QB Talk Once Again.... sigh

[JetsandI]

Carr section is being corrected as I failed to understand why the hell did I think he would be available until 3rd day in new league year to be traded away.  Perhaps, it was overlapped with other player's situation.  Whatever.

 

Carr's new guarantee will be picked up on February 10 and it is 40.4m over 2 years.   32.9m in 2023 and 7.5m in 2024. That should strongly indicate Raiders will release him in February.  Jets have to make a ridiculous pitch to convince Carr somehow.

 

 

[JetsandI]

19 minutes ago, rickyt31 said:

Yeah, I'm basing everything I say on if he gets cut.

At the same time, once when Jackson, Herbert, and Burrow get their new deals, Carr's 2023 isn't even a top-10 QB cap hit. Tannehill and mat Ryan are in the mid 35M cap hit range. Wentz is taking on $27M this year. Goff is at $30M. So $35M may become the average salary for QBs like him within the next couple of years because of the massive contracts that are going to younger QBs. Watson & Murray's deals changed everything. In terms of career averages, Carr is not far but Watson & Murray will be getting $50M+ in 2024. Even Russell Wilson's contract is insane. He's getting $55M at age 37 before the potential out in his deal. So I maybe fine with Carr being traded for if there is competition for him and his cap hits will be considered the average in a year or 2. 

Even if we sign a cheaper vet for 2 years, we'll have to consider paying up at least the average if they perform to the level we hope. 

 

The Lamar Jackson situation is interesting. I'm still watching. 

Tom Brady's dead money pushes Carr to 9th. lol.

[ekill08x]

1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

Was Fitz not a competent backup? And then we got tricked into thinking he was a legit starter and wasted cap space and a draft pick that should’ve been used on a QB (Mahomes or Watson). 

LOL I dont think we are understanding each other nvm man.

[GangGreen420]

15 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Was Fitz not a competent backup? And then we got tricked into thinking he was a legit starter and wasted cap space and a draft pick that should’ve been used on a QB (Mahomes or Watson). 

Fitz didn’t have anything to do with it, I don’t think that was the Jets thinking. Mac spent the 40th pick or whatever the year before on Christian Hackenberg so we didn’t draft one. 
 

Getting a guy like Minshew in here is a step forward for the QB room IMO. Especially if any of you still believe in ZW. He’s good enough to play, but you can put him in a “competition” with Zach.

[SteelKing728]

I've taken a lighter approach to Wilson since you guys beat Green Bay, but I fear I was right about Zach Wilson, at least so far.

I have nothing against him, but I just don't think he's the guy you want leading your team. He needs to drastically improve in 2023 or his time in New York could be over.

[GangGreen420]

3 minutes ago, SteelKing728 said:

I've taken a lighter approach to Wilson since you guys beat Green Bay, but I fear I was right about Zach Wilson, at least so far.

I have nothing against him, but I just don't think he's the guy you want leading your team. He needs to drastically improve in 2023 or his time in New York could be over.

You don’t say?

Seriously though, I’d be shocked if he became a starter anywhere in the league 

[ekill08x]

3 hours ago, GangGreen420 said:

Fitz didn’t have anything to do with it, I don’t think that was the Jets thinking. Mac spent the 40th pick or whatever the year before on Christian Hackenberg so we didn’t draft one. 
 

Getting a guy like Minshew in here is a step forward for the QB room IMO. Especially if any of you still believe in ZW. He’s good enough to play, but you can put him in a “competition” with Zach.

Agree 100%. Not only that but Minshew is a lunch pale guy. Not flashy but he gets it done. Not to mention, for no reason at all, he's kind of almost looked down upon by fans from other teams because he was a 6th round pick whose short and a little odd, but based on his play and the numbers hes put up on bad teams, the guy is a legitimate starting QB. He is also the kind of guy that you can bring in that should really light a fire under Zach and if it doesn't then he was never going to be the guy.

Now I am realistic and don't there is any realistic chance that a team would try and trade for him, but if that actually happens, what do you think we'd be willing to take? Obviously this is completely hypothetical but do they actually think Zach has been bad enough to just want to get rid of the cap hit assuming we try and sign a JG or Carr (if released) while not wanting too much money tied to that QB room or do they simply bite the bullet and only make this move if they are offered at least a 2 etc. I think there is a 95% chance Zach is here in 2023 but I think internally they are way more concerned than they will let out for obvious reasons. I know they have been making the Jamarcus Russel comparisons but he does have very similar numbers to Matt Leinart to this point and this is where Leinart pretty much stopped getting starts. I was all for drafting Zach. I believed in the arm and the ability to process. I hope that sitting a year (very very likely) allows him to relax, work on his technique and just get better all around. I think he is feeling the pressure and its starting to weigh on him. I personally wouldn't trade him unless it was a no brainer and I just don't see that happening. A year out of the spotlight and seeing another pro operate could really help him mature both mentally and physically. 

 

[GangGreen420]

24 minutes ago, ekill08x said:

Agree 100%. Not only that but Minshew is a lunch pale guy. Not flashy but he gets it done. Not to mention, for no reason at all, he's kind of almost looked down upon by fans from other teams because he was a 6th round pick whose short and a little odd, but based on his play and the numbers hes put up on bad teams, the guy is a legitimate starting QB. He is also the kind of guy that you can bring in that should really light a fire under Zach and if it doesn't then he was never going to be the guy.

Now I am realistic and don't there is any realistic chance that a team would try and trade for him, but if that actually happens, what do you think we'd be willing to take? Obviously this is completely hypothetical but do they actually think Zach has been bad enough to just want to get rid of the cap hit assuming we try and sign a JG or Carr (if released) while not wanting too much money tied to that QB room or do they simply bite the bullet and only make this move if they are offered at least a 2 etc. I think there is a 95% chance Zach is here in 2023 but I think internally they are way more concerned than they will let out for obvious reasons. I know they have been making the Jamarcus Russel comparisons but he does have very similar numbers to Matt Leinart to this point and this is where Leinart pretty much stopped getting starts. I was all for drafting Zach. I believed in the arm and the ability to process. I hope that sitting a year (very very likely) allows him to relax, work on his technique and just get better all around. I think he is feeling the pressure and its starting to weigh on him. I personally wouldn't trade him unless it was a no brainer and I just don't see that happening. A year out of the spotlight and seeing another pro operate could really help him mature both mentally and physically. 

 

I don’t think any team will be willing to offer close to a 2, especially after Rosen/Darnold showing that they were what they were. I think it would be extremely difficult to trade him period. It’s a huge sunk cost for the Jets to give up and his tape is beyond bad. But  if the Jets were offered a 2 in the offseason and he doesn’t see the field again this year, I think they would think about it.

I personally think the coaching staff is quickly losing faith in Wilson. I said it at the time but that move to put White up the chart, and to make the comments he did weren’t for no reason. I think the Jets had some foresight here. We’ll have to see if Wilson gets back on the field this year but I’d say he’s definitely here next year.

If he’s not feeling the pressure now then he never will. I was in the opposite camp, taking him at 2 would have been completely out of the question. I hated him as a prospect, every red flag needed to be ignored like the captaincy thing, he faced no pressure, etc. Chris Simms hyping him up contributed to his over drafting. I wish he showed me pretty much anything to get excited about, but it is what it is. He’s had a few good quarters but never put together a full game. I just hope Douglas learned his lesson about these low floor/high ceiling guys like him and Becton in the top 10. BOTH of these guys had red flags and both are looking like busts.

Edited November 26, 2022 by GangGreen420

[ekill08x]

9 minutes ago, GangGreen420 said:

I don’t think any team will be willing to offer close to a 2, especially after Rosen/Darnold showing that they were what they were. I think it would be extremely difficult to trade him period. It’s a huge sunk cost for the Jets to give up and his tape is beyond bad. But  if the Jets were offered a 2 in the offseason and he doesn’t see the field again this year, I think they would think about it.

I personally think the coaching staff is quickly losing faith in Wilson. I said it at the time but that move to put White up the chart, and to make the comments he did weren’t for no reason. I think the Jets had some foresight here. We’ll have to see if Wilson gets back on the field this year but I’d say he’s definitely here next year.

If he’s not feeling the pressure now then he never will. I was in the opposite camp, taking him at 2 would have been completely out of the question. I hated him as a prospect, every red flag needed to be ignored like the captaincy thing, he faced no pressure, etc. Chris Simms hyping him up contributed to his over drafting. I wish he showed me pretty much anything to get excited about, but it is what it is. He’s had a few good quarters but never put together a full game. I just hope Douglas learned his lesson about these low floor/high ceiling guys like him and Becton in the top 10. BOTH of these guys had red flags and both are looking like busts.

Yeah I am with you with the trade scenario. Very unlikely, just thought it was interesting.

Yeah I remember you weren't a fan and obviously you've been right. Douglas has definitely been very good overall but I was pounding the table for Wirfs there. Still think if Becton can get on the field that he will be good for us because worst case, he's a high end run blocking OT. I still hope we continue to prioritize the OL and keep building that defense. This is going to be such an interesting offseason because even though some positions are better than others, we actually have a very solid roster all around minus the most important position. Great job of the GM getting us back to respectability, now comes the part where we have to maneuver around the cap while continuing to have perennial success.

[jetfuel34]

You guys really want Minshew??? He is not that good and the Jets would probably not make the playoffs. You know what he can do and it is not that good. I would rather stick with White. The QB's I want are Carr or Rodgers and if we can't land one of them I would go with White, Wilson and a rookie to fight for the job. 

[GangGreen420]

33 minutes ago, jetfuel34 said:

You guys really want Minshew??? He is not that good and the Jets would probably not make the playoffs. You know what he can do and it is not that good. I would rather stick with White. The QB's I want are Carr or Rodgers and if we can't land one of them I would go with White, Wilson and a rookie to fight for the job. 

Look at Minshews stats and tape and come up with a good argument how Mike White or Zach Wilson is a better option?

[SteelKing728]

9 hours ago, GangGreen420 said:

You don’t say?

Seriously though, I’d be shocked if he became a starter anywhere in the league 

I tried telling that one Jets before the season started. What happened there?

[GangGreen420]

 

[GangGreen420]

34 minutes ago, SteelKing728 said:

I tried telling that one Jets before the season started. What happened there?

I couldn’t tell you why any Jets fan would go to bat for him so adamantly. Blind hope? Their wife/gf bought them a jersey?

If your asking what happened to him as a player? Nothing, and that’s the problem. He hasn’t really improved since day 1 hence him being benched. I said it right after we lost to the Pats the first time, if he costs us the next meeting he would be benched. And voila

Edited November 27, 2022 by GangGreen420

[NYJets4716]

At this point I am convinced any QB can come to the Jets and would suck. We are a death sentence for QBs. I feel like it doesn't matter who we get, they will end up struggling and we will be back to where we are. 

I really like Sam Darnold as a prospect, he ends up busting here. I really like Zach Wilson as a prospect, he ends up struggling and things are not looking great right now. None of these guys ever pans out for us.