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The 2023 Draft Thread - We're picking #7


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49 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

We haven't had great coaches but we've also failed to properly build the unit with talent, particularly in the trenches. 

Graham's resume isn't great:

Miami - 2019 (30th in ypg, 32nd in ppg)

New York - 2020 (12th in ypg, 9th in ppg) | 2021 (21st in ypg, 23rd in ppg) 

Vegas - 2022 (28th in ypg, 26th in ppg) 

One good unit and three mediocre units and the good unit became mediocre the following season with the same core of players.

Man that doesn't bode well for us.  I don't really understand what the thought process was when we hired him.  Maybe the teams he went to just lacked talent every single year?

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Just now, Jerry said:

Man that doesn't bode well for us.  I don't really understand what the thought process was when we hired him.  Maybe the teams he went to just lacked talent every single year?

The Giants have/had a pretty talented defense. Graham seems to be pretty highly regarded around the league, IIRC he was getting some head coaching looks last offseason. 

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1 hour ago, NYRaider said:

We haven't had great coaches but we've also failed to properly build the unit with talent, particularly in the trenches. 

Graham's resume isn't great:

Miami - 2019 (30th in ypg, 32nd in ppg)

New York - 2020 (12th in ypg, 9th in ppg) | 2021 (21st in ypg, 23rd in ppg) 

Vegas - 2022 (28th in ypg, 26th in ppg) 

One good unit and three mediocre units and the good unit became mediocre the following season with the same core of players.

Context is everything here:

Miami - Obvious tank before the season started. Deliberate bottoming out. Gutted the entire roster on both sides of the ball. 

New York - 2020 - terrific year. 2021, dealt with a lot of injuries. Defense was on the field a lot with a league worst offense. 

Vegas - What needs to be said? Bad roster, injuries, etc. all played a part. 

When he's had talent, he's done well. He's just been on 4 terrible teams. 

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4 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

Context is everything here:

Miami - Obvious tank before the season started. Deliberate bottoming out. Gutted the entire roster on both sides of the ball. 

New York - 2020 - terrific year. 2021, dealt with a lot of injuries. Defense was on the field a lot with a league worst offense. 

Vegas - What needs to be said? Bad roster, injuries, etc. all played a part. 

When he's had talent, he's done well. He's just been on 4 terrible teams. 

I just don't get why he gets so much praise considering his resume thus far. Even last season our defense seemed to be confused and lacked situational awareness in big moments. 

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2 hours ago, Jerry said:

Man that doesn't bode well for us.  I don't really understand what the thought process was when we hired him.  Maybe the teams he went to just lacked talent every single year?

Been saying it all along, he road Josh's coattails to job security in taking a job nobody else would have wanted due to who the HC was, his reputation, the likelihood he flops, and the lack of talent across the board on his side of the ball. 

I'm not a fan of Graham's, as his record speaks for itself. 

But it was another reason my only initial reaction to hiring Josh McDaniels in the first place was "Gross". He's not going to attract good assistant coaches because virtually nobody believes in him as a head coach. His time in Denver may have been all but entirely forgotten by active players in the league, but coaches have a longer shelf life. They remember he was an astounding failure. They remember he ditched Indianapolis at the altar. They're not going to line up to come hitch wagons with the guy, especially when it's hardly a secret that if he's successful, he wants the Pats head job once Bill retires, and if it fails, they're back looking for a job. 

I bet Josh wouldn't have taken the Vegas job if his buddy wasn't made GM, affording him extra unwarranted job security. I've been lukewarm on Zeigler so far as I don't think he's made too many huge mistakes for a first time GM. That said, however, what had Zeigler done that was so incredibly astounding that he warranted a GM role to begin with? 

It boils down to our owner being a gullible goof. 

 

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12 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

Been saying it all along, he road Josh's coattails to job security in taking a job nobody else would have wanted due to who the HC was, his reputation, the likelihood he flops, and the lack of talent across the board on his side of the ball. 

I'm not a fan of Graham's, as his record speaks for itself. 

But it was another reason my only initial reaction to hiring Josh McDaniels in the first place was "Gross". He's not going to attract good assistant coaches because virtually nobody believes in him as a head coach. His time in Denver may have been all but entirely forgotten by active players in the league, but coaches have a longer shelf life. They remember he was an astounding failure. They remember he ditched Indianapolis at the altar. They're not going to line up to come hitch wagons with the guy, especially when it's hardly a secret that if he's successful, he wants the Pats head job once Bill retires, and if it fails, they're back looking for a job. 

I bet Josh wouldn't have taken the Vegas job if his buddy wasn't made GM, affording him extra unwarranted job security. I've been lukewarm on Zeigler so far as I don't think he's made too many huge mistakes for a first time GM. That said, however, what had Zeigler done that was so incredibly astounding that he warranted a GM role to begin with? 

It boils down to our owner being a gullible goof. 

Graham seemed to be highly regarded before we hired him though, he was getting some head coaching looks, IIRC. 

Weren't they a package deal when they got hired? Of course he wouldn't have taken the job. Zeigler the jury is still out on for me as well but I'm not impressed so far.

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2 hours ago, ronjon1990 said:

It boils down to our owner being a gullible goof. 

 

Bingo...Mark seeked others help when he hired Reggie. Reggie helped get us out of cap hell but he had his flaws especially with drafting. Once Mark was able to get Gruden, he gave him all the power and Gruden dumped Reggie for a 'yes man' in Mayock who had no experience as a GM. Horrible drafting continued and the 10 year trap ended with some 'released' emails from Gruden. So Mark let it all go and wanted a 'program' of doing things and brought the Partiots system in with McDaniels and Zeigler. So 3rd times the charm or 3 strikes and you're out. If this doesn't work out Mark should sell the team as he hasn't learned how to be an NFL owner. Vegas and the Raiders name would be worth a LOT more in competent hands. 

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I don't see how we can't find two starters in this draft. If we trade down then probably 3. CB's and Oline are deep. A handful of DT's are better than what we got currently and same thing could be said about the LB's. Probably a dozen Olinemen could start over what we've got. So I'm not a fan of trading up as this team needs a lot of help, especially if they want to get 'their people.'

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16 minutes ago, G said:

Bingo...Mark seeked others help when he hired Reggie. Reggie helped get us out of cap hell but he had his flaws especially with drafting. Once Mark was able to get Gruden, he gave him all the power and Gruden dumped Reggie for a 'yes man' in Mayock who had no experience as a GM. Horrible drafting continued and the 10 year trap ended with some 'released' emails from Gruden. So Mark let it all go and wanted a 'program' of doing things and brought the Partiots system in with McDaniels and Zeigler. So 3rd times the charm or 3 strikes and you're out. If this doesn't work out Mark should sell the team as he hasn't learned how to be an NFL owner. Vegas and the Raiders name would be worth a LOT more in competent hands. 

Reggie's mediocre drafting is one of the main reasons that JDR eventually got fired and Gruden was hired to replace him. The team was extremely top heavy because he wasted premium picks year after year, lol. It is pretty crazy though that we've had three GMs within a decade. 

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3 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Graham seemed to be highly regarded before we hired him though, he was getting some head coaching looks, IIRC. 

Weren't they a package deal when they got hired? Of course he wouldn't have taken the job. Zeigler the jury is still out on for me as well but I'm not impressed so far.

The highly regarded part is WAAAAY overblown. Maybe guys like him. Maybe he's a players coach.

But the only time he got any HC looks was after his lone decent season, as virtually every does assistant these days, and it appears to be a massive outlier for Graham. 

That said, I'm sure opposing offensive minds regard the heck out of him for continually making them look fantastic. Dude has likely saved a job or two singlehandedly. 

 

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3 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Reggie's mediocre drafting is one of the main reasons that JDR eventually got fired and Gruden was hired to replace him. The team was extremely top heavy because he wasted premium picks year after year, lol. It is pretty crazy though that we've had three GMs within a decade. 

It was not RM's poor drafting that led to JDR's firing.  It was the politics that eventually led to players quitting on him.  The Washington game was the last straw for many players.  I really believe that Gruden got some information and cleaned house of players that quit on JDR and Carr.  That is how it looked to me.  Moves were made that did not make sense, Mark Davis came out and gave some evidence of this being a possibility in an interview, and then the emails came out giving some indication that Gruden was similar to JDR.

 

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11 hours ago, ronjon1990 said:

Been saying it all along, he road Josh's coattails to job security in taking a job nobody else would have wanted due to who the HC was, his reputation, the likelihood he flops, and the lack of talent across the board on his side of the ball. 

I'm not a fan of Graham's, as his record speaks for itself. 

But it was another reason my only initial reaction to hiring Josh McDaniels in the first place was "Gross". He's not going to attract good assistant coaches because virtually nobody believes in him as a head coach. His time in Denver may have been all but entirely forgotten by active players in the league, but coaches have a longer shelf life. They remember he was an astounding failure. They remember he ditched Indianapolis at the altar. They're not going to line up to come hitch wagons with the guy, especially when it's hardly a secret that if he's successful, he wants the Pats head job once Bill retires, and if it fails, they're back looking for a job. 

I bet Josh wouldn't have taken the Vegas job if his buddy wasn't made GM, affording him extra unwarranted job security. I've been lukewarm on Zeigler so far as I don't think he's made too many huge mistakes for a first time GM. That said, however, what had Zeigler done that was so incredibly astounding that he warranted a GM role to begin with? 

It boils down to our owner being a gullible goof. 

 

Man.... you much have drank the water in Mobile this weekend. We already established you did not post a single thing regarding McDaniels when hire, nor Graham. You only started mouthing off once the season started and you could speak in hindsight. 

This post is opinionated nonsense and hyperbole. Teams have been interested in McDaniels for years. He's very well respected in the league. The hire was lauded with praise by the media and a lot of former players. 

Stop trying to paint a narrative we all know is not true. 

 

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4 hours ago, big_palooka said:

Man.... you much have drank the water in Mobile this weekend. We already established you did not post a single thing regarding McDaniels when hire, nor Graham. You only started mouthing off once the season started and you could speak in hindsight. 

This post is opinionated nonsense and hyperbole. Teams have been interested in McDaniels for years. He's very well respected in the league. The hire was lauded with praise by the media and a lot of former players. 

Stop trying to paint a narrative we all know is not true. 

 

There were also former Broncos players and Indianapolis media personnel who brought up their history with him.  McDaniels definitely has a checkered past.  I still don't know if he's the guy.  I'd bet he isn't.

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4 hours ago, big_palooka said:

Man.... you much have drank the water in Mobile this weekend. We already established you did not post a single thing regarding McDaniels when hire, nor Graham. You only started mouthing off once the season started and you could speak in hindsight. 

This post is opinionated nonsense and hyperbole. Teams have been interested in McDaniels for years. He's very well respected in the league. The hire was lauded with praise by the media and a lot of former players. 

Stop trying to paint a narrative we all know is not true. 

 

https://forums.footballsfuture.com/topic/38737-the-search-for-a-new-head-coach/?do=findComment&comment=4338302

Man, you really are mentally challenged aren't you? 

Now I feel bad for poking fun at you for your Graham fellating. Clearly no reading comprehension, research skill, common sense, and Lord only knows what else is missing between your ears. 

Then again, I also think you deserve to feel like a complete idiot for getting even the most basic of facts wrong. Try harder. 

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