lavar703 Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 2 hours ago, MKnight82 said: Dotson was a consensus first round pick. Anything after the top 12-14 talents in a draft there's usually another 30 or so guys that could go in the 15-45 range. Calling Dotson a reach last year is kind of ridiculous imo. I wouldn’t say Dotson was a consensus first round pick. Now we really can only go by draft experts and I wouldn’t say all of them had him as a first rounder. It’s silly to do the revisionist history thing and say he wasn’t a reach. He absolutely was. It was no different than Jamin Davis. So in looking it up it’s as I remembered. Late first, early second round pick. Not top 20. Maybe in the grand scheme of things it doesn’t matter but they do this consistently with the players they pick. https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10021518-jahan-dotson-nfl-draft-2022-scouting-report-for-penn-state-wr.amp.html https://www.nfl.com/prospects/jahan-dotson/3200444f-5428-2798-d9f2-9e8608edcb8a https://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2022JDotson.php https://www.profootballnetwork.com/nfl-mock-draft-2022-jahan-dotson-top-consensus-landing-spots-draft-projections/ https://www.nfldraftbuzz.com/Player/Jahan-Dotson-WR-PennState Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Mc Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 16 minutes ago, lavar703 said: I wouldn’t say Dotson was a consensus first round pick. Now we really can only go by draft experts and I wouldn’t say all of them had him as a first rounder. It’s silly to do the revisionist history thing and say he wasn’t a reach. He absolutely was. It was no different than Jamin Davis. So in looking it up it’s as I remembered. Late first, early second round pick. Not top 20. Maybe in the grand scheme of things it doesn’t matter but they do this consistently with the players they pick. https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10021518-jahan-dotson-nfl-draft-2022-scouting-report-for-penn-state-wr.amp.html https://www.nfl.com/prospects/jahan-dotson/3200444f-5428-2798-d9f2-9e8608edcb8a https://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2022JDotson.php https://www.profootballnetwork.com/nfl-mock-draft-2022-jahan-dotson-top-consensus-landing-spots-draft-projections/ https://www.nfldraftbuzz.com/Player/Jahan-Dotson-WR-PennState I can't find the article, but immediately after the draft there was a team that stated had we not selected him, they would have. I think it's absolutely bizarre that you would still feel that Dotson was a reach, but you are entitled to your opinion. I will go on record and say that the Dotson trade and talent they got because of the trade is the single best Draft decision this staff has made. It's not even close either. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e16bball Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 I think there are degrees to the term “reach.” It’s not a binary thing where you either are one or aren’t one. Both Dotson and Davis went a bit higher than just about anyone in the draft media had really projected them, and that’s all we have to go on as fans. Just taking a quick look at the final mock drafts for a couple guys (Kiper, McShay, Brugler), they all had Jamin pegged between 26-29 and Jahan slotted between 23-26. Which means that each of them went about 7-10 picks before their perceived range (by leading draft media). I think that qualifies as a “slight reach” on both. Not Cole Strange level, but based on what we know, the consensus seemed to be that these guys would last a bit longer on the board. It’s not egregious, but there may have been an opportunity there in both cases to make a small move back and still get the guy. Even dropping back just 5 picks from 16 or 19 would net a late 3rd per the draft charts. The best drafting teams make these kinds of moves, and in doing so, they meaningfully increase their arsenal of picks over time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARTMONK HOF Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 17 minutes ago, e16bball said: I think there are degrees to the term “reach.” It’s not a binary thing where you either are one or aren’t one. Both Dotson and Davis went a bit higher than just about anyone in the draft media had really projected them, and that’s all we have to go on as fans. Just taking a quick look at the final mock drafts for a couple guys (Kiper, McShay, Brugler), they all had Jamin pegged between 26-29 and Jahan slotted between 23-26. Which means that each of them went about 7-10 picks before their perceived range (by leading draft media). I think that qualifies as a “slight reach” on both. Not Cole Strange level, but based on what we know, the consensus seemed to be that these guys would last a bit longer on the board. It’s not egregious, but there may have been an opportunity there in both cases to make a small move back and still get the guy. Even dropping back just 5 picks from 16 or 19 would net a late 3rd per the draft charts. The best drafting teams make these kinds of moves, and in doing so, they meaningfully increase their arsenal of picks over time. IMO Dotson and Davis’ character was the additional piece for them to be selected a little earlier than projected. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e16bball Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 4 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said: I will go on record and say that the Dotson trade and talent they got because of the trade is the single best Draft decision this staff has made. It's not even close either. I was in favor of the trade, as well, even though I thought it was a light return for that particular move down. My board got eviscerated between 11 and 16, which hurt. But they seemed to do well with the picks they ended up with, and if Howell is an actual NFL starting QB then it was a grand slam outcome. Still, it will be interesting to track Olave vs. Dotson. It was obvious that their focus was on the WR position, and they passed on the chance to take the last of the clear top 3 WRs in order to move down and take a lesser prospect. If Olave is a star and Dotson is just a guy, that would hurt. But I’d still favor the logic of the move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ripsean21 Posted March 22, 2023 Author Share Posted March 22, 2023 1 hour ago, ARTMONK HOF said: IMO Dotson and Davis’ character was the additional piece for them to be selected a little earlier than projected. I agree they def prioritize a certain type of character. They want the guys that are going to work work and the ones who just love it. Of course everyone is searching for that but we’ve really seemed to emphasize that here. Personally I had Dotson as a blue chip leading up to the draft so I’m not gonna call him a reach in the teens. Last year had a loaded class for me though especially with those DB’s and WR’s 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaiphoon Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 Two things: 1) If we can shore up the OL and CB situations a bit more I really want to grab Dalton Kincaid in the 1st. I've been watching a lot of videos and game "tape" on him lately and I really love what I see. Not a road grader for blocking, but he can at least shield and hold his own. But man is he really good in the passing game 2) I'm gonna surprise you guys and even though I'm a curmudgeon and Howell has only had 1 game, I'm gonna start early pushing all my chips into the pot for Howell to succeed. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKnight82 Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 2 hours ago, Thaiphoon said: 2) I'm gonna surprise you guys and even though I'm a curmudgeon and Howell has only had 1 game, I'm gonna start early pushing all my chips into the pot for Howell to succeed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e16bball Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 3 hours ago, Thaiphoon said: 1) If we can shore up the OL and CB situations a bit more I really want to grab Dalton Kincaid in the 1st. I've been watching a lot of videos and game "tape" on him lately and I really love what I see. Not a road grader for blocking, but he can at least shield and hold his own. But man is he really good in the passing game Really agree with the take on Kincaid. I’ve loved Mayer since September of his freshman season, but Kincaid just seems to have a little more burst and fluidity in the passing game. Just has the knack for getting open and securing the ball. I really hope everyone will be wrong about this preoccupation with sending a TE to GB at 15. They should take Addison or JSN, and the TEs should fall into the 20s, where we can scoop our favorite after a trade-down. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 4 hours ago, e16bball said: Really agree with the take on Kincaid. I’ve loved Mayer since September of his freshman season, but Kincaid just seems to have a little more burst and fluidity in the passing game. Just has the knack for getting open and securing the ball. I really hope everyone will be wrong about this preoccupation with sending a TE to GB at 15. They should take Addison or JSN, and the TEs should fall into the 20s, where we can scoop our favorite after a trade-down. I mean, it doesn’t seem to matter if Green Bay takes a TE or not as many of the local beat reporters and Rivera himself have said they’re happy with what they have there already. Which is insane considering what we have appears to be injury prone players and a major dart throw. Sigh. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Mc Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 4 hours ago, lavar703 said: I mean, it doesn’t seem to matter if Green Bay takes a TE or not as many of the local beat reporters and Rivera himself have said they’re happy with what they have there already. Which is insane considering what we have appears to be injury prone players and a major dart throw. Sigh. I still prefer IOL for our 1st round pick, but I could get on board with Mayer or Kincaid. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 Been on Kincaid for a while. Not sure I ever really wanted him at 16, but I'd be pumped regardless. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARTMONK HOF Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 Any of you think Nolan Smith GA-Edge/OLB could be close to Micah Parsons. Interesting prospect, listed probably as a tweener and rising up draft boards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSkinGM Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 1 minute ago, ARTMONK HOF said: Any of you think Nolan Smith GA-Edge/OLB could be close to Micah Parsons. Interesting prospect, listed probably as a tweener and rising up draft boards. I'm not familiar but THAT'S the position we need ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARTMONK HOF Posted March 23, 2023 Share Posted March 23, 2023 How would this news impact you picking him at 16? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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