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Week 16 Thread: (7-6-1) Commanders vs (10-4) 49ers - 4:05 PM CBS


MikeT14

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10 hours ago, MikeT14 said:

Do you think it's strange that you seem to be the only one defending Logan's play?

I don’t care. I haven’t seen anything that proves to me that he’s not the same player he was two years ago. It’s not like he’s getting 10 targets a game & not catching them or something. He’s being asked to block more this year & he’s not being targeted - same with our RBs - bc we’ve upgraded WR so much. 
 

In 2020 Logan was our 2nd or 3rd option for Alex every game after Terry & McKissic. He’s not getting those same types of targets bc Carson & Taylor are throwing to our elite WR corps.

In 2020 Logan had 110 targets, this year 51. That’s why his production is in half of what it was in 2020.

Edited by turtle28
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28 minutes ago, turtle28 said:

I don’t care. I haven’t seen anything that proves to me that he’s not the same player he was two years ago. It’s not like he’s getting 10 targets a game & not catching them or something. He’s being asked to block more this year & he’s not being targeted - same with our RBs - bc we’ve upgraded WR so much. 
 

In 2020 Logan was our 2nd or 3rd option for Alex every game after Terry & McKissic. He’s not getting those same types of targets bc Carson & Taylor are throwing to our elite WR corps.

In 2020 Logan had 110 targets, this year 51. That’s why his production is in half of what it was in 2020.

Logan is a shell of what he showed in 2020. He is a terrible blocker (this is where he has regressed the most IMO) and his routes are not fluid anymore. The unfortunate thing is Bates (who was supposed to be our best blocking TE) has struggled mightily in that area as well.

He will likely be on a different team next year or retired.

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12 hours ago, turtle28 said:

I don’t care. I haven’t seen anything that proves to me that he’s not the same player he was two years ago.

This season. Literally this season is showing you that. By your own self admission that you don't think he's 100%. 

12 hours ago, turtle28 said:

It’s not like he’s getting 10 targets a game & not catching them or something. He’s being asked to block more this year & he’s not being targeted - same with our RBs - bc we’ve upgraded WR so much. 
 

So find someone that can be used to block more since we're upgraded elsewhere. 

12 hours ago, turtle28 said:

In 2020 Logan was our 2nd or 3rd option for Alex every game after Terry & McKissic. He’s not getting those same types of targets bc Carson & Taylor are throwing to our elite WR corps.

That was 2 nearly 3 seasons ago now. A lot has changed. 

12 hours ago, turtle28 said:

In 2020 Logan had 110 targets, this year 51. That’s why his production is in half of what it was in 2020.

So we shouldn't pay someone that much for that production. Find better use for the funds. 

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12 hours ago, MikeT14 said:

This season. Literally this season is showing you that. By your own self admission that you don't think he's 100%. 

So find someone that can be used to block more since we're upgraded elsewhere. 

That was 2 nearly 3 seasons ago now. A lot has changed. 

So we shouldn't pay someone that much for that production. Find better use for the funds. 

That’s true, but I guess it begs the question, if we’re not even going to target our TE, should we even invest in a TE like Mayer or Washington (GA)? I’d lean towards no.

If we’re not targeting the TE often despite how capable Logan is bc we have so much talent at WR, maybe it does make sense to   just use the combination of Bates & Cole Turner with them combining for 50-60 catches for 600-700 yards & 5 TDs.

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11 hours ago, turtle28 said:

That’s true, but I guess it begs the question, if we’re not even going to target our TE, should we even invest in a TE like Mayer or Washington (GA)? I’d lean towards no.

Same. It's why @MKnight82 pointed out... when's the last time investing a 1st in a TE has paid off for someone? 

 

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9 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

Same. It's why @MKnight82 pointed out... when's the last time investing a 1st in a TE has paid off for someone? 

 

Well it was working out for Detroit when Hockenson was healthy &’since he got to Minny, Hockenson & Kirk have great chemistry. Hockenson took over as the Vikings offenses #2 target vs us in his first game w/ Kirk.

Our main problem is we overpaid to re-sign Logan when we really didn’t have to extend him. If we hadn’t extended him before his 2 year contract was up in the summer of 2021, and waited until after the 2021 season we could’ve had him for a vet minimum this season.

Edited by turtle28
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Just now, turtle28 said:

Well it was working out for Detroit when Hockenson was healthy &’since he got to Minny, Hockenson & Kirk have great chemistry. Hockenson took over as the Vikings offenses #2 target vs us in his first game w/ Kirk.

I would disagree with that wholeheartedly. TJ's best season(s) barely eclipsed the numbers you're asking for from Turner and Bates. And that's not even counting that the Lions traded him (if it was working out). 

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10 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

I would disagree with that wholeheartedly. TJ's best season(s) barely eclipsed the numbers you're asking for from Turner and Bates. And that's not even counting that the Lions traded him (if it was working out). 

In 2 of his first 3 years he also battled injuries but, in this his 4th year he was coming into his own in Det & especially is with Kirk throwing to him in Minny.

He has 78 recs, 838 yds & 6 TDs this season.

Before he was traded to Minny, in 7 games Hockenson still had 26 recs, 395 yds & 3 TDs in less than 1/2 a season.

You extrapolate that out over a whole season & should Hockenson have finished his season in Detroit he likely would’ve had around 70 recs, 975 yards & 7 TDs.

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1 minute ago, turtle28 said:

I agree in his first three years where he also battled injuries but, in this his 4th year he was coming into his own in Det & especially is with Kirk throwing to him in Minny.

He had 78 recs, 838 yds & 6 TDs this season.

Before he was traded to Minny, in 7 games Hockenson still had 26 recs, 395 yds & 3 TDs in less than 1/2 a season.

You extrapolate that out over a whole season & should Hockenson have finished his season in Detroit he likely would’ve had around 70 recs, 975 yards & 7 TDs.

When their only other weapon was St. Brown. We have arguably 2+ more weapons. There isn't enough ball. 

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2 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

When their only other weapon was St. Brown. We have arguably 2+ more weapons. There isn't enough ball. 

There actually is but you’re not taking into account that his injuries in 2 of his first 3 seasons where he missed a month in his rookie & 3rd years.

I guess we’re going to have to disagree bc near 70-80 recs for near 1000 yds & 7 plus TDs for a TE is pro bowl worthy.

If we can get 70 recs, 900 yards & 7 TDs out of Cole Turner! Sign me up for that! I doubt we can, but I’ll take it!

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4 hours ago, turtle28 said:

There actually is but you’re not taking into account that his injuries in 2 of his first 3 seasons where he missed a month in his rookie & 3rd years.

I guess we’re going to have to disagree bc near 70-80 recs for near 1000 yds & 7 plus TDs for a TE is pro bowl worthy.

If we can get 70 recs, 900 yards & 7 TDs out of Cole Turner! Sign me up for that! I doubt we can, but I’ll take it!

Fine we won't agree on the maybe 1 out of Pitts (early but dang), Fant, Hurst, Njoku (maybe), Engram (maybe? finally?), Howard, Ebron, Eifert, Gresham, Pettigrew, etc. That's not a strong hit rate. 

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12 hours ago, butz65 said:

Does anyone else think our D line is vastly overrated? Every game the commentators go on about how good they are, but when it comes down to it, they can't get it done, am I being too critical? Or are they overhyped?

I think they’re overrated as being all world like people talk about at times, but they’re good always and sometimes great. The issues we have on D sometimes are rarely about the DL, when we have issues it’s bc the LBs, CBs or safeties make mistakes just like vs the 49ers.

Our D played well vs the Giants twice, it’s our O that squandered opportunities in the red-zone that could’ve won us that game & the officiating sucked.

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