The Jalen Hurts Thread

[TheRealMcCoy]

  

2 hours ago, DeJack_10 said:

“I Can throw the ball 32 yards” 😂

That’s my QB. Jalen is gonna prove a lot of people wrong this year and I’m here for it. 

lmao the little dude in the blue shirt with the same name as me (sounded like Alex) was great... pure joy on his face running up.

Love how he slapped Jalen's hand on the handshake and said "my guy!!" lol

Love going to his page and seeing this every time as his pinned tweet.

Some people I think saw it as contrived when he had an opening statement to his press conference about the gun violence issue after the Uvalde school shooting and giving his thoughts on it for 5.5 straight minutes before opening it up to reporters for questioning. But, I think that is honestly a garbage take and think it really hit close for him not only being in his home state of Texas, but also cause his dad is the coach of his high school (Channelview) and his mom is the Head of the Special Services Department and teaches math to special education students there as well. I think him saying how he can't imagine his cousins or little sister not coming home from school or parents not coming home from work was very genuine. 

Dude recognizes the platform he has and doesn't take it for granted.

On 6/25/2022 at 5:42 PM, TheRealMcCoy said:

For my favorite Eagles on a personal level he's right there with Nick Foles.

Both of them are super easy to like and root for.

Gotta give his parents credit on raising him. They did a tremendous job.

[TheRealMcCoy]

40 minutes ago, TheRealMcCoy said:

20 hours ago, Jeezla said:

What rank would you have given him for last year? 20 is still a step up from 25-27.

I'd argue that he was top 20 on last year alone.

Maybe not top 20 strictly as a passer, but when factoring in his legs into how he plays the position. If you don't factor in what Lamar or Kyler do with their legs they wouldn't be as high on peoples lists as they are. Even Josh Allen with his legs boosts his ranking. He was only 4 yards rushing behind Jackson and 21 yards behind Hurts. Granted he played 2 games more than Hurts and 5 games more than Jackson. Still Allen's legs are a big part of the Bills offense. They do a bunch of designed runs for him.

That's why seeing that you voted for 20-24 was slightly disappointing to me. I can understand the pessimism though. I know I'm glass half full almost always and you're almost always glass half empty. 

Not saying you are wrong. Nobody can for sure project what he will do this year. I know I've said he has got better as a passer every single year since his true freshman year at Bama and I still believe that to be true, but he could also stay the same or even regress. I think it will be hard to regress with the addition of AJ Brown and the OL he'll have in front of him which could be better than last year, but something interesting I heard from a PFF podcast today is they were talking about an article up on their site which I don't have access to. Basically what the article is about is the difference between guys clean pocket grade and under pressure grade. Guys at the top of the list are guys who had a big difference between those two grades and the ones at the bottom were guys who had the least difference between the two grades. So their overall point was the guys at the top of the list who had the biggest difference like lets say a high grade with a clean pocket and low grade against pressure like Jimmy (#1) and Tua (#2) have reason for optimism based on the volatility of grade vs. pressure that they could be in for a better season. Whereas guys at the bottom of the list who had really good grades against pressure, but whose grade in the clean pocket wasn't all that much better could be in for some regression if that grade against pressure falls off some which is highly likely whereas grade in a clean pocket is more stable.

The QBs at the bottom of the list for difference between clean pocket vs. pressure?

26. Josh Allen (Has been terrific against pressure the past 2 seasons, but last year his clean pocket grade fell off from 2020)

27. Dak Prescott 

28. Jared Goff

29. Daniel Jones

31. Carson Wentz

32. Jalen Hurts 

They said that Carson and Jalen both graded in the 70s from a clean pocket. Wentz wasn't that bad against pressure and Hurts was pretty good against pressure. Like they said for Allen his grade against pressure didn't fall off from 2020 to 2021, but its a volatile grade/stat that you can't just assume is gonna stay the same cause its hard to have a high grade against pressure.

I do think Jalen thrives more outside the pocket, so it makes sense he's good against pressure. I'm not sure if I talked about it here or not yet, but Jalen's mechanical issues were much more prevalent from the pocket than when he broke it. 

I went back and watched some Eagles games after he tweeted this originally and it was definitely true.

Hurts footwork and lower body mechanics as a pocket passer might be more important to fixing his upper body stuff like tightening up the release which I think OTAs showed he did.

As you see in the Twitter post and the YouTube clip (I set the video to the part with Sirianni) you can hear Nick talk a lot about how he's worked on his footwork and how he sees it getting better, so that's an encouraging sign.

I do agree with you that his arm isn't the greatest. He's not gonna have a top 10 arm in the league. With his ability to scramble and make plays happen outside the pocket I don't think he needs a top 10 arm to be a successful QB. Would I love for him to have one? Absolutely. I think having a super strong arm lets you get away with a lot even when your mechanics or timing aren't the greatest. Mahomes can do some stuff he shouldn't be able to just cause of his arm talent.

The area Jalen ultimately has to improve isn't as a scrambler/improviser as he had the highest EPA in that regard, but you see his passing from the pocket fell woefully short of the other top scramblers.

I think the point about him being in the same offense for a 2nd year in a row for the first time since he was a kid in HS is a big deal and I've brought it up a lot since the end of last season. I also think the Eagles receivers and play callers failed him a good portion of the time like @TheHonestNFL brings up in the first couple tweets here. I think teams around the league will adjust more this year to take away Jalen's running opportunities, but I also think the staff having had a full season with him to learn what kind of passing concepts he excels most at is huge for him going into his 2nd year as the starter and his comfortability and how quick he sees things in the offense will just be a decent amount better than it was in 2021.

I also don't think it can really be understated how HUGE of an addition that AJ Brown really was. If he can stay healthy he's gonna be a big force multiplier for us beyond just taking pressure off DeVonta Smith and Dallas Goedert. It will allow the Eagles to incorporate more middle read concepts like @TheHonestNFL said in the last tweet. I really think AJ will play a decent amount in the slot for us. He played at least like 30% or so of his snaps there for the Titans and I wanna say his snaps in the slot had been going up since he was a rookie. I really think Quez was miscasted as the main slot receiver last season. I think his speed is better utilized on the outside where he can stretch the defense and open stuff up underneath for guys who are better at operating through traffic. I'm glad Quez got that experience, cause he'll still see some snaps from the slot, but hopefully it will be a lot less than what we saw in 2021. Sirianni wants his receivers to be interchangeable with the spots they play, so its not like gaining experience on how to operate in the slot was a bad thing for Quez.

Like I said before there is a chance he could stay the same or even regress, but I think the latter is just gonna be hard for him to do with how hard he has supposedly worked this offseason on his mechanics, comfortability in the same offense for another year, and the addition of Brown which should open up a lot more of the playbook.

Now, does that mean I still don't have questions about Hurts ultimate ceiling? Sure I do. I saw enough progress throughout the year despite the atrocious playoff game to the point where I think he can be an unanimous top 20 QB after 2021 and might sneak into the top 15 if things go well. He's in a great spot with what we've surrounded him with personnel wise. 

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

BTW... let's just look at some QB rankings of where Jalen Hurts fell for the 2021 season:

Pro Football Focus grade: 10th.... EPA rank 13th...... for PFF's total rank of 11th

Football Outsiders (DYAR/DVOA): 17th/17th

Pro Football Network: 17th 

NFL.com QB Index: 17th

ESPN.com (Tannenbaum): 16th

247.com: 17th

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

I'll stop there with the rankings, but you get the point. Basically everywhere had him in the top 20.

I'd say if Jalen Hurts is in that 20-24 range like you voted for after 2022, then that's a significant disappointment.

We would be looking hard at using our 2 first rounders + 2024 picks to trade up in that case.

I think Jalen needs to be AT LEAST a solidified top 20 QB.. if not widely seen as top 15 to keep the team from looking to replace him.

Bumping this, because it got paged and I spent a lot of time writing it.

[TheRealMcCoy]

BTW when googling for what position at the school Jalen's mom has I ended up coming across this ESPN article:

I got chills reading it.... Jalen and his parents are impressive people.

I won't include a bunch of quotes or post the full article. Just go read it. But, I will post this one excerpt:

Quote

During an era in which transfers are more common, all anyone wanted to know was whether Hurts would stick it out or redshirt and leave. That he stayed and played whenever called upon was a surprise to many, including at least one of his former coaches at Alabama who assumed he'd try to preserve two years of eligibility rather than one.

In his decade at Alabama, strength coach Scott Cochran has seen remarkable athletes pass through his doors. When things inevitably get tough, when future All-Americans struggle with a lack of reps, it's not unusual for Cochran to provide counsel. But Hurts, he said, is a unique story.

To go through all the ups and downs of the past three years, to handle his demotion the way he did, Cochran said, was nothing short of incredible.

"He's built with something different, that's all I can say," he said. "His family, the way he takes coaching, he's built with something special. He was always ready.

"I always said, 'The phone booth is right there if you want to go turn into Superman.'"

When I went to the author of the articles twitter page his header is a picture of Jalen Hurts from a practice interview.

Searched his tweets to see if he left a big impression on him and....

Edited June 29, 2022 by TheRealMcCoy

[TheRealMcCoy]

I'm on a roll right now.... might as well keep going. Here are some other good tweets I found looking for that article in ESPN's feed:

Touching moment...

Strong words from Saban...

Former Eagles Head Coach...

After his last football game of his college career where he lost to LSU in the CFB Playoff....

He was 2-0 vs. LSU in his first 2 years at Bama. The respect was real.

Last, but certainly not least.... I remember this interview. This is how Jalen Hurts started his Oklahoma career.

The reporter had to ask him to give her a smile, because he was all business... 😂😭

The backstory to this season opener against Houston makes his response in the post game interview that much more powerful:

When Channelview met powerhouse Manvel in the first round of a bi-district playoff game in 2015, few gave the program a chance. Manvel had around a dozen Division I recruits. Channelview had two, and one was Hurts, who committed to Alabama that June. He might have been the best player on the field, but it takes more than one in football. 

Manvel scored the first 47 points and won going away, 71-21. The Mavericks had their share of dynamic moments, especially against an undersized opponent. But what stood out most about Hurts’ performance, coaches from both sides said, was his effort and the blow he delivered to a defender in the fourth quarter when the outcome was all but settled.

_______________________________________________________________

When Hurts transferred to Oklahoma, his first game, against Houston, set up a rematch with former Manvel quarterback D’Eriq King. The Manvel defender he ran over, Deontay Anderson, was also a Cougar.

“I haven’t forgotten,” Hurts said then when asked about his last high school game.

The quarterbacks’ roles were reversed with the Sooners heavily favored. Houston never stood a chance. Oklahoma raced out to a 21-0 lead and won, 49-31, as Hurts accounted for more than 500 yards and six total touchdowns.

Edited June 29, 2022 by TheRealMcCoy

[TheRealMcCoy]

Sando does this list every year. Used to do it over at ESPN and has done it at The Athletic since 2019 now.

Here is the criteria for how the list is tabulated:

Quote

 

The full 2022 Quarterback Tiers results are below for every veteran starter. The results reflect voting from 50 NFL coaches and executives, including six general managers, eight head coaches, 10 evaluators, 12 coordinators, six quarterback coaches and seven execs whose specialties include analytics, game management and the salary cap. The remaining ballot was put together by four members of one team’s personnel department.

The panel placed 35 veteran quarterbacks into one of five tiers, from best (Tier 1) to worst (Tier 5). Quarterbacks were then ranked by average vote and placed into tiers based on vote distribution, beginning with Aaron Rodgers, whose 1.00 average vote reflected his status as a unanimous Tier 1 selection.

The survey excludes rookies because voters have not seen them play in the NFL. More than one quarterback is featured for teams with unsettled starting jobs.

 

NFCE QB rankings:

Was 9th in 2021..... down 2 spots

Was 30th in 2021..... up 10 spots

Was T-19th in 2021..... down 1 spot

Was 22nd in 2021..... down 8 spots

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Write-up is pretty spot on too.

I'm curious who the two head coaches were that believed Hurts could possibly rise into tier 2 eventually.

For the record tier 2 started with Matthew Stafford at 7th and ended with old Matty Ice at 14th before beginning tier 3 with Kirk Cousins.

 

[Jroc04]

Spot on, IMO. I love Hurts, the man. Feel unsatisfied with Hurts, the player. I told myself if we got in the playoffs last year, he would have earned the next year as the unquestioned starter. Doesn’t really change the fact that he’s limited. I’m willing to watch and see if he progresses but it’s really just this year. He can’t have a repeat of last year, playoffs included and I would be on board for a long term deal. Ideally, Hurts is a perfect backup QB. He can will a few games to a W when you’re desperate but the longer he’s out there, the more the warts show. I would love for him to have a decent year, someone to fall in love with him and trade us a nice little package for him. Paying Hurts 30M+ seems like a big mistake to me. 

[TheRealMcCoy]

1 hour ago, Jroc04 said:

Spot on, IMO. I love Hurts, the man. Feel unsatisfied with Hurts, the player. I told myself if we got in the playoffs last year, he would have earned the next year as the unquestioned starter. Doesn’t really change the fact that he’s limited. I’m willing to watch and see if he progresses but it’s really just this year. He can’t have a repeat of last year, playoffs included and I would be on board for a long term deal. Ideally, Hurts is a perfect backup QB. He can will a few games to a W when you’re desperate but the longer he’s out there, the more the warts show. I would love for him to have a decent year, someone to fall in love with him and trade us a nice little package for him. Paying Hurts 30M+ seems like a big mistake to me. 

I just can't see with how Lurie and Roseman want the Eagles to throw the football that they'll pay him a significant contract unless he takes a big jump as a passer. If he doesn't progress as a passer a good amount, then you're right he would be the perfect back-up, but I can't see him staying a back-up in Philly after being the starter for at least 2 years. I think if he doesn't progress enough he's gonna end up being a 1 contract QB here. If he doesn't show enough progress this year, then good chance we trade up for a QB in what could be a pretty good class. If he does show enough progress this year to have some optimism about him and keep his job in 2023 on the last year of his deal, but not enough to give him an early extension, then maybe we do a trade like we did with the Saints where we move one of our 1st round picks back to 2023 as insurance. If Hurts takes a big step I could see the Eagles trying to pay him early like they tend to like to do to get a better deal, but with how they got burned with Wentz they may be a bit more apprehensive to go that way. No matter which scenario happens I think we're in a fairly good position with the draft capital and how we've started turning over the roster since after the 2020 season from the aging and often injured one it used to be. We still have a good amount of work to do, but I think we are in a good position despite having a question mark at QB right now.

Edited July 26, 2022 by TheRealMcCoy

[EaglesFlySBChampsHigh]

My pants can't take this thread!! Top 10 QB season incoming F it #HomerSeason 

[TheRealMcCoy]

 

[Jroc04]

Maybe we should keep a running tally of his season stats here. People were throwing around lofty numbers pre season. 

[TheRealMcCoy]

22 minutes ago, Jroc04 said:

Maybe we should keep a running tally of his season stats here. People were throwing around lofty numbers pre season. 

I don't think anyone here was really throwing out crazy high stats predictions tbh.

Maybe Nabbs on the first page? 

Edited September 15, 2022 by TheRealMcCoy

[TheRealMcCoy]

Chris Simms who didn't rank Hurts in his top 40 QBs last offseason is saying complimentary things? Weird

[Jroc04]

1 hour ago, TheRealMcCoy said:

I don't think anyone here was really throwing out crazy high stats predictions tbh.

Maybe Nabbs on the first page? 

Yea. That’s who I remember. lol 

[Nabbs4u]

18 minutes ago, Jroc04 said:

Yea. That’s who I remember. lol 

Long season, don't think it'sall that far fetched tbh. Could if easily had 24 TD passes last year without penalties.  Throwing to 4 WR not even on the 2022 roster a year later.

Guess we'll see?

Edited September 15, 2022 by Nabbs4u

[Jroc04]

1 hour ago, Nabbs4u said:

Long season, don't think it'sall that far fetched tbh. Could if easily had 24 TD passes last year without penalties.  Throwing to 4 WR not even on the 2022 roster a year later.

Guess we'll see?

Maybe he was on the unlucky side of that stat but then you’re assuming everything is perfect this year. Which never happens. He’s got to make his own luck. You can’t negate the misfortunes of playing QB. It happens to everyone. It all mostly comes out in the wash. 
 

I’m not trying to cheer against him or be a thorn in your side about it. I want him to succeed and improve to be a QB that can deliver top performances yearly. I’d be a fool to root for anything else. I just have my doubts. Just maybe a exercise in expectations can be measured. I’ll be keeping my tabs if we don’t want to be reminded weekly.