I don't understand why Baker gets so much hate

[AkronsWitness]

1 hour ago, onejayhawk said:

If Mayfield would shut up and played football he might he may actually be that, along with Kyler Murrray, Mac Jones, and the ghost of Ben Roethlisberger. 

I mean in 2020 he was 10th in QBR (between Brady/Carr), led the Browns to the playoffs and beat the Steelers while having better than a 3:1 TD/INT ratio.

It is not out of the question that he was arguably a top 10 QB post 2020. It just people are prisoners of the moment and since his 2021 was so bad people forget exactly how good he was the year before.

I dont think he was ever 'elite' but he absolutely looked like a good franchise QB following 2020 which would have put him in that 9-12 range.

Edited May 26, 2022 by AkronsWitness

[brownie man]

Baker has enough talent to win a Super Bowl is everything around him is going perfect. 
 

Someone mentioned it earlier but at the core hes insecure in himself. Deep down he knows his talent deficiencies and tries to play with that underdog demeanor to overcome it. 
 

It’s the insecurity and immaturity. He doesn’t beat good teams. Look at this whole career and he can’t beat the good teams. His record vs Baltimore and Pittsburgh is bad. He can light up Cincinnati for some reason. Those are his best games. Wanna watch Baker at his best watch his games vs Cinci. 
 

I think someone will trade for him once a QB drops. Let’s Daniel Jones get hurt for example I think they’d reach out for Baker. It’s just going to take an injury. 

[Forge]

6 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

I mean in 2020 he was 10th in QBR (between Brady/Carr), led the Browns to the playoffs and beat the Steelers while having better than a 3:1 TD/INT ratio.

It is not out of the question that he was arguably a top 10 QB post 2020. It just people are prisoners of the moment and since his 2021 was so bad people forget exactly how good he was the year before.

I dont think he was ever 'elite' but he absolutely looked like a good franchise QB following 2020 which would have put him in that 9-12 range.

There's a certain degree of irony in saying people are prisoners of the moment with regards to his 2021 season while also saying he was arguably a top 10 QB after 2020 because of a really nice stretch of 8-10 games that year at the end of the season. 

[43M]

2 hours ago, Tk3 said:

 

 

 

well.. this took a gross turn for no reason

Don't get me wrong, I think people in general should wait a while to get married for maturity reasons

But to just make a blatant assumption that full grown men are incapable of being faithful + women are just happy to marry rich, even if the man is unfaithful is just offensive to every party involved.

😄

Sorry if reality offends you, but I dont really care.

I even stated there are some who would remain faithful, but if you really think that most young millionaire athletes are going to remain faithful or that most women would not marry primarily for financial security, you are helplessly naive and out of touch with modern society.

Edited May 26, 2022 by 43M

[Warhorse]

17 hours ago, onejayhawk said:

For what it may be worth, last summer I was criticized for daring to say that Derrick Carr might be as good as Baker Mayfield. 

J

Lol. There was a thread a couple years ago about what franchise was taking a downturn. I said Seahawks. I didn't exactly receive a ringing endorsement. 

[ronjon1990]

13 minutes ago, brownie man said:

Baker has enough talent to win a Super Bowl is everything around him is going perfect. 
 

Someone mentioned it earlier but at the core hes insecure in himself. Deep down he knows his talent deficiencies and tries to play with that underdog demeanor to overcome it. 
 

It’s the insecurity and immaturity. He doesn’t beat good teams. Look at this whole career and he can’t beat the good teams. His record vs Baltimore and Pittsburgh is bad. He can light up Cincinnati for some reason. Those are his best games. Wanna watch Baker at his best watch his games vs Cinci. 
 

I think someone will trade for him once a QB drops. Let’s Daniel Jones get hurt for example I think they’d reach out for Baker. It’s just going to take an injury. 

In fairness, do many QBs have good records against these two? 

Genuinely asking if anyone knows beyond a few surefire Hall of Famers how many QBs/Teams have good records against them since, say, 2000? 

Roethlisberger's record vs Baltimore wasn't bad. 

Brady and Manning were good vs practically everyone. 

Other than that great company, anyone? Rivers' record was pretty bad vs Pitt and Bal. 

[brownie man]

10 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

In fairness, do many QBs have good records against these two? 

Genuinely asking if anyone knows beyond a few surefire Hall of Famers how many QBs/Teams have good records against them since, say, 2000? 

Roethlisberger's record vs Baltimore wasn't bad. 

Brady and Manning were good vs practically everyone. 

Other than that great company, anyone? Rivers' record was pretty bad vs Pitt and Bal. 

That’s a fair point, but when you’re in our division you’ve got to beat them. At least be around 500% and he’s not that. I think he’s only beat Pittsburgh once in a game that mattered which was the playoff game where the snap goes over Ben’s head for a TD to start the game. 

He’s just not great, but he acts like he is. That’s the problem. The immaturity more than anything. 

[AkronsWitness]

1 hour ago, Forge said:

There's a certain degree of irony in saying people are prisoners of the moment with regards to his 2021 season while also saying he was arguably a top 10 QB after 2020 because of a really nice stretch of 8-10 games that year at the end of the season. 

My point being you cant slam Baker for playing like crap last year (injuries) but not also recognize how good he was in the year before that, which is the whole part in question. I dont think its crazy at all to say he was a top 10 QB after 2020.

Its a lot easier for me to explain how bad he was last year (injuries) than it is for Baker haters to make 'yeah but' excuses for how well he played in 2020.

[Forge]

1 hour ago, AkronsWitness said:

My point being you cant slam Baker for playing like crap last year (injuries) but not also recognize how good he was in the year before that, which is the whole part in question. I dont think its crazy at all to say he was a top 10 QB after 2020.

Its a lot easier for me to explain how bad he was last year (injuries) than it is for Baker haters to make 'yeah but' excuses for how well he played in 2020.

Based on an 8-10 game stretch in 2020? You're criticizing people for recency bias using 2021 as a basis for how they feel about him while bumping him to a top 10 QB after 2020 because of a small stretch of games to end that season. You're not seeing the hypocrisy there? So people have recency bias right now, but if you were advocating that he was a top 10 QB after 2020, that wouldn't have been recency bias? I get that you can "justify" the craptastic play he has had whenever he has had it (2019, well it was the freddie Kitchens crap...start of 2020...well, he was learning a new system....2021...well he was hurt) but supporting him as a top 10 QB after a small sample fantastic play is still very much recency bias. Especially considering that one of the things that made that stretch so good was a massive outlier (his INTs). 

Furthermore,  I really don't think 2021 is nearly as impactful on people's thinking of Baker as you're making it out to be. The thread last year was before the season and people were still arguing that he was worse than the likes of Derek Carr who is a very fringe top 10 QB. A lot of people saw him as a largely average-esque QB. That tier is pretty big and the players within that tier can move pretty generously based on their most recent year's performance because these guys tend to be very up and down. I don't see many people using 2021 as a justification for saying Baker "sucks". I honestly don't believe the majority of people's opinion on Baker have changed all that much over the years.

Baker is certainly capable of putting up a top 10 season on any given year. But here's the thing...there are like 20 QBs I could say that about, and that is not hyperbole. We've seen guys like Jared Goff put up multiple top 10 QB seasons. In order to ensconce himself as a top 10 QB in the league, he's going to have put up those type of seasons consistently over multiple years, and he 100% hasn't done that, excuses or no. 

 

[Forge]

1 hour ago, ronjon1990 said:

In fairness, do many QBs have good records against these two? 

Its very hard to consistently win against good teams. I believe that there are 5 active quarterbacks with winning records against winning teams. I think its Brady, Mahomes, Lamar, Jimmy G, Russell Wilson 

[ronjon1990]

16 minutes ago, Forge said:

Its very hard to consistently win against good teams. I believe that there are 5 active quarterbacks with winning records against winning teams. I think its Brady, Mahomes, Lamar, Jimmy G, Russell Wilson 

One of these is not like the others

[Forge]

3 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

One of these is not like the others

That lamar run game is legit. 

[dll2000]

20 hours ago, MWil23 said:

He has his own perfect meme:

Not a Baker hater, but that's funny.

 

[onejayhawk]

2 hours ago, Warhorse said:

Lol. There was a thread a couple years ago about what franchise was taking a downturn. I said Seahawks. I didn't exactly receive a ringing endorsement. 

I hear you. I said the Seahawks would take a step back after the second Super Bowl and you would think I claimed membership in a racist orgaization. 

 

44 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

One of these is not like the others

Not really. Jimy G is a very good QB when he's healthy. It's the staying healthy that he has trouble doing. 

He also had a 10 point lead in the 4th quarter of a Super Bowl. Blame that loss on the defense or on Hill and Mahomes, but not on the QB.  

[Forge]

26 minutes ago, onejayhawk said:

He also had a 10 point lead in the 4th quarter of a Super Bowl. Blame that loss on the defense or on Hill and Mahomes, but not on the QB.  

Nah, you can give a lot of that blame to Jimmy (though everyone else certainly deserves a share of it too - it's not all on Jimmy). He was straight dreadful in the final quarter. You don't really see it in the game broadcast, but there are multiple articles and videos out there that broke down how awful he was in the 4th quarter when you see the coaches tape. It's pretty funny. He obviously missed the big time throw to Sanders, but there were a ton of times he simply didn't throw it to the guy who was wide open.