Justin Fields has a separated nonthrowing shoulder; on pace to return vs Packers

[CKSteeler]

I'm not watching the Bears game, but this strikes me as another awkward moment for a fanbase desperately defending their young QB drafted last season. Back-up comes in, not even a good back-up, and the passing attack at least so far has come to life against one of the better defenses in the league. 

Granted, it's early and I could end up eating my words here. Could. It is Trevor Siemian. But has Fields ever had even a quarter throwing the football as well as he just did?

And I don't know what it takes to qualify someone as being a bad passer in the modern NFL given how some fanbases defend guys. He's completing under 60% of his passes, has one of the highest rate of poor throws in the league, has a QB rating of 86.2, his INT% is 3.5, he's averaging a meager 150 yards a game. Saying he isn't poor just inconsistent is an understatement, but it feels like people are more interested in playing word games. I say a guy who is wildly inconsistent as a thrower sucks, even if there is a nice pass sprinkled in here or there.

The passing offense is anemic with him under center despite the fact that his running should be giving him a lot of easy throws. This is 2022. Passing has never been easier, and the young QB's aren't getting it done and there's some people who have a hard time admitting that.

[CKSteeler]

None of what I said should be construed to mean that Fields doesn't have talent, but he aint showing it on the field. He has the arm to succeed, but he is a mess as a passer right now.

[Leoric]

I haven’t checked the box score yet but lol at Peterman starting. Please tell me it was a 4 pick day for the practice warrior. 

[Bigbear72]

16 hours ago, CKSteeler said:

I'm not watching the Bears game, but this strikes me as another awkward moment for a fanbase desperately defending their young QB drafted last season. Back-up comes in, not even a good back-up, and the passing attack at least so far has come to life against one of the better defenses in the league. 

Granted, it's early and I could end up eating my words here. Could. It is Trevor Siemian. But has Fields ever had even a quarter throwing the football as well as he just did?

And I don't know what it takes to qualify someone as being a bad passer in the modern NFL given how some fanbases defend guys. He's completing under 60% of his passes, has one of the highest rate of poor throws in the league, has a QB rating of 86.2, his INT% is 3.5, he's averaging a meager 150 yards a game. Saying he isn't poor just inconsistent is an understatement, but it feels like people are more interested in playing word games. I say a guy who is wildly inconsistent as a thrower sucks, even if there is a nice pass sprinkled in here or there.

The passing offense is anemic with him under center despite the fact that his running should be giving him a lot of easy throws. This is 2022. Passing has never been easier, and the young QB's aren't getting it done and there's some people who have a hard time admitting that.

And this is why some people can't be taken seriously. Didn't watch the game. Back up comes in and brings the passing attack to life. If by life you mean 179 yards passing and 1 Td and 1 Int then you are 100% correct. I guess hot takes do what hot takes do.

[CKSteeler]

16 hours ago, Bigbear72 said:

And this is why some people can't be taken seriously. Didn't watch the game. Back up comes in and brings the passing attack to life. If by life you mean 179 yards passing and 1 Td and 1 Int then you are 100% correct. I guess hot takes do what hot takes do.

Simaen put up similar passing numbers to Fields. When I posted, he put up the bulk of those numbers in the first quarter. No one will ever mistake Trevor Simaen for a franchise QB. 

So, maybe Bears fans can point out a quarter Fields has had throwing the ball even as well as him? 

I'd personally like to see a night and day difference in the passing ability of my franchise QB and a journeyman who probably shouldn't even be in the league at this point, back-up or not.

[Bigbear72]

10 hours ago, CKSteeler said:

Simaen put up similar passing numbers to Fields. When I posted, he put up the bulk of those numbers in the first quarter. No one will ever mistake Trevor Simaen for a franchise QB. 

So, maybe Bears fans can point out a quarter Fields has had throwing the ball even as well as him? 

I'd personally like to see a night and day difference in the passing ability of my franchise QB and a journeyman who probably shouldn't even be in the league at this point, back-up or not.

Again, you look at stats with no context and make assumptions and hot takes. Very uninformed hot takes. The bulk of the yardage that was picked up was short passes that picked up yards after the catch gains. He by no means has ANYTHING on Fields. Zero, nothing. Box score scouting is bad almost without exception. Also the offense put up a wopping 10 points as opposed to the 30 a game that they did with Fields. Siemian threw for 1 TD. Fields over the last four games has thrown for 10 and ran for 5. At least try to do some research before posting.

Edited November 29, 2022 by Bigbear72

[Ty21]

5 hours ago, Bigbear72 said:

Also the offense put up a wopping 10 points as opposed to the 30 a game that they did with Fields. Siemian threw for 1 TD. Fields over the last four games has thrown for 10 and ran for 5. At least try to do some research before posting.

Agreed on all points, although Fields probably would’ve had a pretty rough day against that defense. 

[CKSteeler]

6 hours ago, Bigbear72 said:

Again, you look at stats with no context and make assumptions and hot takes. Very uninformed hot takes. The bulk of the yardage that was picked up was short passes that picked up yards after the catch gains. He by no means has ANYTHING on Fields. Zero, nothing. Box score scouting is bad almost without exception. Also the offense put up a wopping 10 points as opposed to the 30 a game that they did with Fields. Siemian threw for 1 TD. Fields over the last four games has thrown for 10 and ran for 5. At least try to do some research before posting.

Fields has not thrown for 10 TD's in his last 4 games? He's thrown for 10 in his last 6 games. Quite a difference there. Three of those games were 1 TD performances where he had 179 yards or fewer 5 times...the same as Siemian. The one game where he eclipsed that mark he put up a whopping 190 yards in a 12-7 loss. He's only had more than 179 yards passing one other time this season.

So, what you are falling back on is that Fields is a better runner. Which no one would deny, and it has led to more points in the last few games for the Bears. Siemian is not a runner, and he also sucks as a passer. But there's the rub - Field's is doing no better as a passer than a guy who should not even be in the league. 

That's not box score scouting. Simian was ineffective after the first quarter throwing the football, but that first quarter was about as much as Fields produces over an entire game with his arm.

People joke that Lamar Jackson is a RB around here. Justin Fields is a hobo's Lamar Jackson throwing the football right now.

Edited November 29, 2022 by CKSteeler

[Bigbear72]

12 minutes ago, Ty21 said:

Agreed on all points, although Fields probably would’ve had a pretty rough day against that defense. 

Possibly, but he put up points against Dallas and NE.

[Bigbear72]

1 hour ago, CKSteeler said:

Fields has not thrown for 10 TD's in his last 4 games? He's thrown for 10 in his last 6 games. Quite a difference there. Three of those games were 1 TD performances where he had 179 yards or fewer 5 times...the same as Siemian. The one game where he eclipsed that mark he put up a whopping 190 yards in a 12-7 loss. He's only had more than 179 yards passing one other time this season.

So, what you are falling back on is that Fields is a better runner. Which no one would deny, and it has led to more points in the last few games for the Bears. Siemian is not a runner, and he also sucks as a passer. But there's the rub - Field's is doing no better as a passer than a guy who should not even be in the league. 

That's not box score scouting. Simian was ineffective after the first quarter throwing the football, but that first quarter was about as much as Fields produces over an entire game with his arm.

My mistake. 8 TDs. And again, context is everything. Six games ago we were running a different style of offense. Also yes, he is a better runner because at this point he has to be. The OL may be the worst in the league. So is the receiving corp. He has no time to pass and not very many options to pass to.  

As far as Siemian goes. Those plays were made by dump off passes to rbs that broke loose for 59 yards. Again, you are box score scouting. And if not what context are you speaking of that does not involve the box score since you have already stated you did not watch the game because at this point I'm a bit confused? How many games have you watched of the Bears period? Oh, that many.

Edited November 29, 2022 by Bigbear72

[blkwdw13]

5 hours ago, CKSteeler said:

Fields has not thrown for 10 TD's in his last 4 games? He's thrown for 10 in his last 6 games. Quite a difference there. Three of those games were 1 TD performances where he had 179 yards or fewer 5 times...the same as Siemian. The one game where he eclipsed that mark he put up a whopping 190 yards in a 12-7 loss. He's only had more than 179 yards passing one other time this season.

So, what you are falling back on is that Fields is a better runner. Which no one would deny, and it has led to more points in the last few games for the Bears. Siemian is not a runner, and he also sucks as a passer. But there's the rub - Field's is doing no better as a passer than a guy who should not even be in the league. 

That's not box score scouting. Simian was ineffective after the first quarter throwing the football, but that first quarter was about as much as Fields produces over an entire game with his arm.

People joke that Lamar Jackson is a RB around here. Justin Fields is a hobo's Lamar Jackson throwing the football right now.

Either watch the game to make an informed argument about Siemian or don't at all. This is similar if I were to say N. Harris stinks he hasn't gone over 100 yards once, is under 4 yards per carry, and barely scores at all. Yet I don't watch the Steelers games so I don't have any context to actually say any of that. Siemian was not good even in the first quarter of this past game. Like other have said half of his total yards came on two dumps offs that went for yardage and the long pass to Claypool was a bad throw that Claypool make a good catch on; his TD throw was also a bad throw that the receivers jumped and grabbed the ball over the DB. Like I said misleading with out context.

[CKSteeler]

23 hours ago, blkwdw13 said:

This is similar if I were to say N. Harris stinks he hasn't gone over 100 yards once, is under 4 yards per carry, and barely scores at all. Yet I don't watch the Steelers games so I don't have any context to actually say any of that.

I do watch Steelers games and I can tell you that your assessment isn't too far from the mark.

Maybe Fields can hope to get as lucky as Siemian when he returns to the field and Claypool will actually surpass 50 yards in a game.

[Ty21]

57 minutes ago, CKSteeler said:

I do watch Steelers games and I can tell you that your assessment isn't too far from the mark

Then surely you’ve seen how bad their offensive line is 

[Thomas5737]

3 hours ago, CKSteeler said:

Maybe Fields can hope to get as lucky as Siemian when he returns to the field and Claypool will actually surpass 50 yards in a game.

He usually didn't last year.

Fields is pretty much Lamar right now. Only successful because of his legs. It's out of necessity. It would be dumb not to do what works. Fields barely ran in college so that aspect is pretty new for him. Good on him for doing what it takes to score points. It will start opening things up though and make life easier.

You'd take Fields 100 times before Siemian though so the whole argument seems silly.

[Sugashane]

On 11/29/2022 at 10:37 AM, CKSteeler said:

Fields has not thrown for 10 TD's in his last 4 games? He's thrown for 10 in his last 6 games. Quite a difference there. Three of those games were 1 TD performances where he had 179 yards or fewer 5 times...the same as Siemian. The one game where he eclipsed that mark he put up a whopping 190 yards in a 12-7 loss. He's only had more than 179 yards passing one other time this season.

And he ran for 5 more TDs in that span of 4 games. He also added an average of  117.5 ypg on the ground. Its just ridiculous to ignore their overall production.

You talk of his ability as a runner but ONLY look at passing yards to inflate your argument. Look at total yards. Over his last 7 weeks he put up 1811 yards for an average of 258.7 yards per game. Quite a difference there too, right? He did that with a bottom 5 OL in the league.

On 11/29/2022 at 10:37 AM, CKSteeler said:

So, what you are falling back on is that Fields is a better runner. Which no one would deny, and it has led to more points in the last few games for the Bears. Siemian is not a runner, and he also sucks as a passer. But there's the rub - Field's is doing no better as a passer than a guy who should not even be in the league. 

Because he is adding value in the running game. Yards are yards. Who cares how they are gained? Also he has thrown only 1 game in that stretch 25 times or more, while putting up an additional 100+ yards on average on the ground.

On 11/29/2022 at 10:37 AM, CKSteeler said:

That's not box score scouting. Simian was ineffective after the first quarter throwing the football, but that first quarter was about as much as Fields produces over an entire game with his arm.

Considering "produces" means to cause or create and not simply meaning "passes for" you'd be 100% wrong. See above and add what he rushes for, which is included the total he produces. 

But les not just look at the QBs, look at how they affect the players around them.

The Bears put up 292 yards last game on the Jets with TS. They put up 10 points total

They have averaged 369 over the last 6 Fields played in, the only time they went under 368 was with Fields being injured. The Bears averaged almost 26 ppg in that span.

On 11/29/2022 at 10:37 AM, CKSteeler said:

People joke that Lamar Jackson is a RB around here. Justin Fields is a hobo's Lamar Jackson throwing the football right now.

And Deshaun Watson has the same lack of understanding of the word "consent" as Big Ben did.