craig Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 13 minutes ago, Old Guy said: ...As it looks today, we are going to have a whole lot of guys we are going to want to hang onto in the next two, three years. Yes, I can't remind myself of that often enough. We're just coming out from an extended stretch of cap pressure, but we'll return to it in no time. Any millions unnecessarily spent next year are millions we'll wish we had a year or two later. Tangent: When Gute came in, he spent a bunch (successfully) on Z, Preston, Billy Turner. It worked great, and he was praised as being non-TT. But FA spending is always a manifestation of how well or poorly you drafted. That splurge into FA was totally the consequence of drafting ineffectively. Now that we've been drafting well again, plus with the extra picks three years straight, all cap space is going to get gobbled by draftees worth re-signing. Gute like TT should be facing years with draftees earning all the cap space and none left for outside FA's. Tangent 2: I don't remember the exact number of years, but I saw a note that bad-drafting-Belichek has gone many years without re-signing a draftee from rounds 1-3. That kind of lousy drafting is exactly why they are in current dreadful situation. And why a coach should not be entrusted with drafting and GM-ing! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 8 minutes ago, Old Guy said: You can't pay everybody and I think this is a good strategy. Unless Rhyan turns elite in the next two years, you replace him. Same with Myers. I just assume JRJ is down the road after this year. As it looks today, we are going to have a whole lot of guys we are going to want to hang onto in the next two, three years. It is a great strategy, and maybe there is more to Rhyan. We shall see. And I love having him cheap for 2 more years. I agree about Myers. I don't worry much about the cap. Guys come, guys go. Guys flash. Guys fade. Let's just enjoy those young players while they are here and flat out balling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTwoSixFive Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 (edited) 5 hours ago, Old Guy said: As it looks today, we are going to have a whole lot of guys we are going to want to hang onto in the next two, three years. ........and this is a problem as a lot of players want to get paid as they get onto 2nd contracts if you have drafted as well as Gutekunst seems to have done the last couple of years. Once you get away from having a variety of ages on a team and 'go young', you get a lot of cheap contracts to begin with and either lose some guys you'd rather keep, or have cap problems as you try to keep a lot of the guys you have developed. This problem is only made worse by having $50m+ spent on your franchise QB. To some extent you can plan for the hike in cap price by structuring stuff in the early years (of going young) to allow you to pay a little more when things start to bite...........but Green Bay was in cap hell in 2023 and to some extent in 2024, so they cannot push money into the future now, when they have lots of cheap young guys. One solution is to go young again, but that only works if you draft successfully again - and that is very hard to do, to the extent Gute did in 2022 and 2023. Edited January 8 by OneTwoSixFive 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Guy Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 47 minutes ago, OneTwoSixFive said: ........and this is a problem as a lot of players want to get paid as they get onto 2nd contracts if you have drafted as well as Gutekunst seems to have done the last couple of years. Once you get away from having a variety of ages on a team and 'go young', you get a lot of cheap contracts to begin with and either lose some guys you'd rather keep, or have cap problems as you try to keep a lot of the guys you have developed. This problem is only made worse by having $50m+ spent on your franchise QB. To some extent you can plan for the hike in cap price by structuring stuff in the early years (of going young) to allow you to pay a little more when things start to bite...........but Green Bay was in cap hell in 2023 and to some extent in 2024, so they cannot push money into the future now, when they have lots of cheap young guys. One solution is to go young again, but that only works if you draft successfully again - and that is very hard to do, to the extent Gute did in 2022 and 2023. Which is why you only pay premium positions. Interior offensive line is going to have to be a rotation unless you land an elite player. Also, you are not going to be able to extend all the premiums if you hit on a lot of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeresAGuy Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 Kid's still got upside to cultivate. I am completely good with the idea of Rhyan at right guard come next season. One more offseason with the team is going to just make him even better, and Im already assuming the Eagles are going to overpay JRJ, who while has been a great servant to us, I can let him walk when Rhyan seems at worst a lateral move generally speaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTwoSixFive Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 50 minutes ago, Old Guy said: Which is why you only pay premium positions. Interior offensive line is going to have to be a rotation unless you land an elite player. Also, you are not going to be able to extend all the premiums if you hit on a lot of them. That sounds great, but you never know which positions are going to throw up the premium PLAYERS. If your difference makers turn out to be ILBs, safeties, guards, NTs, what do you do then ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Guy Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 22 minutes ago, OneTwoSixFive said: That sounds great, but you never know which positions are going to throw up the premium PLAYERS. If your difference makers turn out to be ILBs, safeties, guards, NTs, what do you do then ? Well we signed Jenkins but I would definitely not want two guards on. If contracts. I would not pay two people at any of those positions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted January 8 Author Share Posted January 8 3 minutes ago, Old Guy said: Well we signed Jenkins but I would definitely not want two guards on. If contracts. I would not pay two people at any of those positions. Ted Thompson disagrees. Just keep good football players on your team. Picking between Lang or Sitton because "you can't pay two guards" would've been silly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Guy Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Packerraymond said: Ted Thompson disagrees. Just keep good football players on your team. Picking between Lang or Sitton because "you can't pay two guards" would've been silly. Different time. Different cap and pay structures for players. how many great players did Bellichick let walk or trade because they didn’t for the cap structure. Probably a better model to follow. He also had a quarterback playing on a discount. might be why we only one 1 championship. Reckless spending. Edited January 8 by Old Guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R T Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 7 hours ago, craig said: Yes, I can't remind myself of that often enough. We're just coming out from an extended stretch of cap pressure, but we'll return to it in no time. Any millions unnecessarily spent next year are millions we'll wish we had a year or two later. Tangent: When Gute came in, he spent a bunch (successfully) on Z, Preston, Billy Turner. It worked great, and he was praised as being non-TT. But FA spending is always a manifestation of how well or poorly you drafted. That splurge into FA was totally the consequence of drafting ineffectively. Now that we've been drafting well again, plus with the extra picks three years straight, all cap space is going to get gobbled by draftees worth re-signing. Gute like TT should be facing years with draftees earning all the cap space and none left for outside FA's. Tangent 2: I don't remember the exact number of years, but I saw a note that bad-drafting-Belichek has gone many years without re-signing a draftee from rounds 1-3. That kind of lousy drafting is exactly why they are in current dreadful situation. And why a coach should not be entrusted with drafting and GM-ing! And when they are paying all their cap to former draft picks, we will have the same group of nitwits claiming the Packers never go all-in because they are not signing high dollar outside free agents. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 13 minutes ago, Old Guy said: Different time. Different cap and pay structures for players. how many great players did Bellichick let walk or trade because they didn’t for the cap structure. Probably a better model to follow. He also had a quarterback playing on a discount. might be why we only one 1 championship. Reckless spending. Count me in the group that's totally happy spending money on OL 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted January 9 Author Share Posted January 9 1 hour ago, Old Guy said: Different time. Different cap and pay structures for players. how many great players did Bellichick let walk or trade because they didn’t for the cap structure. Probably a better model to follow. He also had a quarterback playing on a discount. might be why we only one 1 championship. Reckless spending. Yeah, it was harder to keep players back then, lower cap, no void years, etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 9 hours ago, Old Guy said: You can't pay everybody and I think this is a good strategy. Unless Rhyan turns elite in the next two years, you replace him. Same with Myers. I just assume JRJ is down the road after this year. As it looks today, we are going to have a whole lot of guys we are going to want to hang onto in the next two, three years. We're a LONG way before we're talking about extending Rhyan. And he's going to have to play in more than 17% of the offensive snaps before that even becomes an issue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Guy Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 28 minutes ago, CWood21 said: We're a LONG way before we're talking about extending Rhyan. And he's going to have to play in more than 17% of the offensive snaps before that even becomes an issue. I actually said UNLESS he's elite in two year you let him walk. Not sure how you came up with wanting to extend him now. My point was you only pay guys who are elite. You can't give average to slightly above average guys big contract. We let other MVS and Lazard walk and allowed other teams to make the mistake of paying them. Correct decisions on both of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 1 minute ago, Old Guy said: I actually said UNLESS he's elite in two year you let him walk. Not sure how you came up with wanting to extend him now. My point was you only pay guys who are elite. You can't give average to slightly above average guys big contract. We let other MVS and Lazard walk and allowed other teams to make the mistake of paying them. Correct decisions on both of them. I mean, he's only playing in less than 20% of the offensive snaps this year. He's closer to being out of the league than he is receiving another contract at this point in time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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