Around the league Talk 2022-23

[Mesa_Titan]

19 minutes ago, twotonebluenation said:

Sadness

Too many errors adding up for Jrob.

Hard to blame him on that one. Adoree was pretty much average in all his time here. 

[-Hope-]

2 hours ago, titans0021 said:

Used a first-round pick on an Adoree replacement and then released him to afford Julio. What a brutal use of assets.

robinson is living entirely off the 2019 draft and tannehill trade because that man has been absolutely godawful ever since.

[TitanRedd]

7 hours ago, Mesa_Titan said:

Hard to blame him on that one. Adoree was pretty much average in all his time here. 

No he wasn’t he was simply used wrong, I been saying this for yr I was a big adoree advocate, because I know corners. He’s a man cover corner he sucks at zone it slows his game down tremendously why because he does not understand route concepts while playing off & sitting on routes. Every WR that has beaten him as a titan & by beaten him I’m saying put 80- 100 yards on him, the list is short. Will fuller, Tyreke Hill,Antonio Brown, Kenny stills caught a bomb on hill & Hollywood brown. Every yr Pro football focus grades him high in man coverage & below average in zone so that backs my hypothesis up. Vrabel is about guys that play his style of play, fits his system vs playing towards the strengths of his personnel. 

[KingTitan]

10 hours ago, titans0021 said:

Used a first-round pick on an Adoree replacement and then released him to afford Julio. What a brutal use of assets.

I think this is grossly out of context. 
Not one to go back and pull up receipts of posters but you will find very few were mad about releasing him as a player. It was a lot of shock about the direction given Butler was leaving too. We also didn't know what Fulton was. 
 

Adoree was mainly drafted because of what he added to special teams and maybe offense.  And he couldn't do either consistently. Then he as an average to slightly above average corner. 
Add on his injury plagued season...and he was gone. 

And Adoree isn't playing like a top 5 corner. I don't see that at all. 

Ramsey
Slay
Howard
Jaire Alexander
Denzel Ward
Marcus Lattimore
Tre’Davious White

I'll stop there. But I don't know if he would make my top 20.

Hindsight is always what it is, but Julio was a shot that many praised.  And we still ended up with 12 wins. Minus a turnover QB and questionable OC calls we are in the AFC championship. 

Posters said we were going to the cellar last year after releasing him.....yet we did not. 
Signed Jenkins. Fulton played well. Molden played well. Byard and Hooker were dope. 
I don't think it was a misuse of assets. We used that money to improve the defense and Julio and we ended up a better team than the year before. I don't know what else anyone could  ask for outside of a Super Bowl. 

[titans0021]

10 minutes ago, KingTitan said:

I think this is grossly out of context. 
Not one to go back and pull up receipts of posters but you will find very few were mad about releasing him as a player. It was a lot of shock about the direction given Butler was leaving too. We also didn't know what Fulton was. 
 

Adoree was mainly drafted because of what he added to special teams and maybe offense.  And he couldn't do either consistently. Then he as an average to slightly above average corner. 
Add on his injury plagued season...and he was gone. 

And Adoree isn't playing like a top 5 corner. I don't see that at all. 

Ramsey
Slay
Howard
Jaire Alexander
Denzel Ward
Marcus Lattimore
Tre’Davious White

I'll stop there. But I don't know if he would make my top 20.

Hindsight is always what it is, but Julio was a shot that many praised.  And we still ended up with 12 wins. Minus a turnover QB and questionable OC calls we are in the AFC championship. 

Posters said we were going to the cellar last year after releasing him.....yet we did not. 
Signed Jenkins. Fulton played well. Molden played well. Byard and Hooker were dope. 
I don't think it was a misuse of assets. We used that money to improve the defense and Julio and we ended up a better team than the year before. I don't know what else anyone could  ask for outside of a Super Bowl. 

Nah, people were pretty mad when we released Adoree lol. I mean, a lot of the doom and gloom that you accurately said was being spouted started with people upset about the Adoree move.

He was always under appreciated here though. I’m assuming it’s because he was billed as incredible playmaker Adoree Jackson coming out of USC and when it turned out he was actually just great coverage corner Adoree Jackson, it’s a lot less flashy. Even if it’s just as valuable. He’s one of the five best pure coverage corners in football over the last few years. The numbers speak for themselves. Where that translates in personal CB rankings kinds of depends on what you value.

His cap hit in New York last year was only $2 million higher than Jack Rabbit’s, there’s no sense in pretending his release freed up all this room. At best, it allowed us to get Julio.  Though, the Julio move came months after Adoree’s release.

We gambled that we could replace a very good CB entering his prime with a draft pick. Didn’t end up biting us last year,. Which, I guess given our move at WR this past year, seems to be the Robinson special. I look forward to us drafting a DL and trading Simmons in 2023 lol.

[TitanRedd]

29 minutes ago, KingTitan said:

I think this is grossly out of context. 
Not one to go back and pull up receipts of posters but you will find very few were mad about releasing him as a player. It was a lot of shock about the direction given Butler was leaving too. We also didn't know what Fulton was. 
 

Adoree was mainly drafted because of what he added to special teams and maybe offense.  And he couldn't do either consistently. Then he as an average to slightly above average corner. 
Add on his injury plagued season...and he was gone. 

And Adoree isn't playing like a top 5 corner. I don't see that at all. 

Ramsey
Slay
Howard
Jaire Alexander
Denzel Ward
Marcus Lattimore
Tre’Davious White

I'll stop there. But I don't know if he would make my top 20.

Hindsight is always what it is, but Julio was a shot that many praised.  And we still ended up with 12 wins. Minus a turnover QB and questionable OC calls we are in the AFC championship. 

Posters said we were going to the cellar last year after releasing him.....yet we did not. 
Signed Jenkins. Fulton played well. Molden played well. Byard and Hooker were dope. 
I don't think it was a misuse of assets. We used that money to improve the defense and Julio and we ended up a better team than the year before. I don't know what else anyone could  ask for outside of a Super Bowl. 

Look this up do your research my guy, he never was a top 5 or top 10 corner however even pro football focus has him high graded as a man cover corner his struggles are zone. When he was drafted **** lebeau a zone guru DC from day 1 played adoree to his strengths. He let him play on a island & play man. Here’s why he doesn’t get a lot of picks, he doesn’t jump routes he’s not a gambler he plays not to get beat. 
everyone always quick to say he’s an average or above average corner but to his defense as a titan he didn’t get beat by a lot of WR’s. Every WR that has beaten adoree far as put up 80-100 yards on him are as follows, Tyreke Hill, Will fuller, Antonio Brown, Hollywood brown & he gave up a bomb to Kenny stills vs Miami. How did those guys get open on him because when you ask him to play zone, he gives up a tone of cushion against speedsters because he doesn’t understand route concepts playing off & sitting on routes which is why he use to struggle with defending a slant. 
this is why I wanted wade phillips he plays to the strength of his personnel unlike vrabel who wants you to play within his scheme. 

[TitanRedd]

Go look at Stephon Gilmore in Buffalo Vs him with the patriots. Majority of people thought he was a bust, he gets to NE then boom he’s regarded as arguably top 1 or 2 CB in the league, outside looking in it’s the scheme it’s Belichick, but it’s bill allowing him to play his game, press man sticky coverage he did the opposite Buffalo did which was ask him to play off coverage zone corner Tampa 2. Sometimes a coach shouldn’t be about scheme & allow a player to play his game 

[KingTitan]

11 minutes ago, titans0021 said:

Nah, people were pretty mad when we released Adoree lol. I mean, a lot of the doom and gloom that you accurately said was being spouted started with people upset about the Adoree move.

He was always under appreciated here though. I’m assuming it’s because he was billed as incredible playmaker Adoree Jackson coming out of USC and when it turned out he was actually just great coverage corner Adoree Jackson, it’s a lot less flashy. Even if it’s just as valuable. He’s one of the five best pure coverage corners in football over the last few years. The numbers speak for themselves. Where that translates in personal CB rankings kinds of depends on what you value.

His cap hit in New York last year was only $2 million higher than Jack Rabbit’s, there’s no sense in pretending his release freed up all this room. At best, it allowed us to get Julio.  Though, the Julio move came months after Adoree’s release.

We gambled that we could replace a very good CB entering his prime with a draft pick. Didn’t end up biting us last year,. Which, I guess given our move at WR this past year, seems to be the Robinson special. I look forward to us drafting a DL and trading Simmons in 2023 lol.

I still felt the upset feeling was more about the roster construction opposed to him as a player. 

Just looking around at some media rankings for what's that worth, highest I've seen him was 12 and that was based on partly his time with us. 
I'm not saying he is trash, but it just one of those things that always happen.... "player x leaves team a, goes to team b, doesn't suck, makes some plays and it's WHY DID WE GET RID OF THEM?" 

But it sucks now mainly because we are injured and Farley is looking real suspect.  
Nobody was screaming for Adoree during training camp when everyone was healthy. People were very excited about the depth. 
Things change and like it was perfectly said, hindsight makes the move look questionable, given the circumstances now. 

I'm sure when Derrick got hurt and if say someone like Darryton Evans went to a team and rushed for 1,000 yards people would have said the same thing about that move. 
Good for Adoree improving and being healthy, but sometimes things just don't work that way. 

And lastly, I know the 1st round picks are what they are, but to ignore things like Byard, Hooker, Landry, Henry (so far) all getting 2nd deals and concentrating on the 1st round picks is understandable but not accurate. 
I don't care if all our 1st round picks walk, but if we are getting franchise cornerstones later in that same draft, lets rock! Normally it's reverse but again, so what?

Of course sign Simmons.   
 

[TitanRedd]

I love it’s so funny I remember this guy had a sentimental crush on kern & laughed at this move 😮‍💨 because we wanted to get younger & save money 

[KingTitan]

12 minutes ago, TitanRedd said:

Look this up do your research my guy, he never was a top 5 or top 10 corner however even pro football focus has him high graded as a man cover corner his struggles are zone. When he was drafted **** lebeau a zone guru DC from day 1 played adoree to his strengths. He let him play on a island & play man. Here’s why he doesn’t get a lot of picks, he doesn’t jump routes he’s not a gambler he plays not to get beat. 
everyone always quick to say he’s an average or above average corner but to his defense as a titan he didn’t get beat by a lot of WR’s. Every WR that has beaten adoree far as put up 80-100 yards on him are as follows, Tyreke Hill, Will fuller, Antonio Brown, Hollywood brown & he gave up a bomb to Kenny stills vs Miami. How did those guys get open on him because when you ask him to play zone, he gives up a tone of cushion against speedsters because he doesn’t understand route concepts playing off & sitting on routes which is why he use to struggle with defending a slant. 
this is why I wanted wade phillips he plays to the strength of his personnel unlike vrabel who wants you to play within his scheme. 

I know you are pretty high on him. 

And I know his grades from PFF. 

He wouldn't be in my top 5 or top 10.  Some of your points are not something I'd want in a corner. "Not understanding route concepts. Not able to paly well in zone. Not a lot of picks."

I'd want a top corner to be good at at least one of those to go with Man skills. 

If he can only play in a certain scheme then that is limiting compared to a guy you can put in any defense and he do well. 
I'm not going to say I know this was true or close to it, but what if the whole defense knows how to do one thing and then Adoree is one of the few that can't, am I supposed to adjust the whole scheme for Adoree or find a guy to fit what I'm doing?

[KingTitan]

11 minutes ago, TitanRedd said:

Go look at Stephon Gilmore in Buffalo Vs him with the patriots. Majority of people thought he was a bust, he gets to NE then boom he’s regarded as arguably top 1 or 2 CB in the league, outside looking in it’s the scheme it’s Belichick, but it’s bill allowing him to play his game, press man sticky coverage he did the opposite Buffalo did which was ask him to play off coverage zone corner Tampa 2. Sometimes a coach shouldn’t be about scheme & allow a player to play his game 

Well, again I would say. Do you alter your scheme and what you know for one player or do you get a player to do what you know?

How is he doing in Indy? How did he do in Carolina? I ask because I don't know and I don't feel like looking it up. lol
I know Indy does a lot of Tampa 2 right? 

[TitanRedd]

1 minute ago, KingTitan said:

I know you are pretty high on him. 

And I know his grades from PFF. 

He wouldn't be in my top 5 or top 10.  Some of your points are not something I'd want in a corner. "Not understanding route concepts. Not able to paly well in zone. Not a lot of picks."

I'd want a top corner to be good at at least one of those to go with Man skills. 

If he can only play in a certain scheme then that is limiting compared to a guy you can put in any defense and he do well. 
I'm not going to say I know this was true or close to it, but what if the whole defense knows how to do one thing and then Adoree is one of the few that can't, am I supposed to adjust the whole scheme for Adoree or find a guy to fit what I'm doing?

You have some corners that are good at certain styles like I just gave you Stephon Gilmore he wasn’t a zone off cover corner which is why Buffalo let him go, Marcus peters not a good man cover corner he’s a beast at playing off & a zone corner he loves to jump routes. Richard Seymour wasn’t a good man corner he was a very good press corner & cover three zone corner. He knew how to play WR’s partially because he was a WR in college. AQUIB Talib press cover corner didn’t like playing in a cover 2 zone in Tampa early in his career. It’s about playing to your personnel. 1 thing Asante Samuel about Belichick is this, if you were good at playing your type of game & made plays he bend his defense philosophy for you. Asante suckd at playing press he prefer off coverage unlike Ty Law who was the opposite & bill will let Ty law get 1-2 defensive holding penalties as he requested a game so he can frustrate the Receiver to get in his head early on. That’s coaching my friend 

[TitanRedd]

8 minutes ago, KingTitan said:

Well, again I would say. Do you alter your scheme and what you know for one player or do you get a player to do what you know?

How is he doing in Indy? How did he do in Carolina? I ask because I don't know and I don't feel like looking it up. lol
I know Indy does a lot of Tampa 2 right? 

He played well in Carolina in limited time after coming off a quad tear but at this point he’s pass his prime due to injuries, playing press man on a island takes a toll on your body believe it or not 

[TitanRedd]

11 minutes ago, KingTitan said:

Well, again I would say. Do you alter your scheme and what you know for one player or do you get a player to do what you know?

How is he doing in Indy? How did he do in Carolina? I ask because I don't know and I don't feel like looking it up. lol
I know Indy does a lot of Tampa 2 right? 

The only guy I’ve seen that vrabel played to his strength & let him do what he does best was Cruikshank & that was play man coverage on TE’s use his speed & physicality to challenge them, yet we let him walk out of here for 2 mill dollars I just don’t get it. We didn’t use Cruikshank like we use hooker & Byard we kept it simple we want you to be put dime LB/S & cover the TE 

[deeluxx3]

Looking at the old thread @titans0021 sent, I said I was not surprised by the Adoree cut...wasn't in agreement, but not surprised

I thiiiiink he didn't attack his knee rehab as hard as the team would've liked? Who knows

 

He was a very good corner here. Way more good games than bad.

 

To the Julio point...yea I loved the move and it didn't pan out. Net net, though, Robinson has made more "bad" moves than good moves during the past 3 offseasons and it's seemingly coming to bite us in the butt.

Edited September 27, 2022 by deeluxx3