MOVE THE STICKS - REBUILDS THE LIONS

[Karnage84]

Daniel Jeremiah and Bucky Brooks had a segment on their latest episode of the 'Move The Sticks' podcast. Here are the players they selected for our Detroit Lions:

• Pick #2 - Sauce Gardner, CB, Cincinnati
• Pick #32 - Jahan Dotson, WR, Penn State
• Pick #34 - Kenny Pickett, QB, Pittsburgh (they did comment if you're going to take a QB you'd take him at #32)
• Pick #66 - Josh Pascal, Edge, Kentucky
• Pick #97 - Luke Fortner, OL, Kentucky

One of the things that they (and a lot of the media) got hooked on is Campbell's comment on not needing an elite level QB. Dose of Dion actually did a great job at refuting this narrative and that the comment was more about an elite level runner (like a Lamar Jackson) at the position. 

I'm generally a big fan of DJ and Bucky but it's not a draft that I'm overly fond of. Their next segment was day 2 (2nd/3rd round picks) players and there were a couple DL guys they talked about who should go at the top of round 2. If we're going to bypass someone like Thibodeaux, Hutchinson, Walker, Johnson at #2 then I'd like to see us attack the position at either #32 or #34. 

[LionArkie]

I'd hate this.

[Karnage84]

12 minutes ago, LionArkie said:

I'd hate this.

Yeah - I wouldn't be thrilled. I like Sauce but I think that's waiting too long to take an edge guy and I feel like we need a different type of WR - more of a big body than a small, speedy/shifty guy. 

[Sllim Pickens]

I think a QB at 32/34 is not the answer.  I also hate Sauce at 2.  He isnt the prospect Okudah was and people complained of him at 2.  

I don't mind Dotson and Paschal.  I think Paschal has been very underrated.  Would rather see a S and a LB in there instead of QB and OL. 

[Karnage84]

12 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said:

I think a QB at 32/34 is not the answer.  I also hate Sauce at 2.  He isnt the prospect Okudah was and people complained of him at 2.  

I don't mind Dotson and Paschal.  I think Paschal has been very underrated.  Would rather see a S and a LB in there instead of QB and OL. 

I agree with you on the QB at #32/#34. I get the reasoning but I think we need to build up the roster using these higher end resources. I'd rather take someone like Howell (if he drops to #66), Elerby, Strong, etc. if they're available at #66 as a Davis Mills-type starter/quality back up. This would allow us to build up the talent on the roster, see if we can hit on a Jalen Hurts/Dak Prescott/Russell Wilson guy and use Goff's salary to add other high end pieces to fill out the roster. If they aren't that guy, we still have a lot of draft capital to try and add "the guy" in the 2023 or 2024 draft. 

[Sllim Pickens]

9 minutes ago, Karnage84 said:

I agree with you on the QB at #32/#34. I get the reasoning but I think we need to build up the roster using these higher end resources. I'd rather take someone like Howell (if he drops to #66), Elerby, Strong, etc. if they're available at #66 as a Davis Mills-type starter/quality back up. This would allow us to build up the talent on the roster, see if we can hit on a Jalen Hurts/Dak Prescott/Russell Wilson guy and use Goff's salary to add other high end pieces to fill out the roster. If they aren't that guy, we still have a lot of draft capital to try and add "the guy" in the 2023 or 2024 draft. 

Thats exactly my thinking.  Drafting one at 32/34 instantly creates a QB competition in the fans/media eyes and I dont think any of these guys are close to Goff's level at this point.  If we grab one at 97 or even 66, its more of a back up expectation and still something to push Goff. I just hate this QB class and unless Willis drops to 32, I wouldn't touch a QB. 

[Karnage84]

2 hours ago, Sllim Pickens said:

Thats exactly my thinking.  Drafting one at 32/34 instantly creates a QB competition in the fans/media eyes and I dont think any of these guys are close to Goff's level at this point.  If we grab one at 97 or even 66, its more of a back up expectation and still something to push Goff. I just hate this QB class and unless Willis drops to 32, I wouldn't touch a QB. 

Exactly. Some would say that if Goff can't handle the competition he shouldn't be the guy... I don't think it's really about whether he can handle it or not. I think he'd be fine. It'd be more about the media and the narratives surrounding the team with questions at press conferences, articles in newspapers, etc. There'd be a lot of time invested into something that is likely a nothingburger for 2022. There isn't a QB in this class who is going to step in and be an immediate upgrade over Goff. Especially with the Ben Johnson/Dan Campbell led offense (and healthier OL group,  improvements at WR, etc.). 

[Sllim Pickens]

15 minutes ago, Karnage84 said:

Exactly. Some would say that if Goff can't handle the competition he shouldn't be the guy... I don't think it's really about whether he can handle it or not. I think he'd be fine. It'd be more about the media and the narratives surrounding the team with questions at press conferences, articles in newspapers, etc. There'd be a lot of time invested into something that is likely a nothingburger for 2022. There isn't a QB in this class who is going to step in and be an immediate upgrade over Goff. Especially with the Ben Johnson/Dan Campbell led offense (and healthier OL group,  improvements at WR, etc.). 

Yup.  I think having someone to push him is good.  Having someone who could take hi job will make him work harder.  But having fans and media start calling for the 1st round/early 2nd round rookie every time he makes a bad throw or we lose a game is just a distraction and no good for anybody.  Goff earned a second year here.  I am more than willing to let him play out the year and reassess at the end of the year and if needed find a QB then.  Guys like Kyler and Lamar Jackson may be available next year too so no need to force it this year just to say you drafted a QB. 

[Karnage84]

2 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said:

Yup.  I think having someone to push him is good.  Having someone who could take hi job will make him work harder.  But having fans and media start calling for the 1st round/early 2nd round rookie every time he makes a bad throw or we lose a game is just a distraction and no good for anybody.  Goff earned a second year here.  I am more than willing to let him play out the year and reassess at the end of the year and if needed find a QB then.  Guys like Kyler and Lamar Jackson may be available next year too so no need to force it this year just to say you drafted a QB. 

Even if you think Ridder has the potential (or another QB prospect who will be available at 32) to be "the guy", the roster isn't set up where we can plug someone in and expect them to have success. We've seen what the Bucs and Rams did - they added a veteran QB through FA or trade to a roster that was already completed for a championship run. We have the assets to build out our roster and be in a better position to either a) add a high caliber veteran QB to round things out or b) draft a QB from a draft class that will likely be higher graded than this year. If we do go that route, they would be given better circumstances to be more competitive early on than when we drafted Stafford. Either way, the roster will be in a better and more complete spot. Taking any QB early is a risk - why take that extra risk on in a poor QB class and an incomplete roster?

[Just Want A Title]

I think the Lions are in a position to let the draft fall to them:  They will be able to take prospects that they need the most right where they could get the most value and impact to the roster.  What I see:

#2-Edge-T. Walker, A. Hutchinson

#32-Safety/WR-L. Sine, J. Brisker, D. Hill, J. Pitre, C.Watson, G. Pickens III, Alec Pierce

#34-Safety/WR-L. Sine, J. Brisker, D. Hill, J. Pitre, C.Watson, G. Pickens III, Alec Pierce

#66-LB-T.Anderson, C. Muma, B Smith, N Bonitto

The Lions might be able to add an additional 2d, 3rd or 4th round pick with potential trades but they could lose out on the prospects that could really help them now.  The Ravens let generally let the draft come to them and it works out well most of the time.  I think they would be well-served by following that example this year rather than getting to cute or over-thinking things.

[Typical_Lions]

5 hours ago, Just Want A Title said:

I think the Lions are in a position to let the draft fall to them:  They will be able to take prospects that they need the most right where they could get the most value and impact to the roster.  What I see:

#2-Edge-T. Walker, A. Hutchinson

#32-Safety/WR-L. Sine, J. Brisker, D. Hill, J. Pitre, C.Watson, G. Pickens III, Alec Pierce

#34-Safety/WR-L. Sine, J. Brisker, D. Hill, J. Pitre, C.Watson, G. Pickens III, Alec Pierce

#66-LB-T.Anderson, C. Muma, B Smith, N Bonitto

The Lions might be able to add an additional 2d, 3rd or 4th round pick with potential trades but they could lose out on the prospects that could really help them now.  The Ravens let generally let the draft come to them and it works out well most of the time.  I think they would be well-served by following that example this year rather than getting to cute or over-thinking things.

This works for me. Would love two get one of Watson or Pierce at WR and would take either over Drake London or Chris Olave. For the safeties I would probably go Pitre, Hill, then Brisker.

[Louis Friend]

This is awful. 

[Just Want A Title]

2 hours ago, Louis Friend said:

This is awful. 

What do you mean?

[Louis Friend]

I mean it's awful. 

I love Gardner, but he's not a top 2 pick, hell, he's a mid 1st at best.

Jahan Dotson is undersized and not the type of WR the Lions even need. There are better fits at WR if that's where they want to go. 

Kenny Pickett is the only other QB in this draft worthy of drafting, but I see no way he 1.) Last this far 2.) gets drafted to the Lions with better players available.

Pascal and Fortner are good players, but if the Lions are drafting both of them here, this draft is a bust.

 

I feel like everyone just wants to be different right now with their mocks, but damn, this ain't it. 

[Just Want A Title]

1 hour ago, Louis Friend said:

I mean it's awful. 

I love Gardner, but he's not a top 2 pick, hell, he's a mid 1st at best.

Jahan Dotson is undersized and not the type of WR the Lions even need. There are better fits at WR if that's where they want to go. 

Kenny Pickett is the only other QB in this draft worthy of drafting, but I see no way he 1.) Last this far 2.) gets drafted to the Lions with better players available.

Pascal and Fortner are good players, but if the Lions are drafting both of them here, this draft is a bust.

 

I feel like everyone just wants to be different right now with their mocks, but damn, this ain't it. 

I agree with you on Gardner at #2.  He is a good CB prospect but Oruwariye is a top tier #2CB.  AJ Price is already a good slot CB.  We might have found something with Melifonwu if he can stay healthy.  We still have Jerry Jacobs and Jeff Okudah.  I think we have a solid group that needs Itime to grow.  Mel Kiper apparently has the Lions taking Gardner at #2.  Considering our need at DE/Edge I don't think that is realistic.