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Cavaliers Thread: We Don’t Suck Again!


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1 hour ago, FGK said:

Hard no. Toppin didn't show anything last year and that pick isn't worth much either. Sexton is a tough fit with our other core players, but he also showed some very real signs of developing into a very efficient, high-volume scorer last year. I get that we won't get full value from him because of both contract timing and our team situation, but I think if you can't do better than that you hold onto him and hope he accepts a role as an overqualified bench scorer.

 

Edited by bruceb
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4 hours ago, FGK said:

Hard no. Toppin didn't show anything last year and that pick isn't worth much either. Sexton is a tough fit with our other core players, but he also showed some very real signs of developing into a very efficient, high-volume scorer last year. I get that we won't get full value from him because of both contract timing and our team situation, but I think if you can't do better than that you hold onto him and hope he accepts a role as an overqualified bench scorer.

Yeah with the trade scenarios that I have seen suggested the last few weeks I've come around to the idea of just keeping #3, drafting Mobley (or the off chance Green), and paying Sexton what he's worth.  We drafted him, he's improved his game every year, he seems good for the culture, and it's not easy to find guys with his skillset.

I don't see that contract becoming untradable in the future either.  It doesn't seem like a bad idea to me adding a potential star at #3 and rolling it back again. 

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41 minutes ago, brownie man said:

At least we trying. If we can’t move up i want the trade with Orlando or possibly a trade with OKC. I just like Allen too much to draft Mobley 

I can't see Orlando trading. I guess let me clarify. I can't see why Orlando would have traded Vucecic, who was a solid player for them, to give up the asset earned from trading him and their own pick to get another big. I would 100% make the deal with them if they were game, I just don't see it. Out of curiosity, what are you thinking OKC would want to do in a deal?

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2 minutes ago, H2ThaIzzo said:

I can't see Orlando trading. I guess let me clarify. I can't see why Orlando would have traded Vucecic, who was a solid player for them, to give up the asset earned from trading him and their own pick to get another big. I would 100% make the deal with them if they were game, I just don't see it. Out of curiosity, what are you thinking OKC would want to do in a deal?

I should've clarified. Most likely Orlando would only do that trade if Green were there, and if that is the case I'm still doing the trade and coming about with

 

Kuminga and Jalen Johnson - Such a natural transition player definitely one of the best I've ever seen at his age. Needs to improve his 3 and willingness to shoot, but I would love Jalen on this team along with Kuminga. 

Kuminga and Kai Jones - Might end up being better than Mobley possibly hes got the talent to do it. Id much rather have Jones at 8 than Mobley at 3 

Kuminga and Scottie Barnes - Most likley wouldnt make it to 8, but would be our Draymond creator point forward. 

any of those combinations to me would be a better situation than Mobley or Green at 3 by themself. 

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4 hours ago, H2ThaIzzo said:

I just don't see how this happens. I like Cade, a lot, but there's no way I'd want to give up 3, Collin, and a bunch of other future assets to get him. 

Colin has to go one way or another. I’m fine with using him to move up. Can’t play Cade garland and Colin and I doubt Sexton would be cool with coming off the bench. Make that pick too 10 protected and I’d be good with it. 

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9 hours ago, H2ThaIzzo said:

I just don't see how this happens. I like Cade, a lot, but there's no way I'd want to give up 3, Collin, and a bunch of other future assets to get him. 

Trading of future assents like 1st are meaningless cause they will have protection attached to them. If we are playing well enough that we lose the pick, just means Cade was worth the move up

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5 hours ago, sdrawkcab321 said:

Colin has to go one way or another. I’m fine with using him to move up. Can’t play Cade garland and Colin and I doubt Sexton would be cool with coming off the bench. Make that pick too 10 protected and I’d be good with it. 

I don't agree to this at all. I will trade him for the right deal, but we don't have to move him one way or the other. 

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4 hours ago, H2ThaIzzo said:

I don't agree to this at all. I will trade him for the right deal, but we don't have to move him one way or the other. 

Some people act like trading Sexton is somehow addition by subtraction and it blows my mind.  He's the best scorer by far, and probably the best player on our team.  If we trade him we need somebody who will fill the void of the best scorer, and player, on our team.  To me it's that simple, and a lot of these trade scenarios being thrown around don't satisfy that. 

The fit with him paired with another short guard is just irrelevant until we become a playoff team.

Edited by Rod Johnson
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5 hours ago, Rod Johnson said:

Some people act like trading Sexton is somehow addition by subtraction and it blows my mind.  He's the best scorer by far, and probably the best player on our team.  If we trade him we need somebody who will fill the void of the best scorer, and player, on our team.  To me it's that simple, and a lot of these trade scenarios being thrown around don't satisfy that. 

The fit with him paired with another short guard is just irrelevant until we become a playoff team.

We can’t become a playoff team with 2 undersized no defense playing guards. 

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21 hours ago, H2ThaIzzo said:

I just don't see how this happens. I like Cade, a lot, but there's no way I'd want to give up 3, Collin, and a bunch of other future assets to get him. 

I wouldn't either.  But at the same time I think #3 and '22 Unprotected 1st might get it done.  Huge risk, but potentially huge reward for roster balancing options.

16 hours ago, sdrawkcab321 said:

Colin has to go one way or another. I’m fine with using him to move up. Can’t play Cade garland and Colin and I doubt Sexton would be cool with coming off the bench. Make that pick too 10 protected and I’d be good with it. 

I think if Sexton was coming off the bench in a Manu Ginobili or Harden in OKC situation where they are still playing starter minutes, are viewed as a key part of their Big 3, and of course got rewarded financially based on his production, he'd do it.  Seems like a guy that would do a lot that the team wants to help them win.

6 hours ago, Rod Johnson said:

Some people act like trading Sexton is somehow addition by subtraction and it blows my mind.  He's the best scorer by far, and probably the best player on our team.  If we trade him we need somebody who will fill the void of the best scorer, and player, on our team.  To me it's that simple, and a lot of these trade scenarios being thrown around don't satisfy that. 

The fit with him paired with another short guard is just irrelevant until we become a playoff team.

I agree.  If you swap Sexton with Green, you're still running a Portland type offense where the only difference is Green is a little taller than CJ but still would be 2 guards bad defensively, though Green could grow into it.  I really liked what I saw from Sexton/Okoro pairing to close out season with Garland out as it showed Sexton made a lot of progress finding guys both on the perimeter and at the rim when player collapsed around him.  Sexton had his higher assists average of the season and Okoro had his highest points of the season while the only "core" guys they had available really were Sexton/Okoro/Allen being run out there with Osman and Wade a lot of the time.

1 hour ago, sdrawkcab321 said:

We can’t become a playoff team with 2 undersized no defense playing guards. 

Making the playoffs, definitely possible.  Winning a championship, probably not.  I also don't think that you can truly contend if your main facilitator can't play defense unless they are All-NBA caliber scorers.  I think it'd be easier for the Cavs to try to run the Suns model of getting a defensive facilitator at PG, Rubio/CP3, have pure scoring 2 guard that doesn't play defense, Booker who although is 5 inches taller doesn't help his defense at all, and putting defensive players at 3-5 with some offensive ability, especially from 3pt range.

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