2023 NFL Draft

[Crimmage]

1 hour ago, m haynes said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzyCZ7pdIcU

Found this video on Dawand Jones.  Not a good look, based on his HS history.

I'm not sure he would be a pick for the Pats.   I call players that don't (1st) love football, "Paycheck Boys" !!!  The Pats have drafted a couple over the years. Football is my job players.

Ken Sims and Ron Brace.

I don't waste my time or pick when it comes this type of player. Plays great in college becasue of one reason, get paid.

Also I'm not impressed with his game. He needs work he can't get by with his size at the next level. His reaction time is a big question IMO!

He is very much a "ball of clay" type player. 

 

If he isn't a lover of football type of guy he's probably off the board though. Especially given Trent Browns history and the fact that they've had to spend a lot of time to motivate him.. I doubt they want a new guy who has those issues to learn from him. 

 

The Senior Bowl / Combine will show a lot though. 

[m haynes]

Just finished the (top 10) OL/LT in this draft. Awful.  I'm talking all the way into 2nd RD!!!!!! Depressing to say the least. Here are the only ones I would touch.

1. Peter Skoronski  ---  Plug and play starter 1st day.

2. Paris Johnson Jr. ---  He is big but his height gives him problems at times. He not a mauler but he athletic. He's a wall and shadows his guy. Film against ND and Frosky tells me he can play.  A little Scar would turn this into a 10 year player.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxuZpoxvC40

Ohio State OL/Offense vs Notre Dame Defense (2022) - YouTube

3. Jaelyn Duncan  ----  This guy has no clue how to play, however he has everything you look for.  If Scar can teach him he could be the steal of the draft. He could end up being scary good. But he will need a YR. Check out the size and movement. Reminds me of Micheal Orr in HS!!!!!  Once it kicks in watch out!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWp3t6Gdeadx9lc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYUsGieoNs0

Kids a freak

So far I have yet to find my favorite player however Duncan might be my (favorite) Travis Jones !!!!  

Matter of fact,  I would draft him in the 1st with a trade down.

ADDED   I'm not sure but I think someone brought up this kid a while ago in a post. I think is was @Deadpulse

 

Edited December 15, 2022 by m haynes

[Crimmage]

5 hours ago, m haynes said:

3. Jaelyn Duncan  ----  This guy has no clue how to play, however he has everything you look for.  If Scar can teach him he could be the steal of the draft. He could end up being scary good. But he will need a YR. Check out the size and movement. Reminds me of Micheal Orr in HS!!!!!  Once it kicks in watch out!!

Those highlights... had some rough moments to say the least. 6'6 320 is awesome though. You really need first rounders to be day 1 starters unless you're an elite team that can afford that luxury. Do you trust Billy Yates to coach him up and get the most out of him? Unfortunately we haven't seen anything from the current OL to make us believe he can do that. 

 

Listening to that analysis was slightly concerning too " he's not a mauler, more athletic and finesse". Sounds a lot like Cole Strange, and we see how he gets bull rushed pretty easily. Can you afford to have an entire left side which can get bullied? Hopefully that's more of a rookie issue and he can gain some strength when he gets into an NFL strength and conditioning program. 

 

He has some exciting moments in that film analysis.. I wonder if he dominates the combine and ends up flying up boards similar to Trevor Penning last year. 

[Hunter2_1]

So who’s going to be this year’s John Metchie, or Kyle Lauretta, or Zach Baun, or Irv Smith? Someone who everyone is utterly convinced will be a patriots. screams patriot. all the experts are mocking him to us…..

 

but we don’t pick him

[m haynes]

1 hour ago, Hunter2_1 said:

So who’s going to be this year’s John Metchie, or Kyle Lauretta, or Zach Baun, or Irv Smith? Someone who everyone is utterly convinced will be a patriots. screams patriot. all the experts are mocking him to us…..

 

but we don’t pick him

Ha Ha Ha  I have been looking for him, the no brainier !!!!!!

[m haynes]

8 hours ago, Crimmage said:

You really need first rounders to be day 1 starters unless you're an elite team that can afford that luxury.

I disagree.  Would I like that to happen yes but you have to have a eye for talent or you'll miss out on player that lack coaching in college.  This kid has everything but technique. It's a problem if Yates can't teach so if that the case it doesn't matter who you draft.

IMO  Its a easy fix with Duncan...  balance , drop your butt, get you hands out.  He gets this and you have a dominate AP for 10 years. Also 2023 they are still building so I would have no problem drafting him in the 1st becasue he has everything and it just a matter of (short) time before he ready.

The Pats drafted Strange and he's not ready but threw him in there so they must see the potential and when with the 1st RD pick. I would though question the player and his upside which I don't see. I do see tremendous upside with Duncan. 

Side note this whole draft lacks starters in the 1st RD for the Pats (needs), they will have to project whoever they take.

8 hours ago, Crimmage said:

Listening to that analysis was slightly concerning too " he's not a mauler, more athletic and finesse".

Sorry I forgot to say the guy has no clue what he's talking about. I used the clip to show his NATURAL ability.  I not a fan of maulers, especially at LT.  IMO the reason he mentioned this is based on the beginning of the video where he looks passive and struggles. He misses on his point, look at his technique that the reason it not the players ability. Easy fix.

8 hours ago, Crimmage said:

" he's not a mauler, more athletic and finesse".

I complete disagree with his comment.  That is just like saying 50/50 and can't get off the press. It something to fill the weakness comments. I'll live with a so call  6'6' 330 "fitness player" !!!!

Total BS from a draft sites wanna be !!!!!!  I read the same crap with Sewell and Slater in the 2021.    I would of taken Slater over Sewell. IMO he was the best LT in the draft.

 

[m haynes]

   I have only taken a quick look at the WR group however I think I found @Hunter2_1 go to guy with the Pats.  Jalin Hyatt. holy crap.  I read the comments and I don't give a crap what they say.  RT tree, blah blah blah.  He can catch it, scares the crap out of DBs and runs on water. Beep Beep!!!  Terek Hill was a converted RB how that work out.  I see Thornton and Hyatt, damn. 

Now picture the middle of the field for TE and Slot WR !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  And don't forget Steve running the ball without 8 men in the box!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Put both on one side give Mac the option at the line and let Fat Matt call his SCREENS with the option to change for a 1 on 1 match up.

Yup Hyatt's  @Hunter2_1 boy. 🤣

Edited December 16, 2022 by m haynes

[Crimmage]

2 hours ago, m haynes said:

   I have only taken a quick look at the WR group however I think I found @Hunter2_1 go to guy with the Pats.  Jalin Hyatt. holy crap.  I read the comments and I don't give a crap what they say.  RT tree, blah blah blah.  He can catch it, scares the crap out of DBs and runs on water. Beep Beep!!!  Terek Hill was a converted RB how that work out.  I see Thornton and Hyatt, damn. 

Now picture the middle of the field for TE and Slot WR !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  And don't forget Steve running the ball without 8 men in the box!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Put both on one side give Mac the option at the line and let Fat Matt call his SCREENS with the option to change for a 1 on 1 match up.

Yup Hyatt's  @Hunter2_1 boy. 🤣

My concern there is the system he came from. They are 100% not a pro style system.. they spread OUT the field. We've seen how hard it has been for players to adjust to the Patriots system at WR.. I think he would struggle. He 

 

- Super limited route tree .. if you watch his highlights 75% are just go balls with him blowing past a DB. 

- Lots of motion in that offense to get him free releases.. they don't do that for Thornton, are they going to do it for Hyatt? The excitement you see people have for Hyatt could be the excitement for Thornton if they had a proper OC

- He lit up Alabama for 200 yards though.. so if Saban tells him this guy is the next big thing, he could get drafted here. I think he's pretty redundant with Thornton though.. they are very similar players. 

- If he runs a low 4.3 he could be a 1st round pick .. i'm not touching him in the first round 

 

If they go after someone from that team it will probably be Cedric Tillman, he's slower but at least runs more than 2 routes. 

[m haynes]

26 minutes ago, Crimmage said:

My concern there is the system he came from. They are 100% not a pro style system..

Don't care. It just noise that up to this year I paid attention to.  Just look at Thornton, hated the pick, not so much now, I see a (fear) future.  Dotson and Olave press, Metcalf one trick pony. All BS !!!!!!!   My main factor now.... He scares (fear factor) the crap out of a DBs. You have to pay attention to him all week and game plan even if he runs only two routes, slat and go!!!!! Don't cover him with two players  ........ gone!!!

That video, check out the fear factor. Bama DBs look like OL-men chasing him !!!!!

26 minutes ago, Crimmage said:

least runs more than 2 routes. 

and those two routes freak out the whole defensive side of the ball !!!!!!

Also he's a football player. IMO he will have no problems improving his skill set. Even if its improves 10/20% that's just increases the fear factor.

Just think start, him out using him deep and like Marcus Jones who is slow compared to this guy!!!! Last, IMO, he's ahead of Thornton when it comes to football.

Edited December 16, 2022 by m haynes

[Crimmage]

5 hours ago, Hunter2_1 said:

So who’s going to be this year’s John Metchie, or Kyle Lauretta, or Zach Baun, or Irv Smith? Someone who everyone is utterly convinced will be a patriots. screams patriot. all the experts are mocking him to us…..

 

but we don’t pick him

Charlie Jones .. I almost forgot all about him .. you're going to hear his name A LOT to the Patriots

• Smart Player
• Good Route Runner .. I would have liked to see him run more in the slot, more twitchy routes.. but he has a larger route tree than most in college. I just worry that he's a bit stiff for the Welker/Edelman role.. he would def be more of a vertical slot (which Mac is used to)
• Deceptively Fast.. everyone says he is more quick than fast.. but we've seen him beat 4.3 guys like DJ Turner
• Jim Nagy LOVES him .. which will go far for BB imo 
• He will be at the Senior Bowl which we know the Patriots put a lot of emphasis on .. if he does well they will fall in love with him. I still believe they wanted Christian Watson in the 2nd round and traded up for Thornton when he got picked as their backup
• He played a lot outside but could play all over the formation given his size/speed
• Mac Jones to Charlie Jones.. to add to the Jones crew makes too much sense

IF he plays well at the senior bowl and tests well at the combine (4.3) ... I believe he will be a day 2 pick. You will see him mocked to the Patriots a lot in the 4th-7th round, but that's insane imo. He is 100% a top 100 pick.. and could easily go in the 2nd round with a good pre-draft. 

[Crimmage]

1 minute ago, m haynes said:

Just think start, him out using him deep and like Marcus Jones who is slow compared to this guy!!!! Last, IMO, he's ahead of Thornton when it comes to football.

Marcus Jones is a wild card in this offseason tbo. 

His greatest strength is moving with the ball in his hand.. Troy Brown has mentioned working with him a lot and reminding him of himself. Could they let Meyers go and transition Marcus Jones into the future slot role? He may be a better WR than CB.. and I think he's a good CB. Will be really interesting to see what happens there. I think he could do it but would be worried about him getting injured too much at WR given how small he is. 

 

If it were me.. I would probably do my best to keep a package for him.. 5-10 plays a game as a wrinkle teams have to deal with... but keep him primarily on defense. They need at least one more (if not 2) CB's this offseason. 

[m haynes]

12 minutes ago, Crimmage said:

Charlie Jones .. I almost forgot all about him .. you're going to hear his name A LOT to the Patriots

• Smart Player
• Good Route Runner .. I would have liked to see him run more in the slot, more twitchy routes.. but he has a larger route tree than most in college. I just worry that he's a bit stiff for the Welker/Edelman role.. he would def be more of a vertical slot (which Mac is used to)
• Deceptively Fast.. everyone says he is more quick than fast.. but we've seen him beat 4.3 guys like DJ Turner
• Jim Nagy LOVES him .. which will go far for BB imo 
• He will be at the Senior Bowl which we know the Patriots put a lot of emphasis on .. if he does well they will fall in love with him. I still believe they wanted Christian Watson in the 2nd round and traded up for Thornton when he got picked as their backup
• He played a lot outside but could play all over the formation given his size/speed
• Mac Jones to Charlie Jones.. to add to the Jones crew makes too much sense

IF he plays well at the senior bowl and tests well at the combine (4.3) ... I believe he will be a day 2 pick. You will see him mocked to the Patriots a lot in the 4th-7th round, but that's insane imo. He is 100% a top 100 pick.. and could easily go in the 2nd round with a good pre-draft. 

I don't see it at the NFL level. He could be as good as Meyers however I'm not looking at him until the 4/5th RD. 

I do see that Pats interest do to his football knowledge.  IMO he has zero fear factor against a NFL DB.

ADDED Meyers is average WR on the Pats he's all world!!!

Edited December 16, 2022 by m haynes

[m haynes]

16 minutes ago, Crimmage said:

Marcus Jones into the future slot role?

Holy crap take Wyatt and now you have fear factors all over the field!!!! Thats what I'm talking about. Match ups.

16 minutes ago, Crimmage said:

He may be a better WR than CB.. and I think he's a good CB

I would keep him at CB but use him on offense. Find his max point to go both ways. Dion Style.

16 minutes ago, Crimmage said:

injured too much at WR given how small he is.

Not worried at all. NFL is now flag football!! Mostly hand tackles.  Hill hasn't been hurt and many other his size from getting hit.

The draft has plenty of DB this year. Get one after 1/2 rds. Might be the deepest position in the draft.

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by m haynes

[Crimmage]

16 minutes ago, m haynes said:

I don't see it at the NFL level. He could be as good as Meyers however I'm not looking at him until the 4/5th RD. 

I do see that Pats interest do to his football knowledge.  IMO he has zero fear factor against a NFL DB.

ADDED Meyers is average WR on the Pats he's all world!!!

I'll be very interested to see how Jones and Hyatt compare at the combine. I think you'll be surprised.. a lot of his wide open catches are due to the scheme / coaching. Jones is the better football player imo. We can't compare Purdue to Tennessee coaching wise.. or O'Connell to Hooker.. major differences. Yet Jone lead the league in a lot of categories. This isn't a Hunter Renfrow situation either where he runs a 4.6. He's going to light up the combine too. I think they both end up being 4.3 guys and Hyatt goes higher just because of the school / hype. IF Charlie Jones is available in the 4th .. and the Patriots have 3+ 4th round picks... and don't pick him (even if they grab another WR earlier) .. I will lose my mind

 

If I were to imagine my perfect draft as of today (subject to change 1,00234 times) it would probably be: 

- Trade back from ~17 to ~27 picking up an extra 3rd and 4th along the way (basically same trade as last year) 

- Draft a LT of the Future in the 1st, let's just say your guy Jaelyn Duncan

- 2nd round, TE Dalton Kincaid, day 1 contributor at TE 

- 3rd round, WR Charlie Jones, can play Slot / Z and move all over the formation .. adding additional speed next to Thornton

- 3rd round, OT Cody Mauch, can start day 1 at RT .. this is assuming they don't sign a RT in free agency 

 

This still leaves them with 4 4th round picks to focus on the defense (CB/LB/FS/etc.) 

[m haynes]

1 hour ago, Crimmage said:

- 2nd round, TE Dalton Kincaid, day 1 contributor at TE 

I would go with  Sam LaPorta from Iowa. I like their TE's.  His numbers don't reflect his skills, running team.   Both TE go in the 2/3 rd in the mocks, I say 3rd for both.

1 hour ago, Crimmage said:

- Trade back from ~17 to ~27

I hope it gives them two picks in the 2nd. Trade in if you have to

2nd Round ( 2 picks)  I come out with Nolan Smith and Zay Flowers. perfect in the slot.

3rd   Sam LaPorta

IMO this draft should be heavy on the offensive side of the ball. My prediction taking @Hunter2_1 comment step further. Pats will draft heavey on the defensive side of the ball. They will look at the offense at the end for future  offensive players for ST !!!!! Some 50th rank WR out of Bridgewater ST.

 

 

1 hour ago, Crimmage said:

Jones and Hyatt compare at the combine.

 Jones 4.5 to Hyatts 4.2 tough to match.  I don't see 4.3 on the field with Jones but it based only  on the videos. I look at the other team and compare the speed, if that even possible.  some of the guys on any videos run like I do, if you get my drift.

  Eye test there not even close when it comes to speed.

 

1 hour ago, Crimmage said:

We can't compare Purdue to Tennessee coaching wise.. or O'Connell to Hooker.. major differences. Yet Jone lead the league in a lot of categories. 

I don't care about this. It's all college numbers which doesn't mean much at the next level.

 

1 hour ago, Crimmage said:

IF Charlie Jones is available in the 4th .. and the Patriots have 3+ 4th round picks... and don't pick him (even if they grab another WR earlier) .. I will lose my mind

So  I guess @Crimmage this is your 2023 Wan'Dale Robinson 🤣

 

As I mentioned earlier it comes down to me is the fear factor and than hands and can he play.  The rest are minor details that draft sites use to fluff there opinions.   I guess the eastest way for me to say it.

Can  a WR do what Hyatt did against Bama's (high rated) db's. If they can, I want them on my team..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by m haynes