2023 CFB Talk/Draft Prospects

[Ray Reed]

1 hour ago, wackywabbit said:

@Ray Reed will tell you that I'm as big a Lamar homer as there is, but if Lamar is only here on the tag and not a long term deal, I'm fine with a round 1 QB. Although in that (doomsday) scenario I prefer we trade Lamar now for assets and then trade w/e it takes to move up and get Stroud or Young this year.

No shame in being a homer at the end of the day. We all do it. I was unable to objectively discuss Jimmy Smith for a decade with friends because of my affinity towards him.

[diamondbull424]

1 hour ago, DreamKid said:

Some interesting things in the first mock from DJ this draft season:

- QB pick for us is just dumb. Doesn't even have us trading Lamar, but thinks we might decide to groom another one behind him....

- No Quentin Johnston in the 1st

- 👀 Devon Witherspoon at 6 to the Lions and Lukas Van Ness at 8 to the Falcons

 

Also there’s no Kelee Ringo, who is 20 with absurd measurables.

I do think we could see an emphasis on those positions, mainly being the OL and I could see the team drafting someone like Richardson, but only if they decide to take the picks for Lamar.

Otherwise two WRs in the first round seems quite suspect. Have to imagine at least 3 maybe 4 will go.

But if the board falls like this, we should absolutely take our top WR fit for the new offense and then consider trading a future pick to land someone like Ringo.

[DreamKid]

43 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

But if the board falls like this, we should absolutely take our top WR fit for the new offense and then consider trading a future pick to land someone like Ringo.

I think they'd just hold off until the 3rd Round, which would suck because I'd love a 1st Round CB(Soooo many great matches for us among the top prospects) but this class is really really deep according to everyone. So we should still be able to land a solid talent or two. 

[diamondbull424]

10 hours ago, DreamKid said:

I think they'd just hold off until the 3rd Round, which would suck because I'd love a 1st Round CB(Soooo many great matches for us among the top prospects) but this class is really really deep according to everyone. So we should still be able to land a solid talent or two. 

I wonder what type of value we could get for Chuck Clark.

This seems to be a pretty bad safety class from all accounts, so with that being the case, perhaps we can package Clark to a team in need along with our 3rd round pick to move up and get into the 2nd round at least.

And if an elite talent falls like this scenario we can do like we did with  Lamar and trade said 2nd and a future 2nd to move up and acquire said talent at the tail end of the 1st.

Without having watched the cornerbacks, if there are guys that have that young and elite profile, I’d rather go there than target another JAD level specimen. But maybe this CB class is just “like that.”

[DreamKid]

19 hours ago, diamondbull424 said:

I wonder what type of value we could get for Chuck Clark.

I'd say a 3rd or early 4th. Above average starter, defensive captain, and still only 27/28. Immediately would add a rock solid and super intelligent piece to any defensive core. The Giants would be a great trading partner. Wink is their DC and Tony Jefferson is starting for them, so adding Chuck to a defense with those young pieces and his former DC would make a lot of sense.

Could be wrong though, some clubs still really undervalue Safeties. We also don't have a ton of leverage as teams will know we want to move Clark with our surplus at the position and desire to spend that money at other spots. 

[DreamKid]

Boy, does Christian Gonzalez CB Oregon really jump out as someone our FO would be salivating to have fall to them. 

- 6'2 200+ Press Man CB with legit deep speed and Inside/Outside versatility.

- Insane movement & athleticism for his size(Made Bruce Feldman's CFB Freak List), falls right into the CB archetype this club has loved(Chris McAllister, Jimmy Smith, Marlon Humphrey). I get huge Jimmy Smith vibes when watching him cover, guarantee you guys will see it too. 

- Only 20 YO, same age as our last 1st Round CB Marlon Humphrey who also declared as a RS Soph.  

- Comes from athletic family, his father was a basketball player in Columbia and his sisters are college track & field athletes. Kyle Hamilton's dad was a basketball player and Marlon Humphrey's sister was a college track athlete as well. 

 

I'd say we have no shot at landing him, but this CB class is deep up top and sometimes that will make teams feel like they can wait a bit before grabbing one. Also CB rankings can be erratic club to club/scout to scout, and with so many options graded out as 1st Round Caliber prospects maybe he's the one who falls into our range? I mean Kyle Hamilton was getting mocked Top 5 at this point last year, we saw how that worked out for us.

The story of this 1st Round for the Ravens will be a bunch of WR2/SWR ceiling type players up against some All-Pro CB1 ceiling level CB prospects. Essentially 2nd-Early 3rd Round WR prospects getting elevated into the 1st because of a weak class, and Top 10-15 talents at CB lasting into the 20s because of a super deep class. Which feeds into my theory that EDC is really going to hit the nitro on trying to obtain a high end Vet at WR like Hopkins or Evans so he has the flexibility to draft a CB in Round 1 without complaints.

 

[Boodgyman5220]

On 1/21/2023 at 9:00 AM, diamondbull424 said:

I wonder what type of value we could get for Chuck Clark.

 

Would trading chuck for a 3/4th round pick be worth how it would. weaken our corner back room? Essentially Kyle hamilton played a slot corner roll with the ability to be a plus run defender. We’d have to take him out of that roll and insert someone else if we traded chuck.

[DreamKid]

Quentin Johnston's mechanical/technique issues scare me. Big time body catcher and I don't trust his releases at this stage of his development. We have essentially never developed a WR with those issues. He tracks the ball pretty good and his twitch + general ability after the catch is really impressive for a player his size, but I can't overlook those weaknesses. 

Jordan Addison or Jaxon Smith-Njigba are who I'm hoping the FO looks at as early round options. JSN might be more of a slot only option but I'll take a bust proof slot stud over a high bust potential X at this point. Addison is in that Diggs/Ridley/Bateman mold I love with his ability to separate, work after the catch, and find his way back to the ball- might be my early favorite.  

[diamondbull424]

2 hours ago, DreamKid said:

Quentin Johnston's mechanical/technique issues scare me. Big time body catcher and I don't trust his releases at this stage of his development. We have essentially never developed a WR with those issues. He tracks the ball pretty good and his twitch + general ability after the catch is really impressive for a player his size, but I can't overlook those weaknesses. 

Jordan Addison or Jaxon Smith-Njigba are who I'm hoping the FO looks at as early round options. JSN might be more of a slot only option but I'll take a bust proof slot stud over a high bust potential X at this point. Addison is in that Diggs/Ridley/Bateman mold I love with his ability to separate, work after the catch, and find his way back to the ball- might be my early favorite.  

Yup. I’m kind of in the same boat, though with a new OC coming in, I think if we go Quentin Johnston, there’s hope there in the selection that maybe between the new OC and perhaps Keith Williams on staff, that perhaps the technical flaws can improve from a route running perspective.

That said, I don’t think you can teach hands. Either a guy has them or they don’t IMO. So either he’s going to be used deep or long, I can’t see him being an intermediate threat at the NFL level with those hands.

Just reminded me too much of Breshan Perriman with his similar flaws and nearly identical collegiate production.

EDIT: This said, I still love his toughness and YAC ability, which is why I think there’s a bit of a “you can’t screw him up entirely” like a pure deep threat like Berryman. I think Johnston has a higher ceiling and a higher floor. We can coach the technical issues and I think if he can drill his hands he can work himself into a DK Metcalf style player. But even in the worst case that we don’t develop him I think he’s a 750-800 yds receiving type guy off pure talent.

Edited January 27, 2023 by diamondbull424

[diamondbull424]

On 1/22/2023 at 5:43 AM, DreamKid said:

Boy, does Christian Gonzalez CB Oregon really jump out as someone our FO would be salivating to have fall to them. 

- 6'2 200+ Press Man CB with legit deep speed and Inside/Outside versatility.

- Insane movement & athleticism for his size(Made Bruce Feldman's CFB Freak List), falls right into the CB archetype this club has loved(Chris McAllister, Jimmy Smith, Marlon Humphrey). I get huge Jimmy Smith vibes when watching him cover, guarantee you guys will see it too. 

- Only 20 YO, same age as our last 1st Round CB Marlon Humphrey who also declared as a RS Soph.  

- Comes from athletic family, his father was a basketball player in Columbia and his sisters are college track & field athletes. Kyle Hamilton's dad was a basketball player and Marlon Humphrey's sister was a college track athlete as well. 

 

I'd say we have no shot at landing him, but this CB class is deep up top and sometimes that will make teams feel like they can wait a bit before grabbing one. Also CB rankings can be erratic club to club/scout to scout, and with so many options graded out as 1st Round Caliber prospects maybe he's the one who falls into our range? I mean Kyle Hamilton was getting mocked Top 5 at this point last year, we saw how that worked out for us.

The story of this 1st Round for the Ravens will be a bunch of WR2/SWR ceiling type players up against some All-Pro CB1 ceiling level CB prospects. Essentially 2nd-Early 3rd Round WR prospects getting elevated into the 1st because of a weak class, and Top 10-15 talents at CB lasting into the 20s because of a super deep class. Which feeds into my theory that EDC is really going to hit the nitro on trying to obtain a high end Vet at WR like Hopkins or Evans so he has the flexibility to draft a CB in Round 1 without complaints.

 

To follow this up. Full breakdown of Gonzalez, I’ll also have to check out his WR videos and some of his other videos that he has up as well.

 

Edited January 28, 2023 by diamondbull424

[diamondbull424]

WR1 = JSN IMO- The more I watch the more I’m seeing some DeAndre Hopkins. He’s got an innate ability to keep himself clean with the physicality of his hands, he presents his hands late so as to disrupt CB’s ability to recover for PBUs, and he’s a route technician that consistently makes the juice worth the squeeze and gets himself first downs by virtue of setting up defenders with his release packages, with manipulating zone spacing, cover leverage, and hand positioning.

I initially felt he was perhaps just an elite slot, but similar to AJ Brown coming out, I think he’s shown that he can similarly manipulate along the boundary. Definitely my WR1 and I think if he’s available at 22, regardless of his durability, he’s got an absurd floor that’s near elite. Only bust chance I give is due to durability and considering the rest of this draft, I think you take that chance and keep it moving. EDC can’t mess this one up IMO. He’s got a similar game to Mark Andrews, but at the WR position, I wouldn’t doubt Lamar will have chemistry with him. Only negative would be we’d still need a burner, but there are guys available that could fit that role in the draft and FA.

 

Edited January 28, 2023 by diamondbull424
Forgot to post the link and include JSN name

[DreamKid]

37 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

WR1- The more I watch the more I’m seeing some DeAndre Hopkins. He’s got an innate ability to keep himself clean with the physicality of his hands, he presents his hands late so as to disrupt CB’s ability to recover for PBUs, and he’s a route technician that consistently makes the juice worth the squeeze and gets himself first downs by virtue of setting up defenders with his release packages, with manipulating zone spacing, cover leverage, and hand positioning.

I initially felt he was perhaps just an elite slot, but similar to AJ Brown coming out, I think he’s shown that he can similarly manipulate along the boundary. Definitely my WR1 and I think if he’s available at 22, regardless of his durability, he’s got an absurd floor that’s near elite. Only bust chance I give is due to durability and considering the rest of this draft, I think you take that chance and keep it moving. EDC can’t mess this one up IMO. He’s got a similar game to Mark Andrews, but at the WR position, I wouldn’t doubt Lamar will have chemistry with him. Only negative would be we’d still need a burner, but there are guys available that could fit that role in the draft and FA.

Who are you talking about here DB? There's no prospect name. I'm guessing JSN though.

[diamondbull424]

Jordan Addison breakdown.

I don’t disagree with the breakdown, I just disagree with Addison being quite as special a player. I think he’s really good for all the reasons outlined in the video.

However my gripe with Addison is that I don’t believe he’s an elite route runner. I think he’s got elite agility and can perhaps improve further and become a Stefon Diggs type of WR option, but as it stands, he doesn’t do a good enough job with manipulating defender leverage to create additional spacing as he could. I don’t find that he’s active enough with his hands mid route to create additional space and with his speed being great but not elite, I think good to great NFL corners will be able to give him problems as he’s currently developed.

I see a guy that will toast the average corners, but will have growing pains against the higher tier guys.

Also I think he presents his hands early enough to allow for defender recovery. In college against lesser athletes, it doesn’t result in any lost plays, but at the next level, that’s IMO the difference between an explosive play and a PBU by the defender.

 

[diamondbull424]

8 minutes ago, DreamKid said:

Who are you talking about here DB? There's no prospect name. I'm guessing JSN though.

Yup. I completely forgot to post the link. Didn’t realize until I stopped to post the Jordan Addison analysis/breakdown. Good guess btw, but I suppose JSN has been my WR1 for awhile now.

I really enjoy this guys film breakdowns. He does an excellent job. Very underrated channel.

Edited January 28, 2023 by diamondbull424

[DreamKid]

Flowers probably just kissed a Top 40-50 selection goodbye.