and back to the playoffs for the fourth straight season. 

Why does holding Goff accountable have to be based on what others say/don’t say? The facts are the facts 

You can’t cherry pick which games in favor of blaming Greg Zuerlein and the Defense when it suits your argument. And make it seem like they cost Goff

I can easily say Goff cost us the SF game with his game sealing pick 6. Also he cost us the Bucs game with his multiple turnovers

You know what the difference between GZ,  a player on defense and Goff is?

only one makes over $30 million a year and is the biggest chunk of cap space on the roster

sure, everyone can play better. Especially Goff because of his pay and position 

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9 hours ago, JonStark said:

I honestly believe it boils down to the offensive line. It'd be different if we didn't already know that Goff is a pocket passer, but that's what he is. He always has been. He needs a pocket to excel, and has shown that he has the ability to do so when he has blocking. You say he was the least sacked, but a lot of the mistakes you brought up were the result of forced throws. You can't use that statistic both ways. 

The running game and play action is also a huge part of it, he'll be fine as long as he has a pocket to throw from. I just hope he doesn't devlop happy feet from getting pressured too much (like Bradford did), because I did see some signs of that last year. 

Goff can make every throw in the book, but he can't do it by himself and honestly, there's only about 3-4 QB in the league that can. 

Go back to last seasons tape and see how much of those throws could he have thrown away or thrown to the checkdown? 

Instead he fell in love with those big chunk plays and became greedy. Especially in the middle of the field 

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8 hours ago, BStanRamFan said:

I'd rather just use stats for sports arguments because everything else is just subjective. Cuts through the BS. I do not agree he was the same QB as 2018 at all, his decision making was much worse. He got riskier and his turnovers were atrocious. 

Also, I do not think he will ever evolve into Mahomes or Rodgers. They are two of the best QB's of all time from a strictly talent perspective. Few will ever measure up to those two. Goff can be Matt Ryan, except win a SuperBowl. 

I disagree. You don’t need to be the most talented to be the most accomplished. 

He’s much better then Ryan. In my opinion he’s a top 3 accurate thrower in the league. 

He just needs to get the mental aspect of the game down. 

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1 hour ago, jrry32 said:

Goff was only sacked 22 times because he did a masterful job of getting rid of the ball and avoiding sacks. PFF ranked our OL 31st in the NFL and was not complimentary of it in pass protection:

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offensive-line-rankings-following-2019-regular-season

31. LOS ANGELES RAMS
The offensive line was a strength of the Los Angeles Rams’ NFC champion team in 2018, but that changed in a hurry this season. Injuries, shuffling pieces and declining play from players who performed well last season — such as Rob Havenstein — resulted in a pass-blocking unit that allowed a pressure rate four percentage points higher than it did a season ago despite Jared Goff getting rid of the football significantly faster on average and running play action at one of the highest rates in the NFL. Given how much Goff relies on a clean pocket, improving the group up front will be a priority heading into 2020.

--------------------------------

Of course, the downside to Goff getting rid of the ball and avoiding sacks was him taking risks, forcing throws, and throwing before the play developed fully. Goff did not play as well as he did in 2017/18, but I lay that more at the feet of the OL than anything.

He did a good job. I wouldn’t say he did a masterful job. He still took some bad sacks and coughed up fumbles 

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1 hour ago, jrry32 said:

Neither hurries nor time in the pocket are great measures of OL performance if you don't adjust for scheme. According to PFF, we ran a large number of PA passes, which is going to drive up time in the pocket. And if we were using PA passes and keeping extra blockers in, it's going to make Goff's hurry numbers look less extreme. But if teams aren't biting on the PA and aren't bringing extra rushers, it's going to make it more difficult for him to complete passes. Simply put, those of us who watched the 2019 Rams could tell the OL was a problem. The stats can say what they say. I trust my eyes.

100% agree with this. Sacks are what casuals use to judge OL

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, rocky_rams said:

He did a good job. I wouldn’t say he did a masterful job. He still took some bad sacks and coughed up fumbles 

He was #1 in the NFL in Sack Rate (meaning that he took the least sacks per attempt of any full-time starting QB; Brees was the only QB better, but he only started 11 games). We gave up the fewest sacks in the NFL in 2019. He did that behind an OL that was bottom ten in pass protection.

Edited by jrry32

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43 minutes ago, rocky_rams said:

Why does holding Goff accountable have to be based on what others say/don’t say? The facts are the facts 

You can’t cherry pick which games in favor of blaming Greg Zuerlein and the Defense when it suits your argument. And make it seem like they cost Goff

I can easily say Goff cost us the SF game with his game sealing pick 6. Also he cost us the Bucs game with his multiple turnovers

You know what the difference between GZ,  a player on defense and Goff is?

only one makes over $30 million a year and is the biggest chunk of cap space on the roster

sure, everyone can play better. Especially Goff because of his pay and position 

He didn’t have a game sealing pick 6. That came at the end of the 1st half. What he did have was lead the team to a game tying field goal and never saw the ball again against the Niners.

Yes he had multiple turnovers against the Bucs but down by 3+ tds he led the team back down by 1 possession to tie with 2 minutes to go only for one of his oline player to not block Suh and he got crushed for a sack fumble that went for a td. No QB could get away from that. Brees got hurt against the Rams because his oline didn’t block Donald.

Im not saying we can’t hold Goff accountable I’m just saying to look at what he did that should’ve lead to the Rams making the playoffs and had Goff led the Rams to playoffs if Zeurlein makes that kick or the Rams defense makes just one 3rd and 16 stop I think the conversation about Goff would be slightly different this offeason imo. 

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So everyone seems agree that OL was bad last year and that Goff can't play without a good OL.

We didn't upgrade the OL this year. 

Some of you are sure this OL gonna be better with the same player than last year. Remember, we ranked 31st in the PFF ranking. 

Also If we have a mediocre OL, the running game will also be doomed. 

I said it, you said it.  Goff with a mediocre OL and running game, is a very bad QB. 

And yet, people doesn't think it was a big issue that we didn't improve our OL in FA or the draft. It's mind blowing.

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2 hours ago, Flounch said:

So everyone seems agree that OL was bad last year and that Goff can't play without a good OL.

We didn't upgrade the OL this year. 

Some of you are sure this OL gonna be better with the same player than last year. Remember, we ranked 31st in the PFF ranking. 

Also If we have a mediocre OL, the running game will also be doomed. 

I said it, you said it.  Goff with a mediocre OL and running game, is a very bad QB. 

And yet, people doesn't think it was a big issue that we didn't improve our OL in FA or the draft. It's mind blowing.

You do realize that last year Noteboom, Allen, and Havenstein got hurt. Then we traded for Corbett middle of the season and Edwards and Evans were rookies who had zero experience in the NFL. It’s not like there isn’t natural room for the oline to get way better than last year. Noteboom being back will be better. A healthy Havenstein have shown us in the past he will be better. Corbett getting a chance to get used to playing for the Rams in McVay system and learning from the OL coach Kroemer he should be better. Then Edwards and Evans getting that playing time will only help them get better. So it’s not like the Rams have no room to get naturally better. I can see if the Rams had an old line and didn’t add no one trying to hope they can get back to how they were years ago ignoring the fact that it’s aging and declined. The Rams invested a lot on the OL so just because they didn’t continue to pour resources in it this offseason doesn’t mean they are sitting on their hands. They really want a fair chance to see what they have and I don’t blame them. 

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I’ve been on the fence about the Goff topic for a little while now. We’ve seen him have some amazing games, make a throw once in a while that leaves you in Awe, and we’ve seen him lead us and be a confident quarterback. However, it almost seems like ever since that Bears game in 18, things haven’t been the same. It seemed like it was the day that the world saw that Goff struggled in the cold, and that he was not good at all under pressure. That day sort of linked him to Mitch comparisons. They had him making awful throws even on the few plays he had time. Obviously it’s natural to decrease in performance under pressure or even in cold weather games sometimes, but since then I developed a little doubt. Soon after that it seemed like the rams weren’t the same and we started seeing Goff have those horrible games.
 

Throughout the year in 2018 my thoughts were very high on Goff, until the lions and then bears game. After that he through 53 times against philly and I started to wonder if McVay was just pass happy or if he was being figured out, or if TG was done, Seemed like option D, all the above. Once we were in the playoffs I felt good about him again, and even seeing him against the saints with his back against the wall and succeed late in the game made me feel like he was overcoming that hump.. and then came the bowl. 
 

last year I went into the year with confidence in Goff.. we started 3-0. Goff didn’t play that great in those wins, but we won. Through out the year it seemed like Goff was so inaccurate. The line was horrible, Gurley was not Gurley, and it seemed like McVay was out of ideas. I didn’t really regain any confidence in Goff or the team until late when they beat Arizona and Seattle back to back (after getting destroyed by Baltimore). I had a feeling they’d really bounce back and they almost did. We even lost by 3 to the niners in a game which we clearly outplayed them in every phase (in my opinion) and then went on to beat the cards again. 3-1 to end the year easily could have been 4-0. The Steelers loss killed us too.. the missed field goal against Seattle, so many things went wrong. It wasn’t JUST Goff. Our special teams were horrible all year, Gurley was not good, etc... all this leaves room for optimism. 
 

I know this division is BRUTAL..But going into the season I feel better than at the end of last year with the roster. I get the line is the same, but I do believe they are healthy and more experienced. Goff yet again has more experience under McVay, and we have a quality backfield and receivers. I 100% trust Snead and McVay during the offseason. They’ve shown they can build a team and get us to the Super Bowl and there’s no doubt in my mind that they will again. No doubt they’ll pull the trigger on anything that can help the team, no matter what the time of year is. This is the year that Goff needs to show up and carry the load that is expected of him. I think our defense might struggle to come together for the first couple weeks but will eventually be a Really solid unit. I love our Dline and our secondary.. as for backers it seems like they really felt confident in who we had last year as backups (or on IR). I do too.   
 

All that said, I’m expecting (Hoping) Goff to hit at least 35 touchdowns with 10 or fewer picks. I hate that it sounds like that’s kind of out of reach for him at the moment, but I don’t think anything less will be acceptable. And if the line ends up being a big problem again then we’ll know the front office wasn’t very smart to not address the position at all. Like it or not, Goff is and will be our guy for a few more years. Let’s hope he’s the guy he’s shown us he can be.. cause if he has that confidence, we all know the throws he’s capable of making. There’s no in between with Goff lmao either top 5 or bottom 5. 

 

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, MDY10 said:

I’ve been on the fence about the Goff topic for a little while now. We’ve seen him have some amazing games, make a throw once in a while that leaves you in Awe, and we’ve seen him lead us and be a confident quarterback. However, it almost seems like ever since that Bears game in 18, things haven’t been the same. It seemed like it was the day that the world saw that Goff struggled in the cold, and that he was not good at all under pressure. That day sort of linked him to Mitch comparisons. They had him making awful throws even on the few plays he had time. Obviously it’s natural to decrease in performance under pressure or even in cold weather games sometimes, but since then I developed a little doubt. Soon after that it seemed like the rams weren’t the same and we started seeing Goff have those horrible games.
 

Throughout the year in 2018 my thoughts were very high on Goff, until the lions and then bears game. After that he through 53 times against philly and I started to wonder if McVay was just pass happy or if he was being figured out, or if TG was done, Seemed like option D, all the above. Once we were in the playoffs I felt good about him again, and even seeing him against the saints with his back against the wall and succeed late in the game made me feel like he was overcoming that hump.. and then came the bowl. 
 

last year I went into the year with confidence in Goff.. we started 3-0. Goff didn’t play that great in those wins, but we won. Through out the year it seemed like Goff was so inaccurate. The line was horrible, Gurley was not Gurley, and it seemed like McVay was out of ideas. I didn’t really regain any confidence in Goff or the team until late when they beat Arizona and Seattle back to back (after getting destroyed by Baltimore). I had a feeling they’d really bounce back and they almost did. We even lost by 3 to the niners in a game which we clearly outplayed them in every phase (in my opinion) and then went on to beat the cards again. 3-1 to end the year easily could have been 4-0. The Steelers loss killed us too.. the missed field goal against Seattle, so many things went wrong. It wasn’t JUST Goff. Our special teams were horrible all year, Gurley was not good, etc... all this leaves room for optimism. 
 

I know this division is BRUTAL..But going into the season I feel better than at the end of last year with the roster. I get the line is the same, but I do believe they are healthy and more experienced. Goff yet again has more experience under McVay, and we have a quality backfield and receivers. I 100% trust Snead and McVay during the offseason. They’ve shown they can build a team and get us to the Super Bowl and there’s no doubt in my mind that they will again. No doubt they’ll pull the trigger on anything that can help the team, no matter what the time of year is. This is the year that Goff needs to show up and carry the load that is expected of him. I think our defense might struggle to come together for the first couple weeks but will eventually be a Really solid unit. I love our Dline and our secondary.. as for backers it seems like they really felt confident in who we had last year as backups (or on IR). I do too.   
 

All that said, I’m expecting (Hoping) Goff to hit at least 35 touchdowns with 10 or fewer picks. I hate that it sounds like that’s kind of out of reach for him at the moment, but I don’t think anything less will be acceptable. And if the line ends up being a big problem again then we’ll know the front office wasn’t very smart to not address the position at all. Like it or not, Goff is and will be our guy for a few more years. Let’s hope he’s the guy he’s shown us he can be.. cause if he has that confidence, we all know the throws he’s capable of making. There’s no in between with Goff lmao either top 5 or bottom 5. 

 

there is no way Goff will ever be bottom 5. He is a very talented thrower of the football. Im assuming you mean bottom 5 in stats which would have alot more to do with players around him, schemes, matchups, etc

I dont really judge QB play off stats. as a former QB i appreciate looking at the film and evaluating mechanics, reads, decision making, and a few other things to make conclusions on a QB

Edited by rocky_rams

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10 hours ago, rocky_rams said:

there is no way Goff will ever be bottom 5. He is a very talented thrower of the football. Im assuming you mean bottom 5 in stats which would have alot more to do with players around him, schemes, matchups, etc

I dont really judge QB play off stats. as a former QB i appreciate looking at the film and evaluating mechanics, reads, decision making, and a few other things to make conclusions on a QB

Yeah I can agree to a certain extent. I also think it should be more than stats because they can be misconstrued when passes are dropped, line doesn’t block, and you have no run game, etc. But I can’t sit here and say that I truly believe that McVay Trusted Goff all of last year. It was pretty blatant in my opinion that McVay doesn’t. I get that many positions weren’t holding up their own part.. but those Bears/Steelers/Pats type games when Goff doesn’t have a clean pocket.. he LOOKS just as bad as a bottom 5 QB. No one will always have a clean pocket.. and I do expect a decline from most QBs when under pressure or in the cold, but not to the point where he just looks lost, is missing open guys, and can’t be trusted so you just throw a screen pass To a WR on 3rd and whatever it may be every single time. Those were almost as hard to watch as Jeff Fisher playing 10 yards off receivers on 3rd and 1. Goff has shown that he can be elite and make ANY throw. But imo he needs to show he can handle and win those games and carry us when we need him. I don’t think a good QB in the nfl is good when they only play well in a clean pocket. I hope with age and experience he develops that poise. Just hope it’s not when he gets a fresh start with someone else 

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43 minutes ago, MDY10 said:

Yeah I can agree to a certain extent. I also think it should be more than stats because they can be misconstrued when passes are dropped, line doesn’t block, and you have no run game, etc. But I can’t sit here and say that I truly believe that McVay Trusted Goff all of last year. It was pretty blatant in my opinion that McVay doesn’t. I get that many positions weren’t holding up their own part.. but those Bears/Steelers/Pats type games when Goff doesn’t have a clean pocket.. he LOOKS just as bad as a bottom 5 QB. No one will always have a clean pocket.. and I do expect a decline from most QBs when under pressure or in the cold, but not to the point where he just looks lost, is missing open guys, and can’t be trusted so you just throw a screen pass To a WR on 3rd and whatever it may be every single time. Those were almost as hard to watch as Jeff Fisher playing 10 yards off receivers on 3rd and 1. Goff has shown that he can be elite and make ANY throw. But imo he needs to show he can handle and win those games and carry us when we need him. I don’t think a good QB in the nfl is good when they only play well in a clean pocket. I hope with age and experience he develops that poise. Just hope it’s not when he gets a fresh start with someone else 

I think a lot of it was schematic issues though. Once we started countering the loaded front with 12 personnel things changed big time.

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3 hours ago, LARams91 said:

I think a lot of it was schematic issues though. Once we started countering the loaded front with 12 personnel things changed big time.

Some of it was, not most of it. Goff has all the tools to be elite if he can get the mental part down 

The mental part is making him an average QB at the moment 

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