2023 49ers offseason thread: Wilks to be new DC

[N4L]

Cmc, deebo, Kittle, Aiyuk, Juice, and Lamar with Kyle calling plays would be very unfair. 

Count me in. 

Also, I personally do not care if the niners completely ruin their cap by paying lamar 40m AND paying bosa 30. Just do what the saints are doing and run up the credit card bill. Figure out the future later. In the meantime, adding lamar to this team makes us heavy favorites to come out of the NFC

Lance, plus future draft picks should be fine to be honest. No need to include anyone else imo. 

[typecast]

3 hours ago, N4L said:

Lance, plus future draft picks should be fine to be honest. No need to include anyone else imo. 

From my understanding of the CBA, I don't think this is possible. I believe the Ravens can only be compensated picks and no more than two FRPs from the non-exclusive tender compensation. Here is Article 9, Section 3, Subsection (h) of the CBA:

Quote

With respect to a trade involving any non-exclusive rights player subject to a Tender or Qualifying Offer who is a Nonexclusive Franchise Player or a Restricted Free Agent who is subject to a Qualifying Offer with Draft Choice Compensation, the following restrictions shall apply:

(i) the Clubs may not agree to draft choice consideration that is greater than the draft choice compensation specified for the Tender or Qualifying Offer;

(ii) the trade may not include the acquisition of another player’s Player Contract; and

(iii) the player and the NFLPA must approve in advance any such trade that takes place during the Signing Period.

With respect to a trade involving any non-exclusive rights player subject to a Tender or Qualifying Offer who is a Transition Player, or a Restricted Free Agent who is subject to a Qualifying Offer for a Right of First Refusal Only, the player and the NFLPA must approve in advance any such trade that takes place during the Signing Period.

The provisions of this Subsection (h) shall not apply to a trade involving any player who is subject to a Tender or Qualifying Offer that provides for exclusive negotiating rights for the Prior Club (i.e., an Exclusive Franchise Player or an “Exclusive Rights Player,” as defined in Article 8, Section 2 of this Agreement). 

If a Club exercises its Right of First Refusal and matches an Offer Sheet, that Club may not trade that player to the Club that submitted the Offer Sheet for at least one calendar year, unless the player consents to such trade.

edit - These restrictions didn't exist in the previous CBA.

Edited March 9, 2023 by typecast

[Chrissooner49er]

17 hours ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

It didn't fall off in 2020. 

I think it would still be good but we will need to get a solid edge rusher or two. Does not need to be a superstar or anything, just a solid edge rusher that can bring some consistent heat. 

The D line was overall better then. That's why it didn't. Hyder was really quite good the year Bosa got hurt.

[J-ALL-DAY]

Just now, Chrissooner49er said:

The D line was overall better then. That's why it didn't. Hyder was really quite good the year Bosa got hurt.

But that's my point....You can get by having some solid edge rushers since our backers are so good and we have a good coverage unit on the back end. You do not need a Bosa level of dominant edge rusher to be very good. Let's not act like Hyder was this big talent or anything, he just had a nice season. Who is to say we can't sign someone like Yannick and have similar or even better production than Hyder had in 2020? 

[adamq]

After what we've been through with jimmy.. and lance... and Purdy... even Alex Smith.. why commit so much (Bosa?!) to a guy who hasn't finished the last two years? His style of play suggest he will get injured again and that he will fall off faster than a conventional "pocket passer". Once Lamars athleticism starts to dwindle, so will his production 

[Forge]

14 hours ago, typecast said:

From my understanding of the CBA, I don't think this is possible. I believe the Ravens can only be compensated picks and no more than two FRPs from the non-exclusive tender compensation. Here is Article 9, Section 3, Subsection (h) of the CBA:

edit - These restrictions didn't exist in the previous CBA.

This is technically true if a team is signing him to an offer sheet,   however there is nothing that precludes the niners / ravens / lamar from discussing a trade and contract in concert with one another. Then lamar signs his tag with the ravens and then they trade him to the niners and the niners then give him the extension. 

 

[typecast]

16 minutes ago, Forge said:

This is technically true if a team is signing him to an offer sheet,   however there is nothing that precludes the niners / ravens / lamar from discussing a trade and contract in concert with one another. Then lamar signs his tag with the ravens and then they trade him to the niners and the niners then give him the extension. 

 

I'm not talking about the offer sheet. I'm talking about the situation the 49ers do talk to the ravens, work out a trade, Lamar/NFLPA approves, Lamar signs tender and is traded. Those restrictions apply to the compensation in the trade. Because Lamar was tagged with the nonexclusive franchise tag, the Ravens can't get back more than two FRPs in trade compensation in such a deal. And Lance couldn't be part of the deal because player contracts are restricted from being traded in such a deal. Had the Ravens exclusive franchise tagged Lamar, those restrictions from that subsection wouldn't apply.

Edited March 9, 2023 by typecast

[Forge]

2 minutes ago, typecast said:

I'm not talking about the offer sheet. I'm talking about the situation the 49ers do talk to the ravens, work out a trade, Lamar/NFLPA approves, Lamar signs tender and is traded. Those restrictions apply to the compensation in the trade. Because Lamar was tagged with the nonexclusive franchise tag, the Ravens can't get back more than two FRPs in trade compensation in such a deal. And Lance couldn't be part of the deal because player contracts are restricted from being traded in such a deal.

This is very weird...because that's definitely how it reads, but I have seen almost nobody talk about it in that way so far. I feel like if this is case, nobody knows about it. Like, even the hypothetical trades being presented by places like ESPN don't follow this rule. Bill Barnwell typically has a good grasp on this stuff and here's what he recently said: 

 

Quote

NFL teams would need to send their own 2023 and 2024 first-round picks to sign Jackson to an offer sheet, but if they can negotiate a sign-and-trade with the Ravens, teams that don't have their own first-round pick in 2023 (such as the 49ers or Dolphins) could acquire Jackson without using an offer sheet. In these cases, I would expect the Ravens to ask for something more than two first-round picks; an example might be to include a first-round pick, a second-round pick and a quarterback who can replace Jackson in the starting lineup.

So maybe it's a situation where Baltimore actually has to give him the contract that a team like the 49ers want to give him first? Then the tag is no longer applicable? 

[typecast]

Yea, I think Barnwell is still operating under an assumption of the previous CBA. These restrictions are new to the current CBA and have really never been discussed. The only sign-and-trade scenario I can think of since the 2020 CBA is the  Saints Clowney scenario. Another team would sign Clowney with a signing bonus, immediately trade Clowney to the Saints thus accelerating the hit on the other team, and the Saints would only pay what remained. A pick for cap space. The deal was worked out but bailed when they suspected the league wouldn't approve because of the good faith clause.

Edited March 9, 2023 by typecast

[typecast]

Here is OTC on it

https://overthecap.com/ravens-use-non-exclusive-tag-on-lamar-jackson

Quote

My understanding of the CBA, and it could be wrong since the CBA seems to always intentionally be vague, is that the Ravens are now locked into compensation of no more than two first round picks because of the tender they applied.

Quote

With respect to a trade involving any non-exclusive rights player subject to a Tender or Qualifying Offer who is a Nonexclusive Franchise Player or a Restricted Free Agent who is subject to a Qualifying Offer with Draft Choice Compensation, the following restrictions shall apply: (i) the Clubs may not agree to draft choice consideration that is greater than the draft choice compensation specified for the Tender or Qualifying Offer; (ii) the trade may not include the acquisition of another player’s Player Contract; and (iii) the player and the NFLPA must approve in advance any such trade that takes place during the Signing Period

The exclusive tag does not have this same disclaimer associated with it.

If my interpretation is correct then the Ravens should not be able to negotiate a massive Watson/Wilson like haul, which would lead me to believe that the Ravens intend to match any offer that will come their way for Jackson since they would look awful for losing Jackson for pennies on the dollar compared to other players.

 

Edited March 9, 2023 by typecast

[Forge]

Just now, typecast said:

Here is OTC on it

https://overthecap.com/ravens-use-non-exclusive-tag-on-lamar-jackson

 

Yeah, I would trust Jason over bill. 

Damn, yeah... They have no intention of letting him walk. This is just letting them let the market decide

[Justone2]

6 minutes ago, Forge said:

Yeah, I would trust Jason over bill. 

Damn, yeah... They have no intention of letting him walk. This is just letting them let the market decide

And the market isn't willing to do it for them. I think teams know they will match so making an offer basically hurts them more than not negotiating with him.

[Forge]

56 minutes ago, Justone2 said:

And the market isn't willing to do it for them. I think teams know they will match so making an offer basically hurts them more than not negotiating with him.

The nice thing for the Ravens is that this works just as well for them lol. Honestly, I kind of love this move by Baltimore. 

[Justone2]

1 minute ago, Forge said:

The nice thing for the Ravens is that this works just as well for them lol. Honestly, I kind of love this move by Baltimore. 

Or not because there is only so many tags you can do. So for other teams they can just wait for that and see if Jackson can stay heathy. Like its quite a unique situation and Jackson being so high profile but having some obvious drawbacks makes it interesting.

Edited March 9, 2023 by Justone2

[Forge]

1 minute ago, Justone2 said:

Or not because there is only so many tags you can do. So for other teams they can just wait for that and see if Jackson can stay heathy.

Yeah, but that's a problem for 3 years down the line and Jackson is kind of gambling here. Tags this year and next are about 70 million guaranteed. If he's a disaster or keeps getting hurt, he could lose out on a ton of money. I would imagine that a 50 million per year contract is going to fully guarantee him about 150 million. 

When this market is completely dry and nobody goes after him on this tag, Baltimore is going to say "see? now come back to the table and lets get this extension done"