2023 QB

[Ray Reed]

1 minute ago, diamondbull424 said:

The thing is I was responding to @wackywabbit initially and the initial reason wasn’t because I felt your opinion is the same as the lazy media narrative, but that you were simply parroting the lazy language the media uses only when describing Lamar and not any other QB.

You essentially said that this offense works for Lamar but not the backups. Which is why I said if you were a Bengals fan you would just say it’s a talent thing and not an “offensive design” thing.

But when you say it’s that this offense is designed entirely for Lamar, that’s going to raise alarm bells.
 

 

Beyond that, the rest was a rant, but I included it all in one post and didn’t provide a break so I can imagine how that would come across as everything being conflated to your specific opinion.

I even said “missing the boat” and I can only assume that came across as condescending when I was literally just saying, “you guys aren’t understanding what I’m trying to say.” And I tried clarifying what I tried to say further.

Heck even “parroting” probably sounds condescending, but I’m legit just saying, it’s been stated so much that I think that language has become “normalized” for Lamar and this offense only. Many Ravens fans, in other places, legit believe the lazy media narratives to heart. Which is why I’m pushing back on the verbiage as well as the fact that I don’t think the verbiage truly fits. So it’s partly semantics, but also that I don’t even believe it to be true on a more basic level.

All good man. I think we're all on the page when it comes to this stuff. Roman's offense is ridiculously lazy and relies way too much on Lamar to be superman for it to succeed. I think (hope) Roman is as good as gone next year, whether Lamar Jackson is here or not. If he's still here, Harbaugh essentially signed his own walking papers in 2024.

[Ray Reed]

 

It's also crazy obnoxious that this has become the main talking point John/the team has to focus on now heading into a playoff game against a division rival. Like, I get that Lamar probably wanted to put out the statement in good faith to end a lot of the distraction surrounding the team, but all it's done is create more distraction. Players are answering questions all week about Lamar's knee and contract, when they should be answering questions about the playoff game they're about to play. 

You can tell Harbaugh has had enough with the whole situation

[wackywabbit]

1 hour ago, Ray Reed said:

 

It's also crazy obnoxious that this has become the main talking point John/the team has to focus on now heading into a playoff game against a division rival. Like, I get that Lamar probably wanted to put out the statement in good faith to end a lot of the distraction surrounding the team, but all it's done is create more distraction. Players are answering questions all week about Lamar's knee and contract, when they should be answering questions about the playoff game they're about to play. 

You can tell Harbaugh has had enough with the whole situation

I feel like it'd be worse if we didn't get a definite answer/ruling by now. Better for everyone to have clarity, IMO. The situation is what it is.

The "is Lamar going to be play" questions would be more persistent than the "why is Lamar not playing" questions. This week isn't about Lamar anymore and they can say as much.

Edited January 13, 2023 by wackywabbit

[Ray Reed]

1 minute ago, wackywabbit said:

I feel like it'd be worse if we didn't get a definite answer/ruling by now. Better for everyone to have clarity, IMO. The situation is what it is.

The "is Lamar going to be play" questions would be more persistent than the "why is Lamar not playing" questions. This week isn't about Lamar anymore and they can say as much.

Yeah, true. Agreed.

[diamondbull424]

2 hours ago, ThatJaxxenGuy said:

Just read an interview of Sammy Watkins kind of calling Lamar out.

 

im really leaning to the “he gone” side for Lamar’s future. Not as in I want to see Lamar gone but I don’t think Sammy Watkins would make this comment unaware of how it would be construed. there must be some smoke on the team about him not playing 

Any link to the interview? Just curious where to find it.

 

EDIT: Was being lazy. Found it. This sounds like it’ll be an interesting offseason at least.

Though I can’t blame Lamar. If he’s not 100% with how this offense runs and how Roman calls plays, I doubt Roman does much to protect Lamar and run a vanilla version that has Lamar just hand the ball off.

I wouldn’t trust Roman either. Amongst other things.

Edited January 14, 2023 by diamondbull424

[Ray Reed]

Everyone going in on Lamar - even Vick who has been an ardent Lamar supporter up to this point in his career

[baltimoreRebel]

They're kind of dogging Lamar here. I genuinely believe he's hurt to the point where he can't play. 

[baltimoreRebel]

1 minute ago, Ray Reed said:

Everyone going in on Lamar - even Vick who has been an ardent Lamar supporter up to this point in his career

We posted at the same time. Lol

This is wrong of them. I genuinely believe Lamar is injured. Questioning his toughness and basically saying he's sitting out is wrong. 

Edited January 14, 2023 by baltimoreRebel

[AngusMcFife]

Ultimately Lamar is destroying his reputation and brand by not manning up and gutting through this injury. 

He should have been aware of this possibility, but if you are being advised by your mom and the NFLPA they are not going to prepare you for this scenario. 

[DreamKid]

That's crazy, even Vick is getting some shots in. Oof. 

 

[bmorecareful]

29 minutes ago, AngusMcFife said:

Ultimately Lamar is destroying his reputation and brand by not manning up and gutting through this injury. 

He should have been aware of this possibility, but if you are being advised by your mom and the NFLPA they are not going to prepare you for this scenario. 

At the end of the day no one will care about any of this if he comes back and  plays well… As far as reputation… anybody that saw what happened to RGIII would Be silly to believe Lamar should come back if he isn’t fully healthy… I mean just this season with Bateman and Dobbins we saw the results of a guy coming back before he was ready… Or what about Stanley last season.. This current ravens staff doesn’t have the most stellar reputation as it pertains to injury… We want a guy to risk his career for a single season when at 26 he has multiple prime years left if he fully recovers… We got to make it make sense… 

[Ray Reed]

 Highly recommend everyone read this article, despite your initial impression of it being Barstool.

Banks has been an airtight ravens source the past 5-6 years and breaks everything before the national media knows it…trades, announcements, etc. He has legit sources. Sounds like where there’s smoke there’s fire with this whole Lamar situation.

[diamondbull424]

4 hours ago, Ray Reed said:

 Highly recommend everyone read this article, despite your initial impression of it being Barstool.

Banks has been an airtight ravens source the past 5-6 years and breaks everything before the national media knows it…trades, announcements, etc. He has legit sources. Sounds like where there’s smoke there’s fire with this whole Lamar situation.

The more medical I read on this and after consulting a doctor friend of mine, the more this situation seems more understandable.

Lamar had a partial but severe PCL tear. It wasn’t a complete tear, but wasn’t a moderate tear that might be on the shorter end of the recovery spectrum but on the longer end of the time table.

You also can’t half arse the recovery. But it would also make sense that Lamar wouldn’t have been initially at the facility as the initial prognosis would’ve been to ice and elevate to reduce swelling until more active recovery steps can be engaged once swelling subsides enough.

If the team didn’t want him to fly with the team to away games early on, it equally probably wouldn’t make sense to drive to the facility so that they could ice it around the clock- which he could similarly do at home, only with less movement to protect against further aggravation early. So maybe someone, a source, not understanding the medical would just be like “he’s not even here for treatment.”

Quote

PCL sprains and low-level tears such as grade 1 and low grade 2 tears, have minimal damage to the ligament and can recover quickly within 2-6 weeks, with no need for surgical intervention. More severe injuries such as high grade 2 and grade 3 PCL tears will take longer to recover, without surgery this may be 3-4 months, and if surgery is needed the recovery may be 12 months of rehabilitation.Most PCL injuries can be managed without surgery, but with high-grade injuries, with instability, you may be advised to use a brace for the first 6 weeks of healing. A PCL brace will hold the tibia forwards, keeping the ligament out of a stretched position to encourage it to heal well in a short and tight position.

What’s more the recovery prognosis makes sense that the team put out. If they hear “PCL Sprain” they’re probably thinking that’s 1-3 weeks or 3-6 weeks. Whereas in reality if it truly is a high grade 2 sprain, as it states above, that’s more like a 3-4 month recovery without surgery and about 12 months with surgery. So even if Lamar busts his tail to get back for the team, 6 weeks would be too soon. Likely 2 months would be a TO superhuman level return. However they and Lamar both were likely holding out hope that it could be shorter than later. Whereas it’s looking to be moreso on schedule.

Now the communication stuff, that’s on Harbaugh. The article tries to paint the picture like Harbaugh didn’t do the same thing with Ronnie Stanley’s return and acting cryptic with that situation.

So either both Lamar and Stanley were just not communicating with Harbaugh about their injuries and that’s why he was cryptic, which shows some sort of lack of respect between the offensive leaders and Harbaugh.

OR both had time tables from their own medical doctors that showed the teams physicians to be VERY generous in their timetables and thus neither player trusted those time tables, which is a problem.

OR there is some sort of miscommunication between the team’s medical staff and Harbaugh where they’re dilly dallying around injury prognosis with him and not giving him a clear and concrete best and worst case scenario. Which is an organizational issue that he as a CEO coach should be in charge of making sure the communication channels are strong and proper understanding is there.

 

Beyond that the rest of the team not knowing what’s going on and speculating it’s a contract thing would’ve been quelled by the team leaking to the media the extent of Lamar’s injury and the expected timeline for a low grade two and high grade two sprain, of which perhaps they don’t know the full extent at the moment. That would’ve been enough to placate wondering minds and make sure they controlled the narrative. Instead they left it up in the air for Lamar to have to control the narrative instead.

Fans were equally turning on Ronnie Stanley before he came back too because of a similar handling of his injury. So the team truly earns no benefit of the doubt here IMO.

Edited January 16, 2023 by diamondbull424
Change phrasing to make it more in alignment with what I was thinking

[DreamKid]

6 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

Fans were equally turning on Ronnie Stanley before he came back too because of a similar handling of his injury. So the team truly earns no benefit of the doubt here IMO.

Stanley wasn't dealing with an injury. He had a surgery after his initial injury 2 years ago, but turned down an additional more elective surgery because he wanted to see how his knee felt. He returned in 21', didn't like how it felt, and opted to go back for the surgery he initially turned down which ended his season. So there was no reinjury. It was a similar situation to JK Dobbins where we had players return healthy then opt out again because they wanted additional surgery after previously turning it down. Stanley was fully healthy and had practiced for months. The controversy was over Harbaugh saying he was holding him out until "He felt like an All-Pro again". Which came off as ludicrous with star players, dealing with actual injuries at the time, like Marlon Humphrey playing at less than 100%.

Lamar is actually injured. 

Everything about the situation is polarized because Lamar is a star player, a QB, about to become one of the highest paid athletes in the world, and we're now in the postseason. Add in what seems like a tricky injury case where the exact severity is hard to pin down and where a return comes down to the athletes personal comfortability and you get the current mess.

My take is this, I can believe Lamar didn't attack his rehab as seriously as he could have but I don't believe he'd sit out just to preserve his mega deal. Maybe I'm wrong and putting too much faith in Lamar, but that's honestly what I think. He's never come off as anything less than an ultimate competitor who'd do everything and anything to help his teammates and this club win.

[coordinator0]

Not sure if I've chimed in here or not.

Anyways, I don't think it will be Lamar Jackson at the helm. Unfortunately. The haul for his eventual trade should be spectacular... but I don't think there's a quick turnaround on offense with it regardless. That unit has to be rebuilt from the bottom up schematically and I don't think the next franchise quarterback will be with the team for next season. And that unit won't get rebuilt properly without competent coaching in place so...